I can't be the only one who's wanted to pull off some very well planned out/staked out, dangerous heists in Oblivion. Unfortunately, there isn't much need to "plan" any of your heists, as they aren't that difficult to pull off, regardless of where you're trying to rob.

I hope in Skyrim, there are certain establishments (*coughbankscough*), where there are LARGE sums of money to be stolen, and they should all require some very well planned out and risky schemes in order for you to be successful. I don't want any of these to be quests, but rather something you choose to do because you think you have the skills and the smarts to pull it off (and the time to invest in such a project). Basically, they'd need to make the stealth and theft systems much more in depth and difficult, and add a lot of places where a nice, strategic heist would be necessary to make a robbery possible.

Thoughts?

Like the House Vaults in Vivec? Those things were loaded man. That was more of a hack 'n' slash your way to gold, rather than sneakin'.

I'm all for it. Bank jobs sound interesting.

Depends on how much money you get from them.


Maybe you can only rob each bank once or each time they may upgrade defences if it is repeatable.

I like robbing stuff but I want the reward to be great (because I stole from a ****** bank!) but not abused to where we get millions of septims.

So it should only be attemptable a few times a year/month or make it even harder each time.

sounds more like something a mod could do and I dont think bethesda should put their effort towards it

Do you know any Oblivion or Morrowind Heist mods? I don't.

I loved those vaults in Vivec and still have fond memories of robbing all that valuable stuff. Needed a ton of sneak/chameleon/invisibility) but the rewards were well worth it.

Come to think of it, I always visited the Dren Plantation too as it also had some valuable stuff (Orcish/Daedric Greaves, shields and weaponry as I recall).

Made you feel truly powerful after hauling out all that stuff and putting it on (even though with low skills it only gave you just a bit of a headstart really)

Maybe if we get to make off with more than chump change from all our loot it might be worth the trouble.

Sooo, like the later thieves guild quests in Oblivion, but you have to figure it out for yourself. Okay, sure, I'm for it.

The problem is, how do you make it so that it's not the same for everyone? Even if every city has a bank, and each bank has its own blueprints and security, there can only be a few ways of pulling off the heist...

Method 1 = hack and slash to the vault
Method 2 = sneak to the vault
Method 3 = use magic to charm/calm/deceive the bank security workers and reach the vault
Method 4 = apply to work at the vault; if accepted you get a key to the vault
Method 5 = take the bank president hostage
Method 6 = convince a bank security member to help you as a partner/friend/hostage
Method 7 = find a way to shut down any defensive enchantments or traps, and distract the security workers from the vault

I'm already starting to get into simple variations of the same basic ideas... So ultimately it would be more or less impossible to create some truly unique/dynamic heist experiences. But it would be nice if they at least allowed heists and some variation in how the player pulls them off.

I'm not gonna spoil your eggs, but if you had the keys it was nothing but a simple affair. I robbed all three vaults easily without spilling a drop of blood.


:EDIT:

There really was nothing you could stage a heist around in Oblivion. Makes me a bit sad considering that would likely be one of my most favourite pastimes.

If bank heists are actually challenging, I'll be content to rob them just for the challenge and satisfaction afterwards. Any loot will just be a bonus.
I'm thinking of something a bit like the Hitman games, I like the emphasis on remaining undetected and using violence only when you have no other option.

there was a bank mod for Oblivion and you could steal from that (it wasn't that hard and big though) However a person could easily do this themselves

There's actually a fair amount of largely unique stuff to steal in Oblivion and all, but the real problem is that you have to either take a risk and enter places 100% blind, or you need to know in advance from out-of-game sources that there's something to steal.

The first and most important part of achieving this is simply to make the player aware of possible heists more effectively. As an example of how this SHOULD work, using Oblivion as our "base":

Me: Here, have a coin, beggar.
Beggar: Thank ye, kind sir.
Me: So what's the word around town?
Beggar: For you, Cat Burgler? I hear that Rasheda keeps a special warhammer with her at all times. I'd imagine it's easiest to take when she's asleep...

Example 2:

Me: What's the word around town?
Beggar: Even for a Shadowfoot, information isn't free.
Me: Right. 10 gold enough?
Beggar: I suppose. Herminia Cinna keeps something under lock and key in her room. I wonder what it could be.

Example 3:

Me: Are you sure you can't help me out? *hands over 10 gold*
Beggar: wait a second... I remember! The Temple of Zenithar is shipping out tithes in the morning, bound for the Imperial City.
Me: Stealing from the Temple, eh? I'm not sure I'd try that WITH Nocturnal's blessing.
Beggar: To each his own.
*I go scout the Temple, just in case I see a chance. Then I decide to go loot the count's castle instead, since it appears all but a handful of guards are at the temple*
*YOU sneak in and manage to rob the Temple of Zenithar in your game*

I've got an idea on how it could work. The building with the vault [be it a bank, noples manor, etc.] would have patroling guards in a set patern. If you attack the guards there is a good chance you will get killed. Instead you would sneak around the building hiding when patrols apppear. [places to hide could be closets, around corners, etc]. If the guards see you they will attack you. At the vault there are two set guards. Every half an hour the guards change shifts. here would be a five minute delay. You could either hide in the room and assasinate the new shift when they come in. Which gives you thirty-five minutes to break into the vault and escape the building. Or you could spend those five minutes trying and failing.

