Whether the Empire falls or stands, I think Morrowind is one of the provinces that will benefit most from the situation, whichever of them it is. If the empire is destroyed, then they are one of the few provinces united into one nation, and Helseth has almost everyone of his internal enemies weakend and as such, they are more or less in control. Therefore, Morrowind would not suffer from the same insecurity as other nations in other provinces, and could focus more on strengthening himself and his influence over the neighbouring provinces. Establishing safe trade routes to Chorrol, for example, making sure the people there has food and such (And no, not in the gentle and good natured king style or for such reasons, having a hold on a Cyrodiilic city makes so many things so much easier )

If the Empire stands, Helseth still has a pretty good chance of improving and establishing a hold on the Imperial Throne. For while I believe that the Empire isn't just going to fall apart in the close few years, there will be wars fought over the title as Emperor by different Legion Generals, nobles and warlords. In the end, what remains will be a seriously weakend Empire. If Morrowind plays it cards right, Helseth might end up with a strong dominance over the new emperor (for I do not believe Helseth would have the manpower it requires to hold the throne himself. Taking it, probably, but holding it, not a chance). In the "succesion" wars, a large, "united" nation like Morrowind would be a very strong ally, but such alliances does not come without disadvantages for the new emperor (leaning on another countrys force is never good for any leader).

And on the other hand, there's a much bigger chance of the Empire pulling back (some of) the Legion in Morrowind, that Helseth even trying to push them out. The Legions is all over the place.

I think you have a pretty good idea of what would happen in those conditions Villfarelse. I know that since most of the stuff was done via RP and that makes people somewhat wary of accepting it or maybe even hearing about it, that people still stick to what they saw of Helseth in Tribunal and pigeon-hole him into this rather one dimensional character and not really allowing for the growth as a character and ruler that Ted wrote about.

Why would he make enemies with them before they're gone? I think he'll just continue to strengthen his position, and when the Empire collapses, he won't make a move with his armies, he'll just strengthen Morrowind even more. When a new power rises, they'll have a great economy, a strong army and a rich nation. Seeing how versatile Dunmer are in combat, i don't think this new power will just charge in, and i can already imagine Helseth trading and stuff with them. This will make Morrowind strong, rich and with influence. And they lived happy ever after.

That's a good point about Morrowind being more prepared for possible anarchy than most provinces. At the same time, the fact that Morrowind borders several other provinces might be a challenge for them, whether it means having to deal with refugees for example, or possible future conflicts with the Nords, Argonians, etc.

Well if he wants to get rid of the Empire, he would also need to get rid of the House of HUalau (sp), and burn Balmora to the ground.......

Make enemies with who before who's gone? I don't get what you're referring to.
And I don't think the Empire will collapse. It will be weakend, and it might loose some influence and foothold in provinces like Morrowind, Summerset Isles, Valenwood, Hammerfell and Argonia, but it will not be completly destroyed.


Well, the only provinces they border to are Skyrim, Cyrodiil and Argonia. Skyrim consists of several bickering city-states, which would take every possibility they get to invade their neighbours, whether they lie in Skyrim, Hammerfell, High Rock, Cyrodiil or, I guess, Morrowind. These leaders and (possibly) war lords are also, to me, a few of the most plausable to reach for the Imperial Throne, focusing on that instead of invading Morrowind. Anyway, since they are not united in the same way Morrowind is, they would not be strong enough to become a serious threat to Morrowind borders.

Cyrodiil would be in the center of an Imperial Civil War, the goal of every emperor-wannabe in all of Tamriell, and the cities there would be to busy defending themselves to attack anything, anywhere. Instead, eastern Cyrodiil would be a place where Morrowind has the greatest chance of increasing it's influence, making it dependant on Morrowind trade.

Argonia is just a plague-ridden pool of Argonian tribes that just wants to be left alone. It's probably the province that would be least affected by a "succession war", since the Imperials have problems keeping in the first place. But I could imagine Helseth approving Hlaalu and Dres settling further down the border, more or less "colonizing" the area.

Why would he do that. He is the highest ranking Hlaalu. And Balmora is not the center of House Hlaalu's activities, only it's main Vvardernfel base of activities.

Seriously, he'd be more effective in razing Kragenmoor or Narsis. Especially Narsis.

Hopefully.

