[Hayley Bristow]

Ho-hum.

Well, I'm sitting on a release at the moment, but I haven't seen or heard from Haama for a while, and the version of II I am sitting on requires a version of Cobl that's not publically available. So...

I'm thinking of adding the new feature I've had planned (thanks to PacificMorrowind) for a long time: the inclusion of mod-added containers! I'll just add a small handful and test. Probably release it like that and see if anyone reports any problems. If it goes smoothly enough then I'll start rolling out full-scale support for containers. How does that sound?

Migck, I've just stripped out the C&C inventory subrecord changes you requested.

Hey Vac, just found http://planetelderscrolls.gamespy.com/View.php?view=OblivionMods.Detail&id=3249 and thought it seemed right up your alley. I'd love to see it integrated, personally

CC

I can throw it into the meta-library, but have you got any suggestions for where this stuff should be found? Showing me items is only half the story, and items in the meta-library than never get used seem kinda... useless?

Vac

[Justin Bywater]

I can throw it into the meta-library, but have you got any suggestions for where this stuff should be found? Showing me items is only half the story, and items in the meta-library than never get used seem kinda... useless?

Hmm... I suppose they should be find in the DB sanctuary and maybe dungeon loot? Also throug some Dementia containers it would make sense. Hand adding some to the shadier areas of Better Cities (some slummy Bravil shacks) would make sense. Vile Lair would seem smart too. Dunno, I guess you can't just add them to NPC drop lists as they kill the NPC's

[Taylor Thompson]

Hmm... I suppose they should be find in the DB sanctuary and maybe dungeon loot? Also throug some Dementia containers it would make sense. Hand adding some to the shadier areas of Better Cities (some slummy Bravil shacks) would make sense. Vile Lair would seem smart too. Dunno, I guess you can't just add them to NPC drop lists as they kill the NPC's

The sanctuary and dungeon loot are all vanilla records: II doesn't touch vanilla stuff as a general rule, the mod-maker should be doing that themself. There can't be any hand-adding as II can't make worldspace or cell edits. Dementia containers sound appropriate, except that they're all Cyrodiilic items. In Dementia? :mellow: I don't much like that concept. I'll take a look at the Vile Lair though, there might be somewhere suitable in that.

Vac

[jadie kell]

About MALO: I don't see why you'd bother, since you already have support for Com's torch compendium you'd just have to add support for the other mod MALO draws from, the one with equippable clutter. (Can't remember the name now.) MALO doesn't add anything else in terms of new stuff.

Other mods to watch:
- [WIP] Soulstones, by Kandiedan I believe.
- Alchemy advanced: adds "essences" of magical effects that can be added to potions, and some new alchemical apparatus and recipes I believe.

I have a question: can II import items from mods that are disabled in the load order, in case we just want to use them as object sources and don't care about their other changes?

[Brad Johnson]

About MALO: I don't see why you'd bother, since you already have support for Com's torch compendium you'd just have to add support for the other mod MALO draws from, the one with equippable clutter. (Can't remember the name now.) MALO doesn't add anything else in terms of new stuff.

Other mods to watch:
- [WIP] Soulstones, by Kandiedan I believe.
- Alchemy advanced: adds "essences" of magical effects that can be added to potions, and some new alchemical apparatus and recipes I believe.

I have a question: can II import items from mods that are disabled in the load order, in case we just want to use them as object sources and don't care about their other changes?

Well, to be honest, with MALO, all I've done thus far is check they don't conflict: I haven't got around to looking at what else (if anything) I can do with it. :shrug:

Alchemy Advanced is one of those mods I am intending to look at some day for use in my own game, so if/when I get around to that II support will probably follow very shortly: mods in my load order tend to get support as a high priority. :angel:

The Soulstones mod I'm not familiar with, I'll be happy to take a look once it's released though.

To answer your last question, no, II doesn't do that. I'm not quite sure how you'd expect that to work out... which plugin would supply the FormID for the item in-game?

Vac

Edit: I've just looked at the Vile Lair and didn't see any suitable place (chest, list or inventory) for II to add the new poisoned items to...

[Heather Kush]

To answer your last question, no, II doesn't do that. I'm not quite sure how you'd expect that to work out... which plugin would supply the FormID for the item in-game?

