cos its REALISTIC.

why would a rat filled dungeon suddenly be replaced with minotaurs later on? it makes no sense..

Maybe the minotaurs ate the rats. It seems like something minotaurs would do.

He did. beth forum can't handle long enthousiastic words :0

ontopic:

Where did you get the info that there will be level locked dungeons?

What I think this will do a good job of, is keeping players from acquiring high level loot sooner than they should. That way we don't become wealthy too easily. But later in the game when we're more powerful, and enemies are too, and we actually need better loot, we'll be able to acquire it.

I dont like it....means that all dungeon loot will once again be randomly generated rather then hand placed with special items and that choosing one dungeon over another will hardly make a difference.....if items are all random, where will the suprise for exploring be?

It's not realistic.
If you go into a dungeon and kill everything in there. Then it's more likely that something else will make it's nest there.

I dont really like it, but I think it can be quite decent as well.

I just hope the leveling system otherwise is ok.

All I can see so far is the whole series going down the plug 'ole because of crap like this.

Morrowind did it right, stick to it.

It doesn't necessarily mean that, I seem to recall that the level scaling system in Fallout 3 is similar, at least, I recall hearing that when the game was in development, since I'm usually in the habit of finishing a dungeon if I enter it unless I simply can't do it at the time, therefore I haven't really experimented with this, but the system didn't prevent certain dungeons from having hand placed loot, obviously, not every item was hand placed, but that was true for Morrowind as well, and yet Morrowind had no lack of hand placed loot.

I'd say I have to wait until I've played the game before I can say how well the level scaling works for it, but at the very least, I'm sure this will be better than Oblivion's approach to level scaling.



I'd hardly say that a game which lets me kill every enemy without any trouble at all by level 20 when I can make characters who go over twice that and still have much room to advance "did it right".

No mention was made of the loot...

they were reffering to enemies. Perhaps there will be hand placed loot... not just in dungeons but in the world.. ie fin gleam in oblivion.

That's also true, not to mention they didn't say, at least from what I've heard, that ALL dungeons, or all enemies in general, are level locked, or even level scaled at all. After all, players seem to conveniently forget whenever the subject of level scaling comes up that Morrowind also had leveled enemies. The key difference was that you'd also encounter non-leveled enemies, and hand placed loot. So if you entered a dungeon at level one and there was a piece of ebony armor placed in it, you'd be able to get it, provided you could fight past the guards. As opposed to Oblivion, where the ebony armor wouldn't even exist in the world until you reached an arbitrary level where the designers decided you should be able to get it.

I would. I played that game to the death. Oblivion? not so much. At least with Morrowind I had the feeling I had grown in power and become the hero of the story.

And you killed Dagoth at level 20 with no trouble? Good job.

Instead of locking it, they should randomize it in a range of from what level you were at when you entered the first time to something even over your own current level upon re-entering. That and once its level is set upon entering, it doesn't reset until it is cleared because you shouldn't be able to wait it out and avoid a tougher fight.

This is my main issue.

However, we know so little I shouldn't be making judgements this early.

Sorry, Beth. :sadvaultboy:

That's BS and let me tell you why.

Because if I go into a dungeon filled with high level horrors and monsters and I get my ass handed to me then I deserve it but if I manage to, against all odds, make my way into one, bravely or foolishly, and am able to take on the worst of the worst, coming out of it battered, bleeding, broken and traumatized, then I deserve my reward.

It shouldn't be easy to do.

E-X-A-C-T-L-Y

:nod:

I think this might also mean that there are dungeons with a lowest level limit. I mean, if you go a dungeon wich has a level range of 23-28 and you'll enter it at level 10 it will be locked at level 23.

That's the only hope I have for this new system. It's not much but it's something.

Yea, i feel the same way. If it's like that will still might a have challenge when exploring a dungeon. If it's not, you can just enter every dungeon at lv 1 and then wait till you are lv 5, so you can explore every dungeon at lv 5. That would svck, really.

I agree, even at the beginning of the game there should be dungeons with far superior enemies but more advanced loot. Even if most dungeons are scaled to you and then locked at that level then after some time, like after 5-10 level ups the dungeons you have already visited could get a reboot in the enemies inhabiting it.

In Oblivion I liked Vilverin, it was the first dungeon I cleared after exiting the sewers and I would periodically return because I knew it would be fun battling those bandits.

I agree. If it doesn't even have that this system seems like it's going to be a downgrade from Oblivions.

If they don't have an auto-level up that means we could still beat everything at level 1, which is ridiculous. I mean the game is meant to have exploring sure, but that doesn't mean we shouldn't get our asses handed to us sometimes trying to do so.

Morrowind did it to too high of an extent. I remember stepping into a cave just outside seyda neen and getting my ass handed to me by a couple of nix hounds but once you reached level 20 as a previous poster said you become god like. This made the start (if you didn't know what you were doing) and end of the game not very playable despite the middle being incredibly playable. Therefore a compromise between MW's and OB's flawed systems is definitely not something you should write off even if it doesn't seem perfect at first sight.

Surely the low-level character has more of a NEED for better loot???

I guess we're coming at this from two completely different angles... if we didn't have level scaling, there'd be powerful enemies in the game from the start, and better loot would be worth taking massive risks to get. With level scaling, we have no big risks and no big rewards, just average everything.

I'm hoping (perhaps naively) that the scaling will be kept to a minimum.

I actually like the way Fallout NV did it. Roads were fairly safe because they were regularly patroled, and there were certain areas that you just didn't want to go at lower levels. I found plenty of unique weapons laying around and for the most part bandits didn't have rediciliously awesome weapons at higher levels. I would be VERY happy if they used a system similar to that. I always thought it was kind of stupid in Oblivion that there were so many dangers on the roads, to the point where if it was a real world people wouldn't be able to travel anywhere and trade would come to a standstill. I don't know how many times I saw a random person getting chased down a road and killed by some random creature....

Also, I have no problem with some system of not being able to use high level weapons at lower levels, and if you do you receive a large penality because you arn't skilled enough for that weapon. Similar to NV...

Playing Morrowind for the first time.

Fresh off the boat I was waylaid by a highwayman who was asking me to pay a "toll". I ignorantly refused to pay it even though I was a wet behind the ears. I got my ass kicked.

And you know what? I deserved it. I was level frickin 1. I don't know what I was thinking taking on a skilled bandit in full armor while I was still wearing my starter gear.

I want that back.

I 100% agree with u on this.Morrowind did it pretty well.