The Elder Council is currently looking to name a successor. (See words of Ocato after Martin's transformation)



"You're no fool. The days of the Empire are almost over. When the Emperor dies, nine hells're going to break loose. Forget about the Imperial City. Think locally." (Caius Cosades' words to the Nerevarine)

___TWM

I always thought it was pretty definitive that Wulf says it. But there ya' go.

Wulfharth tried and tried throughout history to assault Red Mountain to free his god, Lorkhan's heart. (See http://www.imperial-library.info/mwbooks/wulfharthsongs.shtml and http://www.imperial-library.info/mwbooks/arcturian.shtml) Since he never succeeded, he understood that an "old dog doesn't learn new tricks", so he sent the Nerevarine to do it for him. Smart. Tiber Septim always was a good tactician. "This young myth is perhaps inspired by Talos' reputation for shrewd diplomacy, attested by even his greatest critics, which permitted him to scheme and bargain his way into the capital city - which he lacked the armies or funds to conquer by dint of force." (http://www.imperial-library.info/pge/cyrodiil.shtml)

___TWM

Wulfharth sent the Nerevarine? I'm not sure that completely aligns with the various interpretation's of the Nerevarine's journey. Does the "lukcy coin" have anything to do with it? Otherwise, the impression I get is Wulf was merely standing around when his god was freed.

Unless you think the Caius may have been Wulfharth, and so Talos or another joyriding divine. (In game, they have the same faces. Gameplay restrictions?)

<.< i don't know all their cities..... Anywho what i was getting at was the House of Hlaalu get most of their power and wealth from trading/working with the empire. If he want to break away from the Empire, he would have to deal with his own house first.

Hlaalu will do anything that will get them more money. And you have to remember one of the most prominant anti-imperial groups was Hlaalu (the Camonna Tong). But in general, if they profit more by letting the Empire stay, they will do it, and if the profit more by kicking out the empire, they will do it. And the Hlaalu/Dres alliance pretty much controls all the money so what is good for Hlaalu is good for Morrowind.

Wulf was really Tiber Septim. (See http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Morrowind:Wulf). As for not clicking with the Nerevarine prophecies, remember that the Nerevarine had to be Dragon-born (http://www.imperial-library.info/mwbooks/lost_prophecy.shtml) while Talos is sometimes called Ysmir, the Dragon of the North (See "Ysmir" in http://www.imperial-library.info/mwbooks/varietiesoffaith.shtml)

And as a side note, http://www.gamesas.com/bgsforums/index.php?showtopic=605086&hl=# was about the relationship of the Nerevarine to the Imperial throne.

___The Word Merchant of Julianos

The thread is closed? At post 120? Outrageous! I would have liked to have participated there.

Either way, it does implictly suggest that Talos prepared the Nerevarine exclusively. This would dispell ideas that any old beggar could have become the Nerevarine, which is good.

"The package you gave me described the prophecy's conditions, and you seem to match them." (Caius Cosades to the Nerevarine)

I have always wondered what happened to that other son of Uriel VII.....a child also having the name Uriel. Daggerfall gave a background depending on some initial choices that allowed you to have saved Uriel VII's son, Uriel from bandits. A long shot at best.

As for why I presented my first post again, it fits with the topic of this thread. Helseth would have had a big reason to have had the Nerevarine assassinated had the Nerevarine been the child of Barenziah. (Let's forget that we would have to explain why Helseth would know that but Barenziah acted as if she didn't know the Nerevarine in-game. )

The other problem is that the Nerevarine is of unspecified race, and Barenziah's son would HAVE to be Dunmer.

But that leads me to another question. Whatever happened to Barenziah's and Tiber Septim's child?

Supposedly, it was aborted.

That is only if the biology worked as it usually does in TES, with the mother's racial features being the most prominent. However, we are dealing with a divine being as the father, which may override the usual outcomes.

Nonetheless, that would place the limits at Breton (if Talos was from High Rock), Nordic/Nedic (if Talos was from Atmora), Imperial (if we retconned their existence the way TES III did) and Dunmer. This would still leave too many options left out for it to be an "across the board" theory.



:shrug: Likely killed, just as the book suggested.

___TWM

OK, that's what I thought. I just didn't want to read through the "Real Barenziah" right now.

That would get rid off Vodunius Nuccius too. Money-grubbing ass, he was.