Quite a lot of people dont find it interesting to play a game that has next to no challenge. New Vegas isnt as bad as F3 was for being too easy but its still far too easy.



Why are you playing New Vegas then? Characters reach their peak quite quickly and adding 5 levels to the cap wont change that. Stopping you from whining on the forums about a cap for an extra 2~ hours isnt worth dragging down gameplay even further.



Becoming more and more powerful sure but being a lot more powerful than the strongest enemies on the game is a bit too far.



Getting to the point of being able to kill anything and everything in FNV is not an achievement.



To explore it on a new character perhaps? Character developement in FNV is borked as a whole and simply upping the cap solves nothing. What should have been done, before release, is to slow down the EXP rate from everything so that it takes longer to reach the cap.

When I read replies like yours I laugh out loud. I really liked how you said the devs are professionals who know what RPG players want then go on to say you want to invest a lot of time into a character. You think 5 more levels in New Vegas will do that for you? You are pretty naive. The worst thing about raising the cap is the fact that the world doesnt even level up with the player like it did in F3 (which was still too easy). Now you are still going to be fighting the same old weaksauce opponents while being even stronger.

You also have to take in mind that most of these ppl are young teens or younger if that. Some are new to the rpg genre and don't feel or understand that role playing (video) games are about depth of your character and some of the old school players as you and I take great pride in making the game solely about leveling up your character and collecting ever piece of material, trophies, achievements, etc. Many fans think if Fallout was to fall into an massive leveling system it would ruin the game. I understand how they would like to keep the game's original concept, and not "copy" anything else, but just from Fo3 to FNV the game hit a landslide of idiocy. I think they should just keep Bethesda on the job (of Fallout) and make more dlc's for Fo3!! Lol

So, your solution is to slow down leveling, and possibly just create a new character to explore dlc? That's ridiculous. "Attention fnv fans, coming soon, new dlc. New additions include quest and a side quest. Create a new character to experience this quest, or simply use your already capped character!"

Also, even if its only 5 extra levels, its at least something to keep me going through the new content until next dlc comes out that adds a few more levels. How do you compensate for all this extra "power"? A good story is added that includes more powerful enemies, or more numerous enemies.its called creating...evolving the game. Your idea is to create a new character and learn 60 percent of the same perks. Ingenious man.

Frankly, given the nature of the game, you should be using different characters to begin with. What with the mutually exclusive questlines. Unless you don't care about the various quest options or endings. But if you don't, I don't see why you're playing an RPG to begin with, as opposed to some kind of Diabloesque hack and slash.

And the Oblivion leveling system was terrible. Oh gee, I want to level my athletics skill, so I'll bunnyhop from place to place like it was Counterstrike. Harharhar. I want to boost my healing magic skill? I'll just put some quarters on my "cast magic" key after creating a custom 1/sec 1/hp healing spell and come back after an hour or two! Harharhar.

I agree with using different characters due to the different questlines, but does that mean people who want to stick with one character and develop him further should be left out? If you don't like having a character past level 30 just start up a new one

Do really think ppl are going to take you serious with comments like "harharharhar"?? Like I really believe you're 'har-ing' yourself because you dislike putting effort into getting better at something. You know if you really wanted to get better at jumping in this realm of reality you will have to 'bunny hop' allot to actually get better at it. When most ppl say they want TES leveling system into Fallout they don't mean stat by stat. I beat you, you can't pick up an assault rifle and shoot something 300 yards without having a feel for the weapon, control breathing, squeezing the trigger not pulling, and knowing the projectile of the 5.56. That's my point by adding an Massive Leveling System or Learn As You Play into the Fallout genre. You have to take into consideration that TES is an FANTASY game. Fallout isn't, Fallout is suppose to be more of an reality feel of an nuclear apocalypse. So no, don't have skills like 'athletics' and fyi Acrobatics is improved by 'bunny hopping' Athletics is improved by just running or swimming around. Seeing how you poorly used words as 'harharhar', I can understand you didn't actually play any other TES games before Oblivion. How depth is your experience in rpg or in TES and Fallout?? What was so great about TES is that it went where no game has ever went before by adding that massive skill set. I just think you're missing the true meaning of this topic. Maybe if you actually put some heart and time to understand the series more, maybe you could have an valid point.

There is nothing wrong with the level cap going up 5 levels. Its not like Broken Steel where you had more skill points and more broken perks (Pun Intended). I mean your only going to get an extra 85 skill points max. If you don't like the level system then don't get the DLC or Roleplay a character and add certain rules in such as 5 weapons, or having 1 Endurance. Complaining about the extra 5 levels doesn't get anyone anywhere it just makes you look like a crybaby "Oh the level cap went up 5 Levels its going to be the end of the world, my characters are going to be broken".

Do you think people are going to take you seriously with your wall of phone text typing?

@Above: Keep in mind that regardless of DLC most of your play time is going to be in the Mojave Wasteland which unlike F3s Wasteland doesnt level with the player. At level 35 in FNV you are going to fighting the same old same old most of the time which is already considerably weaker than the player at level 30. Its going to be as unchallenging as F3 was.

