To kill a Daedra : The Elder Scrolls Series Discussion

» Tue May 08, 2012 6:58 am

Probaly. Also about Jyggalag. How did he achived that much powers? He could just help mortals alot or love them, and they would love him and worship him. Increasing his powers to insane stats.

He probably had quite alot of power, mainly due to his Anuic nature, as there isnt much known about the origins of Jyggalag he could be a Magna Ge, as he sphere is really more aligned with that of the Aedra.

Hmm, I like the idea of unlinking the planes of Oblivion and diverting magical energy from reaching to a particular plane of oblivion effectively starving out whatever Daedric prince is occupying it, you may even be able to starve them to death, make their particular plane of Oblivion vanish. It would need tremendous power and knowledge to do though.

» Mon May 07, 2012 10:08 pm

Hmm, I like the idea of unlinking the planes of Oblivion and diverting magical energy from reaching to a particular plane of oblivion effectively starving out whatever Daedric prince is occupying it, you may even be able to starve them to death, make their particular plane of Oblivion vanish. It would need tremendous power and knowledge to do though.

It would not starve him to death, since he is the creator of the plane, but did not build it out of his own flesh. It would weaken him a lot, but he is still immortal. It's like taking the light away from us. As a non photosynthetic species, men doesn't need sunlight to survive, but without it we would get depressed and weak.

» Tue May 08, 2012 12:35 am

Would there be a way for another Daedric prince to effectively remove another Daedric prince and take over the ousted Daedric princes plane of oblivion? cause there is no limit to how many planes of oblivion a Daedric prince can have right? then if another prince takes it, then the Daedric prince has only themself, would that be enough to then kill the prince? permanent death?

» Tue May 08, 2012 1:02 am

I don't think so, but there are others that understand this much more then I do. But as we saw in SI, when Jyg was there, Sheogorath was gone; as long as he was - no trace of Jyg. After Jyg was defeated and left, we took over. I think to overtake ones reign, the owner must leave it. If he dies, the plane disappears (remember the Paradise). That is why Nal-Hutta warns of the Ayleids as they've established their own Polydox.

So you can't overtake it to defeat him, but defeat him to overtake. All a Lord can do is weakens the influence of his foes, weaken themselfes eventually.

» Tue May 08, 2012 2:56 am

I am in the middle of writing a quest mod for Skyrim, and I would like for some information to be obtained by the player, in a book of such from Apocrypha.

It is said that the knowledge to kill a Daedra exists in Hermaeus Mora's plane of Oblivion. Given that, what would be the most likely or more specifically the most likely lore friendly way of killing a Daedra?

The only way to kill one of them, that I know of, is through creation or recreation of the Mundus.

Problem with that is they have to be tricked into it and the start of a new Kalpa doesn't happen that often...

» Mon May 07, 2012 8:37 pm

Problem with that is they have to be tricked into it and the start of a new Kalpa doesn't happen that often...

Especially as Alduin, who's job was to end the current Kalpa, failed. Shouldn't have played with his stupid Dragon friends and instead start eating.

» Mon May 07, 2012 5:53 pm

I don't think so, but there are others that understand this much more then I do. But as we saw in SI, when Jyg was there, Sheogorath was gone; as long as he was - no trace of Jyg. After Jyg was defeated and left, we took over. I think to overtake ones reign, the owner must leave it. If he dies, the plane disappears (remember the Paradise). That is why Nal-Hutta warns of the Ayleids as they've established their own Polydox.

So you can't overtake it to defeat him, but defeat him to overtake. All a Lord can do is weakens the influence of his foes, weaken themselfes eventually.

Don't be fouled, the realms themselves are the truest expressions of the princes. Those limited bodies that we think of as princes are just meat-puppets that they set up for the convenience of mortals.

As far as I can tell, Jyggalag is now a lone Daedroth, swimming the waters of Oblivion. It may be that with time, he'll metastasize and grow into another principality.

» Tue May 08, 2012 4:48 am

For all we know Mehrunes Dagon could've bottled that up and poured the madness into Jyggalag's beer.

Wow. I think you found the answer. Maybe rephrase it though. Jyggalag's slaves saw the pure madness as an opportunity to overthrow their kind and generous master like the bottomfeeding ingrates they are.

» Tue May 08, 2012 3:05 am

I suppose you could destroy them, or at least prevent them from reincarnating by destroying their respawn point (such as the wellsprings in Shivering Isles).

» Tue May 08, 2012 5:21 am

Don't be fouled, the realms themselves are the truest expressions of the princes. Those limited bodies that we think of as princes are just meat-puppets that they set up for the convenience of mortals.

As far as I can tell, Jyggalag is now a lone Daedroth, swimming the waters of Oblivion. It may be that with time, he'll metastasize and grow into another principality.

