In one way or another, people will make a non pay to win game a pay to win game: whether it be a power leveling service, buying money or etc.

In reality, the illusion that you want is a promise not really broken.

OP, it's not that i don't agree with you this is a bad decision, but this is more a case of Day One DLC than it is p2w.

I never heard of any sub based MMO holding out in-game content onlaunch based on $$$ ; they used to offer soundtrack, handcrafted models,maps, art books, etc which were only for the ones who really liked that kind of stuff. But holding out a race ( even if they MIGHT realease it to other players later on ) for cash just shows they are in this for a quick $ and everyone supporting this can expect to cought up lots of extra coin over the monthly sub ( even if you have the money to give, it doesn't mean you have to .... or maybe you need to learn what money is worth for those who actually have to work from it and daddy doesn't throw it to them )

MMO's who cos 55E and 13E per month don't get to sell DLC's

Sad, just sad ....

Subscription services should never limit additional products.... bad business. If you don't like the choices offer, shop somewhere else.

Day One DLC isn't an issue in a singleplayer game, because it won't affect other people.

I'm not saying the Imperial race is a big deal - as it's not likely to make any real difference. I said as much in my original post.

My problem is that they PROMISED they wouldn't have content pay gated. Look at the quote and tell me that's not a promise - or as close to a promise as you can get without being a literal promise.

The reason I'm saying this isn't that I'm whining just because I can - it's because it demonstrates a position that's a cause for concern. If they can offer up a unique race for people who pay extra, what could they offer later on in the already created in-game store?

Don't you see why I'm a bit worried?

The ony reason I bother making such a post is because I'm a real fan of ESO - and I'm looking forward to it. I CARE about its future.

I have no illusions about being popular for saying a negative thing - but if it's a good point, I'll take all the crap that comes with it. We have to speak our minds so the developers realise our position on this.

This.

the way ZoS is acting is scrubbish.

Lol EXCLUSIVE IMPERIAL OMG AND EXCLUSIVE RINGS THAT GIVE YOU XPPPPP!!!!

Outa here. Treating everyone else who doesn't get the CE like crap.

So, if I wanted a new car and that new car didn't come with a stereo system unless I paid something beyond the rather significant listed price - I shouldn't be allowed to point it out as a negative, and something I'd like to be different?

I don't agree, sorry.

I wouldn't say this is Pay to win, I would however say this opens the door for them to introduce more pay to win things, which if that happens, then I may be done with the game.

I also feel lied because of this

Like I said, I agree with you this is a bad decision. I'm even willing to agree that goes right against their previous statements. But P2W? No. This is opening day dlc. Which I'm not a fan of.

But I don't care that much about this imp thing myself, seeing as I wont play one. I'm a lot more un happy about the explorerspack. Why make people pick any race in any alliance through a pre-order bonus that will most likely be a cash shop item later? So many more interesting ways to have implemented their "compromise".

Well maybe you just don't read them all because I responded with as close to "proof" of the Imperials racials not being pay to win as it can get and frankly the scenario I stated is FAR more likely than your worries about them getting some insane "win button" power it's really just common sense. The Imperials have boring racials and look like humans... basically the ONLY reason to play this race if you don't care about lore is aesthetic, so it's more so a cosmetic addition than anything. There you go point made.

I'll even step in on the "lie" for you. The comment you posted had him has "putting pay gates between players and CONTENT at any point IN GAME ruins the feeling." key words being IN GAME and CONTENT. Now you can argue that a race is content (it's not in this case) even though they don't get to do any REAL "content" that any other race doesn't it's still just your opinion and your opinion of what content is clearly differs from his when he made that comment. In the end it also sais IN GAME which means that you wont go to enter a zone and have a bubble pop up asking for money for the area this does not pertain to any kind of cash shop or other out of game purchases like a new race. Just in case you don't know, nothing save for racials are race specific in ESO now that they can all go into any alliance.

There you go, sidestepped.

P2W is rarely a literal term, I agree. Very, very few games actually sell "victory" on the side.

But we're talking about unique powers - not just cosmetic stuff. Will they win the game? Most likely not, but people WILL want to try them and use them for their characters. Apparently, being a paying subscriber isn't enough to get all meaningful content anymore.

You still choose to pay for a stereo... regardless. Also, a stereo is non-essential to a car; it wont make it go faster.... or in this case wont make you OP in game

In the end... these kinds of add-ons - that other players choose to buy - should not affect your own quality of service that you are paying for.... other than make you envious.

Again, I'm not talking about a literal "I-WIN" button, as I've said multiple times already. I'm talking about unique powers that offer in-game advantages - meaning it's not just cosmetic. The fact that YOU think Imperials are "boring" makes absolutely no difference whatsoever. Point refuted again.

As for saying a COMPLETE race that you play with IN-GAME is not actually content and doesn't actually limit your freedom to choose between all the races IN-GAME is about as far from a sidestep as you can get. Sorry, your points are all refuted for being irrational and weak.

So the only important thing about a car is speed? Not safety, comfort, luxuries? I don't agree.

I'm not talking about being OP - I'm talking about unique powers offering an actual gameplay advantage - as in not being just cosmetic.

It's not rocket science, really.

I have to say, for the first time in the development of this game I'm actually a bit 'worried' about what is to come next. And I have been following this game since announcement. Really hope they stick with vanity items, pets and cosmetic stuff in the future. An expansion I'm of course willing to pay for.

Very much this, I don't think I'm the only one who thinks this is going to open the gateway for more things similar to this further down the line, I hope I'm wrong.

I feel exactly the same way, and I've been supporting all their decisions so far. This is why I'm now worried.

I may or may not have played the beta - but I was REALLY looking forward to playing. Now, I fear it's going to be another short term game that eventually gets bogged down in cash-shop content.

He just admited that they powers will be along the same lines at the rest of the races, he is just trolling us.

Your right it isn't; your attempting to justify quality of service with absract legalism and envy.

Not sure how else to say it so I apologize for how extreme the wording sounds.

You mean beyond stating in my original post by saying that the powers wouldn't make much of a difference - and repeating myself several times here, yeah.

I'm definitely trolling you because you can't or you refuse to read before bashing away at a complete stranger you know next to nothing about.

Not a good idea to start calling people trolls.

You don't have to apologize to me, as I don't invest emotionally in this kind of thing.

Actually, I'm not attempting anything - except communicating my point.

If you can't refute what I'm saying rationally, I'll consider my point made.

I would bet that once a person learns the skill they can craft it no matter what race they are, just finding the recipe might be a pain, as they all might be.. Like is someone was a breton and made HE gear or purchased some they could wear it.

Agreed.