As ive said many times already New Vegas is already way too easy. Giving the player up to 85 skill points, 2 (probably overpowered) perks and an extra 50 health wont improve the game.

I should hope so, considering that I take people seriously even when their arguments are terrible.



You're missing the point. It's a game, so your game mechanics should be designed for playability before realism. Jumping five hundred times to level your "acrobatics" stat isn't very playable. It encourages the player to undertake boring, repetitive tasks over and over in order to advance. If I wanted to do that instead of playing the game, I'd just go outside and do a couple hundred jumping jacks.



Ahem. "Har har har." I've played Every Fallout game save Brotherhood of Steel. I've played Oblivion and Morrowind, for TES games. For other RPGs, I've played the Baldur's Gate series, the Mass Effect series, Dragon Age, KoTOR 1/2, NWN 1/2, Arcanum, and several Japanese-made RPGs like Final Fantasy and the like. None of these have "raise skills through use" except for the TES games, and for good reason - it sounds great in theory, but in practice it turns out to be crap.

My point, which you blithely ignored, is that Oblivion's (and the whole TES series') system rewarded boring repetitive tasks, like the aforementioned bunny hopping or weighting your "cast magic" button with quarters and reading a book. It doesn't matter if we're talking Restoration or Energy Weapons here. Either way, the TES system is designed to reward the player for "practicing" which in reality is basically just performing a repetitive task over and over.

Which is how it is in real life, but it doesn't make for a particularly stimulating game. Unless you like toggling the sneak button and then running into a corner for an hour to level your "sneak" skill.

Level through use is one of those ideas that sounds great in theory, but the system as implemented in TES was pretty bad, and I for one wouldn't want to see it anywhere near Fallout. I like quests actually giving me rewards that aren't just money or a lame weapon. I like being able to level my [science] skill without having to spend hours playing that repetitive hacking minigame.

[quote name='Celery' date='01 December 2010 - 01:57 PM' timestamp='1291237044' post='16746350']
Do you think people are going to take you seriously with your wall of phone text typing?

@Above: Keep in mind that regardless of DLC most of your play time is going to be in the Mojave Wasteland which unlike F3s Wasteland doesnt level with the player. At level 35 in FNV you are going to fighting the same old same old most of the time which is already considerably weaker than the player at level 30. Its going to be as unchallenging as F3 was.

As ive said many times already New Vegas is already way too easy. Giving the player up to 85 skill points, 2 (probably overpowered) perks and an extra 50 health wont improve the game.
[/quotte]

Seeing how I have this awesome job and life were I'm on the road and on my blackberry. My giant wall of phone text typing is going to be what it is, like the fails of this poorly designed game. Fo3 was too easy to begin with(and the add on of Operation Anchorage where you could get the power suite of armor at the beginning of the game and the level cap to 30 with extra perks and skill point use didn't help that either), you seem to forgetNONE of the Fallout games were challenging. FNV just made it ridiculously ignorant. So if they raise the level cap why not the enemies?? Everything is programmable in the game. What will improve the game (if you can call FNV an finished product) is making sure it's playable before releasing it out.

Alright so with your massive knowledge of rpg's, how may times did you have to use limit breaks in FFVII to achieve your next one?? For all of the playable characters?? How much AP is needed to level up your materia to Master it for another to be born or to have the Ultimate Materia?? How often did you have draw magick in FFVIII on order to increase your junction?? Where in any rpg game did you not have an repetitive task to improve your character. TES used it to the max, its there in Fallout. Fallout is just an stripped tease version of what rpg is. It seems your just bluntly saying your opinion and opposing others and facts. Fallout in general could be allot better if it was more in depth with character. Fallout New Vegas needs to be complete before even being called an game. There's no excuse for it, none what's so ever. If FFXIII can be played for 20 hours nonstop FNV is no exception. Period.

Wow. I think that a few people on this forum need to take a deep breath and consider the fact that this game was not, and will not be, designed just for them.

It really is silly to get all puffed up and start flaming about it.

Keep the TES crap system away from Fallout. I want to play Fallout not TES:wasteland with guns. XD I really hope the DLC puts something in it that warrents the 5 level increase.

Not everyone loves difficulty to the point of either constant dying or coming close on most encounters. I play for the exploration, moderate difficulty in beginning to mid-game, then I like being skilled and strong enough to take those once powerful enemies down easier. Why ruin it for other gamers like me because some people rather just have increased difficulty? I still don't understand why more 'difficulty' can't be added to the game along with new perks and leveling? I thought point lookout added plenty of new challenge despite that I was at a high level.

If the gameplay was balanced better then people could use the difficulty settings to choose their desired level. Right now though all we have is..

YOU WIN!
Really very easy
Very easy
Easy
Normal

..to choose from. People who want to be challenged in FNV are being disappointed because of how easy it is regardless of settings.

New news is old news.

Just like sequels *yawn* you're boring

I'm still on my first game and I leveled out a while ago. The levels are too easy. I got some levels...bam...one after another. If it was tougher or took longer to reach each level they wouldn't need to add more levels. But since it's pretty easy I'm ok with more levels.