Only thing I didnt like about the argonians in morrowind, was the legs. They were too bent. Seriosly, first time I saw argonians from a distance, I was like WTF, whats with the giant frogs?

I know how things go on internet forums, so I'm sure you're still going to argue with me even if I keep demonstrating you're wrong. But anyway, I'll give it just a last try.


1. I think you confound pectoralis with briasts. Perhaps you should learn that briasts aren't muscles, nor are they sacks of fat. But come on, entertain me, and show me a proof of bird briasts!

2. Argonians are reptiles. But then again, there are various examples of humanoid shapes in nature: http://www.fellowearthlings.org/images/home_meerkat.jpg so yeah, I don't think meerkats feel anything towards human briasts. Oh wait, an anthropomorphic lizard! -> http://www.factzoo.com/sites/all/img/reptiles/jesus-lizard-running-on-water-basilisk.jpg Surely this creature loves a pair of briasts!
If you'd pay attention to biology, you should know that being shaped like something does not mean being that thing. (Otherwise we should all be very worried about this http://www.tourtamoan.com/files/perter_pencs_pepper_1_191.jpg ) Argonians have evoluted in a way that gives them an human-like figure. It does not make them human.
If you want your furry fandom fix of anthropomorphic creatures that have NOTHING of animalic but are basically humans in a costume, please, go to a furry forum. I hate the furry fandom precisely because of how they know little to nothing about real Nature.

Yeah, this :yes:

I'd like to see more focus on the beast aspect. These races aren't just humanoids with beast-like features. They are bests. The reason why they are popular is that they are very different compared to elves or humans so i didn't like the direction, benthesa took in Oblivion. The fact they couldn't use boots or helmets made them more unique.

I've always pictured Khajit quite cunning and unpredictavle like cats. Somewhat wild by their nature and not very civilized by their manners. The weakness to moonsugar and skooma underlines their moody nature. Night eye makes them feared hunters of the night. The fact that they use claws in h2h even emphazises their beast nature. The fun contrast is though that Khajit make friends easily with other races unlike Argonians.

Argonians are the most mysterious race, gifted toward arcane and all kinds of magical forces. Resistant to poisons, ilness and all kinds of hazards. The fact that they can live underwater makes them the most unique species in TES. By nature they are slow to trust but very loyal to those they call friends. I'd say Argonians are more civilized than Khajit, but they are more enigmatic as we know so little of them.

Argonians as in Morrowind, but it all depend son the sub species of Khajiit this time around. If we are Suthay-Raht, yet again, then more like Morrowind would be good, but if we are Ohmes-Raht, then they should go the Oblivion style.

Digitigrade legs would be great and all, but let's be honest, Morrowind's beast races looked awkward as hell, especially when you factor in that waddle they had as a walk animation.

If they want to try digitigrade again, they might want to take a look at Mass Effect, which had a number of races with that leg style, and looked much more natural.

I hope they keep it true to the concept art. Perfect balance there, including the briasts of-course...
Anyway, aren't you guys forgetting that gods are real in the Elder Scrolls universe so evolution -and correct me if I'm wrong- needn't exist?

A mix of both. More like Morrowind (minus the horrible walking animation), but let us wear boots and full helms please.

I want them to look noticeably different from the Mer folk. Not like Morrowind, but I want the Argonians to have a prominent, alligator like head, Khajiit to have more Lion like head and both to have different body styles than the humans, not just human bodies with beast heads and a tail.

1. Chicken briasts. Yum. I am not using the term briast to mean Mammary Glands. I'm using the term to refer to the muscle and fat tissue on ventral side of the upper abdomen, synonymous with chest. Outside of the feet, Argonians do have human body proportions, and that can easily extend to the formation of fat over the briasts.

2. Those are bipedal, not anthropomorphic. Anthropomorphism is the application of human(Anthro) qualities to a non-human. In most instances, this is a mental more than physical change. Evoluted is not a word, and, actually, they were created/shaped by the Hist. I'm not saying they do like briasts. I'm saying your logic for why they wouldn't like briasts is faulty. Also, the aforementioned animals, as far as we know, do not mate for pleasure. We cannot say the same about Argonians.

Since we do not know of any species that are as intelligent as humans, all creatures with intelligence are Humans with a different body-shape and physical features. Without another template, it's all we have to work with. Yes, we can give them "Different perceptions" than humans, but all that is are Humans in Funny-looking Bodies and wearing silly Cultural/Personality hats. And, due to Rule 36 of the Internet, there's a human that likely thinks like said Funny-looking human. Even when we try giving them "Animalistic" thought qualities, we are only giving them thoughts along the lines of "How the animal behaves and thinks as a human understands it", and it's easy to find a humans that share the same percieved thought patterns (Where do you think Otherkin come from?)

