It's a valid complaint. The background strings sound like someone picked up some instruments and started hitting entirely random notes on them, and the fact that there are actually segments in the song where that's all you can hear is a pretty terrible decision on his part.

As for the rest... it's hard to argue those sorts of things, but really, if you want to convey solitude then using a complex composition that uses a large number of instruments playing more or less over each other and vying for attention within the composition isn't a very good way to do it. That sort of thing requires subtlety, something that the piece you linked lacks almost entirely (particularly around the middle of the composition, where the music swells a ridiculously excessive amount). As for bliss... that's much more vague and hard to address, but the best I can say in response is that I'm not feeling it. At all.

EDIT:
Which other instruments? Go listen to the three songs linked. I've skimmed through all of them, and I haven't heard anything but strings in any of them.


Not really, no. They can, but only when that beauty and excellence is driven towards doing so, which isn't always the case.


No, I've spoken to a lot of people about it, and emotions are never mentioned until someone points out that there is none. The same's happened in this thread: no one made mention of emotion or atmosphere in Soule's music until people started pointing out that it isn't there. Hell, more than half the people who LIKE his music are agreeing that it lacks emotion.

And actually... well, look at the piece that you've linked and that you've specifically talked about. Look at the comments under it. I went through ten pages of them, with the only person mentioning any emotion whatsoever saying that it made him feel "terribly sad" when he hears it at the office... which is the exact opposite of the "bliss" you said that piece makes you feel (and, given the piece's title, bliss is probably not what Soule was aiming for).

He is honestly too good to pass up. I can not think of anyone who could do he job better. Jeremy Soule probably gets some good press out of it too and I would not be surprised if Bethesda considers him a long time partner. Regardless of whether its him or not, the trailer music is the best symphony music i have ever heard.

I've had the sound track, in conjunction with in game events, choke me in up both Morrowind and Oblivion. If I haven't played either game in a long the opening theme can make me happy and excited with anticipation. You can't look into the minds of the player base and say the compositions aren't affecting them on an emotional level. All you can say is that it doesn't affect you and again, music is very subjective. Your generalization fails.

It wasn't a generalization. Soule's music fails, on a broader level, to evoke any specific emotion in people. That doesn't mean that nobody will feel emotions when they hear his music. It simply means that his music doesn't do an especially good job of bringing them about, and discussion of his music by people who enjoy it almost invariably reflects that (again, with the exception of the discussion that follows someone pointing out the lack of emotion in his pieces).

And all that said, feeling excitement and anticipation when you hear a theme you've learned to associate with the start of something you enjoy when you're about to engage in the thing you enjoy doesn't mean that the music itself is good at bringing about that excitement and anticipation.

Some consider Jeremy the "John Williams of Video-games", but hes more like the "Sam Spence of Video-games" IMO.

It's true strings are what you hear the most, but is there only that? No. You have woodwinds, brass, percussions and choir too. Bonus points for judging three random pieces as everything Soule's ever made.

Lol..so I suppose you aren't a fan of Mozart..man that guy must really svck and can't convey any emotions in his music..too many damn strings.

Solitude doesn't always have to be less intrusive and simple.

I don't need to point out the fact that there are more than just strings in those 3 pieces..really..it's pretty obvious.

Well, then go on Youtube and check out the comments on the soundtracks for Oblivion and Morrowind. Should provide you with ample amounts of emotional reactions.

Just proves that not everybody gets the same emotional reaction from his music. I doubt every person feels isolation and loneliness after hearing Way of Life.

Just to expand on what I was saying before: if you look at a discussion of the music in the first two games, people will always mention specific themes. I can guarantee the night time snow music will come up very early on, and some one will mention how lonely and sad it makes them feel. Then people will get into a bit of a talk about the warm tavern music, someone might bring up how a certain dungeon theme still gives them chills, and it'll go on from there. The entire discussion is always focused around the emotion and atmosphere that the music of those games carried with it.

Compare that to nearly any discussion of Morrowind's music, where you'll generally end up with more than a few people who didn't even know it had more than one track, or Oblivion's music, where at most you'll have people talking about how incredible Soule is and perhaps bringing up specific themes they like... but again, and as I've mentioned multiple times in this thread, unless it's already been brought up as a criticism specific emotions are something you will almost never see brought up, and atmosphere is a rather close second (though I'll cut Soule some slack on the latter - it's hard to make a track that suits a specific atmosphere in a game like Morrowind, where any of the music could play at any time outside of combat).

The point isn't that nobody feels anything hearing that music. People certainly do. People associate emotions with everything, so of course some people will. The point is that his music tends to lack any focused emotion - Soule's music isn't about feeling, regardless of whether or not it brings about feelings for you.


Bonus points for claiming that I was when I was very clearly specifically addressing those three pieces, none of which have any of the instruments you just mentioned from what I've heard of them.