Then it's another vague area of my Wrye Bash understanding. I thought that somehow you could get it to import the relevent records into the bashed patch. I would be nice, since sometimes mods make dubious changes (MALO, I'm looking at you) that go a bit far, and I'd like to forgo all their changes and let II take care of the leveled list integration.

Maybe time for another Wrye Bash feature request? (PacificMorrowind will likely kill me...)

[laila hassan]

Oh, while I was sleeping I thought of somewhere I can put the poisoned food. It's a secret though, and I've no doubt that lots of people won't be running the necessary mod(s) to find the placement(s), but that's not my problem.

Vac

[Jade]

While you were sleeping? Oh yeah, she's gone...

[Gwen]

When I was working on VASE I sometimes got stuck on some technical problem or other and eventually give up and go to sleep at maybe 2 in the morning. Then *while asleep* I would think of a solution and :shocking: wake up! At half past four in the morning. Can I go back to sleep? No way! Can I make a note of the possible solution and try it out later? Not a chance! The only alternative to lying there going "ooh! maybe!" is to get up and test it out. If it didn't work, I'd be there another couple of hours trying to get it to work, if it did work, I'd be so pumped with enthusiasm I'd be awake anyway.
By contrast, merely thinking of something while asleep is nothing.

Vac

[Kate Schofield]

It may be "dry and technical", but I wouldn't dream of playing without it!

My question: I am building a new game which will be running a frightening number of mods, so I am making a number of merged mods. Is there any way of merging the mods that II extracts from/ adds to without rendering them useless? I thought perhaps I could give the new merge the same name as one of the source esp's? Thanks.

[Kate Schofield]

It may be "dry and technical", but I wouldn't dream of playing without it!

My question: I am building a new game which will be running a frightening number of mods, so I am making a number of merged mods. Is there any way of merging the mods that II extracts from/ adds to without rendering them useless? I thought perhaps I could give the new merge the same name as one of the source esp's? Thanks.

I assume you're meaning merging with TES4Gecko? I've only used that tool a couple of times for other stuff, so I'm not certain there is *no* solution, but as I understand what I read of the function, after merging your original plugins the new plugin will have all the same records, but with different FormIDs to the original plugin. These FormIDs are what determines things like overrides, so if II cannot access the FormID it wants, it will have no effect. An unlikely hazard is that II could suddenly start trying to override something like a cell record with a creature record. Maybe the game wouldn't throw a fit, but maybe it would. :shrug:

In short, assuming I've understood you correctly: merging a target plugin breaks II's functionality for that plugin.

Vac

[marie breen]

I assume you're meaning merging with TES4Gecko? I've only used that tool a couple of times for other stuff, so I'm not certain there is *no* solution, but as I understand what I read of the function, after merging your original plugins the new plugin will have all the same records, but with different FormIDs to the original plugin. These FormIDs are what determines things like overrides, so if II cannot access the FormID it wants, it will have no effect. An unlikely hazard is that II could suddenly start trying to override something like a cell record with a creature record. Maybe the game wouldn't throw a fit, but maybe it would. :shrug:

In short, assuming I've understood you correctly: merging a target plugin breaks II's functionality for that plugin.

Vac

Thank you for the speedy reply! I guess some II is better then no II - it will still work with the unmerged mods.

Bye the by... Do you EVER sleep?

[Emma Louise Adams]

My understanding is that an earlier version of Gecko did indeed always change FormIDs but that the later versions only do that if there is conflict.

I'm not sure though that would be easy to test.

Definitely I've merged a mod that added world objects and things my character had in their possession was gone. So just having those FormIDs in a new mod is enough.

But my thinking is probably muddled.

[Damned_Queen]

Well, I think Psymon has more experience with TES4Gecko than I do, so believe him!

Nevertheless, I make no claim that II will work with merged plugins and I'm not going to recommend it. The best bet would be to load up TES4View and take a look, but I think I'm about the only person with all the needed plugins sitting around to be able to do that and be certain exactly what is and isn't working. :shrug:

Vac

Edit: and yes, I do sleep sometimes. When I am not working. Or socialising. Or eating. Or going to concerts. Or modding. Or... well, you probably get the idea.

[Danial Zachery]

Just to let people know that II is by no means dead.

Internally, I am now on build 0.83, and II is being kept abriast of major loot system changes being developed jointly with MMM and Cobl.