Jyggalag is lurking in the shadows, growing in power and planning to take back those who rightfully belong to him.

» Tue May 08, 2012 4:08 am

Then Jyggalag must have a daedric realm somewhere? Maybe he's busy doing housecleaning being away so long :laugh:

» Tue May 08, 2012 12:43 am

Then Jyggalag must have a daedric realm somewhere? Maybe he's busy doing housecleaning being away so long :laugh:

Perhaps if there's enough leftover Aetherial refuse, perhaps he could make a new realm.

» Mon May 07, 2012 4:42 pm

Then Jyggalag must have a daedric realm somewhere? Maybe he's busy doing housecleaning being away so long :laugh:

it was 2 beings like Akatosh and Alduin. Yeah he probaly have his own realm. But must be taking his time to clean Sheogorath mess. Also he is very weak because of the curse and can't stay too much centurys on Jyggalag form.

» Tue May 08, 2012 12:47 am

I suppose you could destroy them, or at least prevent them from reincarnating by destroying their respawn point (such as the wellsprings in Shivering Isles).

I think a Deadric prince is just the vessel to it's soul/energy. Like a gas tank. You can destroy it mechanically but the gas will just be released. So you can maybe destroy the "vessel creation engine" but not the very soul. And as the soul is the reign, it can just build another engine.

About Jyggalag. I really want to see him again as he is the most interesting Daedroth so far. His nature is against his very purpose. I wonder how he was created; something must have gone terribly wrong there.

» Mon May 07, 2012 4:41 pm

Hmm, perhaps the only entity that is capable of Killing a Daedric Prince is another Daedric Prince....

Simply by assuming the defending Daedric Princes sphere, ie similar to how Sheogorath overtook Jyggalag. This seems probable. So for instance, if Jyggy came in and took over from Hermaeus Mora the sphere of Knowledge etc, then Jyggy would be in command of Knowledge and Order, which seem to fit together.

So the question is, if a Daedric Prince did take over a sphere from another Daedric Prince, does this kill the defending prince?

» Mon May 07, 2012 5:30 pm

So the question is, if a Daedric Prince did take over a sphere from another Daedric Prince, does this kill the defending prince?

You're separating the idea from the prince: the prince is the idea. If Jyg were to "take over" HM's sphere (by mantling him, as the CoC did Sheo) the two ideas would become one. The essence of what had been Herma Mora would re-coalesce around Jyg and the two ideas, order and forbidden knowledge, would become one thing over time. The two would become one being.

» Tue May 08, 2012 1:49 am

Then, this would be a way to effectively kill 2 princes, and make 1. right? We have found a way of killing a daedric prince.... right?

» Mon May 07, 2012 6:19 pm

If they appear on Nirn they can be beaten... This has happened several times in the past.
In their realms they probably can't be killed, but that doesn't mean that somebody can't make them weaker and himself stronger in the process.

I thought they could be banished from from anywhere and killed from nowhere?

» Tue May 08, 2012 7:36 am

I thought they could be banished from from anywhere and killed from nowhere?

Probably true, at least from how I see it. I just tried to answer one post in simpler terms.

» Mon May 07, 2012 5:45 pm

You're separating the idea from the prince: the prince is the idea. If Jyg were to "take over" HM's sphere (by mantling him, as the CoC did Sheo) the two ideas would become one. The essence of what had been Herma Mora would re-coalesce around Jyg and the two ideas, order and forbidden knowledge, would become one thing over time. The two would become one being.

Technically Hermy's sphere is divining of the future. That combined with Jyggalag's whole library, the resulting Daedric Prince would be determining the future via what is most likely. The Daedric Prince of Estimation.

» Mon May 07, 2012 7:12 pm

Technically Hermy's sphere is divining of the future. That combined with Jyggalag's whole library, the resulting Daedric Prince would be determining the future via what is most likely. The Daedric Prince of Estimation.

He would be a computer. That's boring.

» Mon May 07, 2012 8:12 pm

The daedric prince of cataloging forbidden knowledge

Now in mind warping blank card catalog format.

Short of unmaking the universe, I don't really see how you can dispose of a daedric lord permanently... but why would you want to ? Its like fighting a force of nature.

» Mon May 07, 2012 8:30 pm

Sanguine would be easier to get rid of. Just take all the fun out of the world.

» Tue May 08, 2012 2:23 am

I think the combination of the two princes would most likely be one of the most powerful sphere, as hermy's sphere isn't particularly evil either. Something to rival the aedra even? Maybe...

Either way this would be a great way for jyggalag to gain power, but not necessarily freedom, but I think his sphere is the stronger of the two anyway

» Tue May 08, 2012 1:07 am

I doubt Jyggalag would want to merge with another prince unless it is Peryite. All the others are too chaotic, and he would want his merged form to be orderly in behaviour.