Well, I agree.

In Morrowind the Altmer had really snobby greetings, like "I feel it is my duty to help those less fortunate than myself" or something like that, and they always talked that way no matter how much they liked you. Khajiit and Argonians were the enslaved races, so that was a big part of their personality (which also means that I'm having troubles finding differences between the behaviors of Argonians and Khajiit right now). Imperials were the civilised colonialists, and Nords were elf haters who were mainly there to cause trouble. (I don't need to mention the Dunmer, I think.)

At least, that's how I remember it. So at least in their generic behavior and in certain roles they've been assigned, they had certain traits that made them seem different. There was nothing like that in Oblivion, except for a little bit of Imperial racism in Leyawiin, Argonians making fun of Khajiit and Orcs acting all tough. But even Morrowind's portrayal of the different races wasn't really enough. There should be scenes in taverns where people start a huge fight over something trivial because one is offended, and the other has no idea why. The Khajiit with their problem of grasping the idea of "property" should make a scene when the guards drag them off yet again to the city dungeon.
There's definitely a lot of room for refinement.

Like i said they talk differently.



Nords and Orcs are both supposed to be brutal warriors, but nords may drink more so there may not be much of a difference there.

Also many people who are too "proud" are snobby and annoying.

Agreed..





Limited time to improve one of the most vital aspects of the game? It has already been confirmed too..




..

Troll

Well you also have to think that this was in the past,and since the emporer had abolished slavery therefore they wouldnt be acting like they were slaves/could become them

each to there own, I prefer solid gameplay and I said before, interesting NPC I wanna care for.

Proud and reclusive is different from being snobby, reclusive being the key word. Like the other guy said..troll..

10 races is a lot and I really respect the developers commitment to keeping them all in - I think there are some technical difficulties (as opposed to design issues such as wood elves being annoying) involved in using different character models for all the races that I hope will be overcome with the new engine. Lets all wait and see we may be surprised!

whenever i have seen a highelf in TES they've always been snobby, also how am i a troll for debating.

Great post, agreed




The culture still remains. If you go to India even now, the people are still bitter over the East India Company. In Palestine, they're still bitter and the culture before the 1948 Israel fiasco remains intact. Native Americans still hold and value their traditions, and African Americans certainly have distinctive cultural habits




To keep them all in? There would be an outrage if they took one out. Your post doesn't really make sense, it talks about personality than character models..

Yeah I know, I meant that Morrowind had this general feeling that every race was different. However a big part of that, for the Khajiit/Argonians, was actually based on the whole slavery thing. They were the oppressed, that automatically gives them an interesting background. So... Morrowind "cheated". Like I said I wouldn't say that there was a huge difference between Argonians and Khajiit in the game. Their uniqueness was dependent solely on them being the enslaved race, and they had to share that spot.

It should be noted that all the cultural differences are already described in the books very well. As of yet, the games just didn't take it as far. If the Argonians and the Bosmer would act like the ones in the Decumus Scotti novels (A Dance in Fire, The Argonian Account), now that would be really interesting.

Because you are not using valid points, rather just disagreeing on everything. That's one of the points, High Elves are snobby rather than proud, reclusive, and haughty.



Yes, as further proof of lasting malice, the Argonians have invaded Morrowind.

True, to be honest im not sure on the time difference between morrowind and oblivion but if its a long time i can understand them getting over it. although i still got a small bit of the "slavery/racism" from the other races towards the beast races.

ie:

EDIT:

sorry i forgot you made the lore for TES, show me where bethesda says that THEIR highelves are "proud, and reclusive" And even so they could have changed throughout the years.

Not a troll thread very good point. And I agree. What I would say is they did make a point to show differences between races. Such as: most Argonians were hated by the people. And most high elves did kinda carry around that "High" self esteem and also Nords did tend to be running the bars and inns most times. However they could take all of this a step farther in the ways you mentioned. And I believe they will too. It probably one of the biggest things they worked and are working on.

exactly, thats what i've attempted to say...just not as well. My point is they did distinguish differences just not as well/much as they could have

Doesn't it say that exact line in their race description when your going through character selection. I can't quite remember but I'm actually pretty sure it says that. Anyone know?

http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Oblivion:Altmer

Kinda same thing if you read first few sentences. But in every race there are exception just as in reality. It says that as well.

Members of an individual race may have had the same voice, but each race had a unique male and female voice. What game were you playing?

Is this thread's premise on the verge of racism, or is that just me? You want people to act/be treated based on how they look. I can see where you're coming from, but besides looks there shouldn't be any difference between the races, except for perhaps how they walk for the best races. Basically, if you go beyond appearance you have hit a touchy subject. I distinctly remember one of my friends being outraged that humans with dark skin (blacks) were an entirely different race altogether from their lighter counterparts, and in Morrowind they were even better at running away than most races. If you are simply trolling, of which you are suspect, then please be on your way. If you are dead serious, please remember that race is a very sensitive issue and that mods are there for a reason.

so uh, yeah i was right??

I strongly disagree that the races should be walking stereotypes.



It's not just you.

Apparently it's not just you, but it's still note quite correct.
This thread is about cultures. And it is very normal that different races should have different cultures, and show that. And that's all. You can argue with racism all you want, that doesn't help the fact that many Indian immigrants in Great Britain still arrange their marriages or wear saris or turbans. Or whatever example you can think of. No real country has a multicultural society where everyone is completely assimilated. I actually think that would be a horrible thing.

I don't know, in our English class back at school, we discussed this topic for about 2 years in the context of different literature. "Heart of Darkness", "The Second Hut", "My Son the Fanatic", "If", just to name a few examples. It is a very important topic in modern society, and it is something that should definitely be done in the right way in a game that has a clash of not two, but ten different cultures, not to mention the fact that most of the races actually have at least two different cultures themselves already (Colovians/Nibeneans, Forebears/Crowns, Hlaalu/Telvanni/Ashlanders/... etc.).


I don't think the problem is calling them a different race. If you'd call them a different species, that would be a whole new level of racism (one where the racist wouldn't even acknowledge it's racism, but claim it's speciesism). But saying they're a different race is, as far as my biological knowledge goes, pretty much according to the http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human#Race_and_ethnicity.
However in TES, it's all a bit complicated, I mean which of these "races" are actually the same species? As far as I know, Argonians have a completely different background than elves and men.

But like I said, the discussion about race is moot, what's important is that these "visually different types of characters which all hail from specific parts of the world" should get their own cultures more fleshed out. Read the "Redguard" comic to learn about the culture of the Redguards, for example. There are certain key elements in the story that are all very much based on the Redguard culture; it completely would NOT work for Imperials, Bretons or Nords.

It has already been confirmed, several times, that they are focusing on making each race unique.

Your friend is really foolish then. What does he/she think "race" is? Redguards are still part of the race of men, along with Imperials, Bretons, and Nords.

But I agree with the rest of your post after reading the original thread again. The races should certainly look different (I still can't tell Imperials and Bretons apart) but every member of a certain race shouldn't behave the same way as every other member. That would be ridiculous.

Mistaking an Altmer for a Bosmer is a stretch to say the least, the height difference alone is huge.

I agree though, more distinctive features in the races is a must, bring their identity back.

Is that a joke? Hell, one voice actor did the male Argonians, male Khajiits, male Nords, and male Orcs; and the Nords and Orcs sounded exactly the same (both male and female, actually)!