There's a lot of really cool stuff in the next release, with MMM Diverse Waterlife, the Deserts of Elsweyr, the enchanted armour in Armamentarium and innumerable smaller fixes, tweaks and improvements.

All in all, this next release has a lot of cool stuff!

When it, Cobl and MMM are all ready to be released, of course.

Vac

[Lyndsey Bird]

This makes me very happy to hear. II is one of my favs, such a brilliant idea, and really ties all the mods together.

It really does show how far this modding community has come.

[NAtIVe GOddess]

sounds like Oblivion is going to become yet more impressive. thanx

[carley moss]

Captain Chaos and General Disarray will be begging for mercy when the new, more powerful II is deployed. :flamethrower:

[Shianne Donato]

Sheep's wool is exceedingly rare in all three of my different FCOM setups. Is this an II issue? Or should I take it up with MMM?

Loot chance issue or interchanging issue?

gothemasticator

[Marie Maillos]

Sheep's wool is exceedingly rare in all three of my different FCOM setups. Is this an II issue? Or should I take it up with MMM?

Loot chance issue or interchanging issue?

gothemasticator

Well, sheep's wool is found by the player from two main sources: sheep and general clutter lists. II gets all the mod-added sheep (and there are quite a few), but there are few/no mod-added clutter lists: pretty much all mods just use the vanilla clutter lists which should be getting covered by the mod(s) in question, in this case MMM. If you want sheep's wool more common in general clutter that's an MMM issue, if you know some mod-added sheep that II isn't covering, that's an II issue. If you have suggestions for other ways/places to find sheep's wool that could be an II issue, assuming those ways/places are mod-added. Do you have such suggestions?

In any case, I see Core appears to have taken on board your concerns about its scarcity in general clutter in the MMM thread, so I figure he'll up the frequency in general clutter.

Glad to hear that people are interested in the work on II. I know I am very happy with the way things are shaping up.

Vac

[Hairul Hafis]

Thanks for the reply. What sparked my actually reporting this (it's always been like this, after all, so why now?) is that I actually just slaughtered a small group of sheep and found to my dismay no wool at all (poor sheep, needlessly dead :sadvaultboy: ). It was on Imperial Isle, but I've got so many mods going there, I don't know off the top of my head which mod put them there. I'll use the refscope or whatever it's called to figure that out and get back to you.

gothemasticator

[Céline Rémy]

Thanks for the reply. What sparked my actually reporting this (it's always been like this, after all, so why now?) is that I actually just slaughtered a small group of sheep and found to my dismay no wool at all (poor sheep, needlessly dead :sadvaultboy: ). It was on Imperial Isle, but I've got so many mods going there, I don't know off the top of my head which mod put them there. I'll use the refscope or whatever it's called to figure that out and get back to you.

gothemasticator

Ahh, that's probably the farms recently added to the Imperial Isle UL, I'd guess. Well, maybe not that recently, but still. If that's the case I think I already have support for them. I thought I added that support in a while back, but maybe it was post-0.78. Either that or they're coming from a mod I don't know about.

Just checked the II readme and it says I added support for the Imperial Isle in v0.76, and I definitely cover all the animals added by that mod, so they must come from somewhere else. If you tell me which mod I'll add support for it. Maybe in the next release.

Vac

[Alex Vincent]

When it, Cobl and MMM are all ready to be released, of course.

:P

[jeremey wisor]

All in all, this next release has a lot of cool stuff!

When it, Cobl and MMM are all ready to be released, of course.

Vac

:P

:twirl: - Which is getting close mmm cobl is what 98% per complete..just that one last thing to do and rebalance.. :banghead: because they are not wanting to rebalance to my liking..

[Sophie Morrell]

:P

:twirl: - Which is getting close mmm cobl is what 98% per complete..just that one last thing to do and rebalance.. :banghead: because they are not wanting to rebalance to my liking..

Well, there's the other two people involved in this. Part of that 2% of stuff needing finished in Cobl is my stuff. I need to get back to those masterlists.
I got distracted making something "completely different", but have decided I need to have a word with someone like PacificMorrowind before I carry on on that little (well, actually huge) project. Retexturing thousands of nifs by hand is no joke at all though I'm quite happy with my test results so far.

Vac