Other possible ideas to create options and slow down repittition

If you kill a serant you can stel his livery [uniform] whereupon you can just walk into the house. But if another servant sees you and recognises you arent one the guards will be alerted. So you either have to hide or assasinate the servant and hide his body in a closet.

It may take ten minutes to pick the locks on the vault. Sneaking into a certain room can up the danger but also make it much fatser.

There should be several ways to gain information. Each servant in the building will have knowledge about guard roots and floor plans. You coul bribe one of those servants. Or maybe you go on reconasainse missions before the heist.

Yeah I want something like that.

Stealing was such a pitiful way to make money in Oblivion, even if you had a fence, very few houses had anything worth stealing.

That sounds simple, good and do-able.

Grab some friends via Xbox-Live 4 player ( here's hoping) or hire some thugs from the local Theives Guild, and crack that joint. And hopefully not end up getting nothing more than a silver dish, 12 gold, and some calipers and tongs.

i like this.
plus im sure if someone put some thought into it, this type of stealing quests could be made recyclable

I was talking about doing this with New Vegas. But large scale heists in Skyrim sound very cool

AGREED!

There was a mod for Oblivion that added vaults to the major cities. Combine that with another mod that added tools from the Thief games, and you had some decent robbing available. It was kind of Formulaic though. Outside of the extra steps you had to take to acquire any special items the vault had, robbing the vault consisted of stealing the keys from an off-duty vault guard, break-in, get around the vault security guards somehow, and clean the place out.

Hmmm... repeating... Yeah, I guess that could be done for something like robbing caravans/tithes/whatever.

My main point was that Oblivion and Morrowind both kind of said "we put awesome stuff out there, go find it" with nothing more to go on. Oblivion made a whole information network for thieves... and it never actually helped you find unique or even rare stuff. That's the important part is... not exactly telling you "go here for da phat lootz", but actually acting as if the beggars, who are the eyes and ears of the Thieves' Guild are capable of helping you with random burglary. Doesn't have to be EVERY unique item, nor be specific at all times... but assume 5000 dwellings and 50 unique or rare items that any self-respecting thief wants to steal. That's a 1% chance completely blind. if 50% of the population is dirt poor (and Bethesda is 98% sensible), we get 2500 dwellings to find 49 items (one being their HAHA moment by putting an amazing shield in a freaking hovel). then, assuming we can pare that down to the richest 10% of the remaining people having 70% of the "cool stuff", that's still 250 houses for 35 items. 14%... 7 houses to find one item, best case.

I wouldn't mind that so much personally, but by the same token, I've still got 24 items in 2250 houses. that's a 1% chance. That's why the beggars should really be "good sources of information for a thief". Really makes the playing style a bit more "rewarding", in that you don't rob half the city and get a bunch of silverware.

That said, no more than 60 to 70% of the items really need to be pointed out. The rest can be subtle things. Maybe people who mention being from "an old family" are "more likely" to have good stuff... but are still more likely than not to have nothing worth your time.

And then, of course, rich houses should (with limited exceptions) always be worth robbing. (Some families will only appear rich), but only some have the really good stuff, etc.

Yes! Me too!

I hope Skyrim will have some kind of open really good stuff. It doesn't have to be legendary artifacts, just.. items and lots of money that are very hard to get otherwise in the game.
Although it would be indeed nice if some unique one-of-a-kind items existed in vaults, like the Daedric Greaves (well... kind of, you could get a full armor in another way by killing you-know-who).

As long as it's possible (but VERY VERY hard) to steal the stuff without getting caught, I'm all in for it.

Lets just hope daedric greaves are rare and not sudenly bandit chic as soon as you steal them ?_?

I'm all for the inclusion of banks and vaults whether there's a heist mechanic or not as it fleshes out the world-building and adds another interesting location.

The expansion of criminality would be good for the game as it's such a big part of the series. Being a bank robber, highywayman or even mugger would be nice additions but would probably require an overhaul of the gameplay mechanics as well as the inevitable detection and reputation improvements to make these things viable. The ability to make threaten a dialogue choice or an action in game (ie. point sword at someone) and also being able to deliver a beatdown without killing someone would improve this aspect. You definitely couldn't have psychic guards with super level boost or immediate worldwide infamy gain.

There is a mod for oblivion, 'Shezries Towns', where you can rob in a museum.