Even if the body's completely different than a human's, the species/race was created by humans in our image, with heavy alteration.

Ah, here's the issue. I used "briast" as synonim of "mammaries", but you used it as synonim for "chest".

Well, reptiles (or birds, or amphibians) do not have mammaries and biologically they could NEVER develop briasts. No, sacks of fat do not make briasts. They would just make the kind of "briasts" you see on fat men, and those are shaped completely differently and definitely not alluring.


I could go on, but since this is going off topic, I'll end the argument with this: if you tell me you like argonians with boobs because you think they're sixy, it's ok. If you tell me you like them because it's a fantasy videogame so it never was meant to be anatomically correct, it's ok. If you tell me you just find argonian with boobs to be funnier or more folkloristic, it's ok.

But if you tell me it makes perfect sense on a biological point of view, so that it makes even more sense than reptiles not having briasts.... then you are so wrong I shouldn't even need to explain why.

So, choose one of the three reasons for liking argonians with briasts, and let's end it there. Just don't tell me that reptiles with human briasts are a biological possibility, no matter how anthropomorphized.

Neither. I want completely new models for both.

I'm saying it's not impossible for the females of a reptilian species to develop completely gratuitous bags of fat supported by a mesh of connective tissue for purely aesthetic reasons if the males of the species find such growths attractive. It doesn't have to make sense from a strictly biological standpoint, and only occurs if the Argonians do have the mindset of a human in that regard (Which they might, being based on human intelligence and thought process). As other lizards do not have human intelligence and reasoning processes (Not neccessarily reasonable processes), they don't find briasts attractive. But, nobody knows with Argonians. They could take after either, and precedent in the games is inconsistant. The females could have gotten them in the first place by the quirks of natural selection and evolution, magical tinkering with their genetics after creation, or having them initially thrown on by the Hist "Just because we're basing the rest of their anatomy on the humans."

The Skyrim concept art looked cool for Argonians. I kind of like my Kajiits looking like the Thunder Cats though, ie Oblivion. If they had beastial legs then I wouldn't be able to play as Lion-O. Although there are many different types of Kajiits from what I understand. Some more beastial and others more human-like. I think the Kajiit should have hoofs if they have beast legs... just because that would look cool... it would make no sense, but it would look cool.

Urg... Thunder-cat Khajiit should be able to be modded in.

Of course, with a good enough character creation system, it might be able to be possible to choose between Suthay-Raht, Ohmes-Raht, and Ohmes subraces. They seem to be statistically similar.

There over 1000 versions of this exact poll. Most of them in general discussion.

I liked how in Morrowind Argonians and Khajiit's had their own unique swimming animation with the argonians having this very elegant way of swimming, shame they removed it in Oblivion, I hope they bring it back. I voted for a return of Morrowind style beast races.

We already know what style Bethesda is aiming for the argonians.

http://img46.imageshack.us/img46/5965/argonian.png

No poll can change that.

Did anybody ever find it funny that that beast's face would fit neetly into a helmet or mask clearly made for a human in Oblivion? I think in Morrowind certain helms couldn't be worn by beast races.

By that logic every race should have its own armor.

MW beast reaces looked and walked goofy as hell and BGS should stick with Arena, Daggerfall, OB posture. And for the last time... Beasts (animals) do not have 'backward legs'!

http://animaldiversity.ummz.umich.edu/site/resources/anatomical_images/feet_and_legs/posture.jpg/medium.jpg

I think Bethesda has already designed the beast races, and I trust they have made them look really cool.

I personally prefer some mix of the Oblivion and Morrowind ones. Beast races should have claws and beast legs, but should stand more upright than in Morrowind.
Khajiit would have legs depending on it's type. I don't think ohmes-khajiit would have beast legs.

Also, to the discussion about whether argonians females should have briasts or not:
They should have briasts. Morrowind is the only TES game as far as I know where argonian females did not have them.
I could not care less if it does not make sense biologically, TES has gods and magic, so the biology of earth does not need to matter at all.

I hope they look like that. He looks way awesome.

Note that this argonian looks exactly like Oblivion's argonians.

Some people deluded themselves into thinking his legs are more animal-like, but no. Sadly, it's just an effect of the boots he's wearing.

If argonians really will look like this concept art, then it'll be the same as Oblivion: they will be human beings wearing goofy animal masks and static fake tails. Talk about high budget special effects!! <_<