See, this is the point where you make such a grasping and outright silly argument that I stop paying attention to you. Not that there's much point responding to the rest of your post anyways, since you pretty blatantly ignore most of what I said in what you were responding to without actually putting forward anything outside of "ha ha you're wrong so there".

Oblivion had one of the best soundtracks Ive ever heard. I never got tired of it.

Agreed. I actually like the fact that it doesn't browbeat me with excessive emotionalism, like so many other composers ( and this is coming from a Richard Strauss fan) and at the very, very least, he's never done a paint-by-numbers Carl Orff ripoff. Its subtlety is its strength.

Oblivion's soundtrack never got old for me either, its one of the reasons I played the game for so long, I might not be a movie music expert like the rest of you guys claim to be but I've never liked a game's music as much as Oblivion, it had to do with how the music and the game worked together so well.

You keep saying his music lacks any focused emotion as if it's some statement of fact. I like how you know exactly what goes through the mind of Jeremy Soule and how he wants his music interpreted. You have no more credibility than any other person here on the forum with an opinion. Sure some of his music could be interpreted to not have any emotional focus, but the generalize and say all of his music is that way is quite ignorant.

You also make the claim nobody feels anything listening to his music as if you speak for the majority of the people who have heard his music. Who elected you to be the voice of the people?

Like I said earlier, Jeremy is like Sam Spence. He borrows, heavily sometimes, when he makes his soundtracks. Then again, Watchmen's Ease and Dusk At The market never get old. I may be the only person in the world that gets drunk and drives his truck around in fields listening to the Oblivion Soundtrack.

Just so we're clear: this is why I'm not actually bothering to really respond to your arguments anymore.

Okay, enough arguing has gone on here. I'd rather not have to hand out warnings.


Edit: I see the Sam Spence comparison, certainly, but I actually find Jeremy Soule pretty reminiscent of Harold Budd, albeit less whimsical, with his spacious, non-invasive style.

You forgot this bit:

It wasn't a generalization. Soule's music fails, on a broader level, to evoke any specific emotion in people. That doesn't mean that nobody will feel emotions when they hear his music. It simply means that his music doesn't do an especially good job of bringing them about

Again throwing around alleged facts. His music doesn't do a good job bringing them about because what? You don't think so? You don't get any emotional reaction thus it's more likely to conclude his music is devoid of any emotion? Yeah I can see the sum of your argument right there in that quote..I won't bother arguing anymore either.

Yeah, tone wise and structure, very Budd like. Jeremy's motto though: "Imitation is the sincerest form of plagiarism"...

Seriously, stop.

Judging from some of the posts, feels like a reincarnation of the "Jeremy has no Soule" thread. *snicker* Oh god I feel old for remembering that thread from over 4-5 years ago. XD

Anyways, is it Soule? I personally wouldn't mind if it is, as I like his music. It doesn't matter to me though as to whoever has the reins to the soundtrack this time around, as long as it is well done.

Elder Scrolls is generic fantasy, to be perfectly honest. They are great games, but they barely deviate from the norm set by LotR. Soule is the right guy for the job, he has created masterpieces in the past and he can do it again. I personally play trombone, and I'm not all that good (first chair, but that isn't saying much). Soule always makes me remember why I enjoy playing classical music, and really what other type of music could work in and Elder Scrolls game?

If you listen to the music right after the narrator says "Dragonborn" in the trailer it sounds alot like the main part of both the Morrowind and Oblivion theme.

Though, i don't know if that necessarily means that Soule made the trailer's music.

I would disagree to an extent. Nirn is very accepting of beast and stranger races, barring slavery. The last time I saw a giant cat beast was when I read Ringworld. You don't see this type of stuff in your typical HF setting. All high fantasy will have its cliche and deja vu moments though, but I find The ES series to be superior to LOTR honestly and pretty unique compared to D&D or some newer IP like DA. This is due to better writing and back stories then Beth is usually given credit for.

@rabish12. I don't want to get into the emotional vs. non-emotional thing, but one might argue that music which expresses loneliness, sadness, happiness, hope, etc. is perhaps less suitable than the high-fantasy style Soule goes for. Music which expresses loneliness, sadness, etc. would be great if they could be cued to specific events in the game which would be improved by having such music... But it might seem odd to be exploring the countryside with a melancholy air, or a lively jig, or whatever, playing in the background. For a lot of the game, it seems like a more neutral expression is more suitable (although, I tend to agree that this could be achieved with some more subtlety, and less of the overt "LOTR/epic" style).

Just to be clear: I don't mean to suggest that you are advocating this, I was just curious about what you thought.

Are you guys kidding me? Oblivions music was fantastic. I loved morrowinds too! Who ever wanted synths should be punished with 10 years of endless cliff racers

Both used synths..yet you loved them. What gives?