I was reading about Mankar Camoran on UESP, and I found the conversation he has with your character. He says that Lorkhan is another daedric prince!
Im looking at the facts in front of me, and it seems to me hes right. Is he? Or has Dagon manipulated him?

If Lorkhan was a Daedric prince, then what right would Mehrunes Dagon have to "liberate" it? No, he's delusional. Lorkhan isn't a Daedric prince, nor is Tamriel a Daedric realm.

The truth is fickle.

Before the creation of Mundus Lorkhan indeed lived in Oblivion. In fact Mundus is still located in Oblivion, just look up at thehttp://www.imperial-library.info/obscure_text/cosmology.shtml and you can see it. As Mankar sees it, there never was a creation event and Lorkhan was betrayed by his lieutenants, the Aedra,

It doesn't account for the moons which are said to the two halves of Lorkhans body, but in essence it it's a conspiracy theory. Every counter argument against it can be explained by invoking the conspiracy. But that's also true when there is a conspiracy.

In the end it's just another variation on the cooperation-betrayal-abandonment myth. The truth being all at the same time or a little of all.

If you go by the strict definition of "aedra" and "daedra", Lorkhan is Aedric, as his essence became part of Nirn

The relativities of it all indicate that Lorkhan isn't exactly Aedric... but he is certainly not Daedric. Mankar was a looney bastard child of one of the most hated men in Tamriel's history led along by Dagon so ol' four-arms could have another stab at annihilating Tamriel. He couldn't even remember his Daedric realms correctly.

As for conspiracy theories... any attempt to disprove the conspiracy theory is simply taken as more proof by the conspiracy theorist that there is one. Such people should be left alone if innocuous, or disposed of if not (as in Manky's case)

I think he's aedra...

This is the old "all myths are true" trope taken to its extreme. Nobody can really agree on the nature of reality in the Elder Scrolls series, and while Mankar's commentary would be considered radical by most, they would not be completely discarded. He was clearly nuts but he was also very smart, and as such his interpretation of things might have some merit.

At the very least, his ranting was far more interesting than anything anyone else said in Oblivion.

And, more importantly, he turned his theology into a fully manifested pocket of Oblivion with the Paradise -- so at the very least he FORCED his version of events somewhat through mythopoeia.

He did have a nice voice

Lorkhan is not a daedric prince... he is also technically not an aedra either... I say he's just a plot point that gave the dwemer a Valentine's Day present.

He's a deal more than that.

I personally think that lorkhan is a daedric prince. The only difference between nirn and the other deadric planes is that barrier and the only reason that is up is because of the 9 divines the aedra who are just the deadra that took part in the creation. So in essince what I believe the barriers are is just like the curse on azuras plan from mortals traveling there. so in essence it is a deadric plane. is azuras plane not a deadric plane just because nobody not liveing there can go there? and we all know the heart still lives and has been released so he isn't dead. this also answers the question where is vivic? he's off playing akatosh over in azuras realm.

I'd say he's not a daedric prince. That would say he did not have a hand in the creation of Mundus. I wouldn't call him aedric, because he is not anu aligned, despite giving a part of himself up to the creation of Mundus. Pretty much what MadCat221 said is what I'd say if I could explain it better. In the end he is just Shor, and we should kill some more elves in his name! WHOSE WITH ME!?

I'm with you! as soon as elder scrolls V is out we shall rid skyrim of all elves for good. Includeing those pesky essential ones.

Lorkhan is not a daedric prince. He is Lorkhan.

There's more than one difference between Nirn and Oblivion other than "Nirn has a barrier to protect it from Oblivion and the daedra". Nirn is a totally different entity created in a totally different manner with totally different rules and properties than the daedric realms. Lorkhan is dead, and he's not dead. His avatar has resurfaced at times, and I remember the Heart laughed at Trinimac and said Lorkhan would never die. Then again, the moons, which are supposed to be Lorkhan's body, are decaying.

Also, nobody has any idea where Vivec is.

"if a god can die then how does his heart survive? he is deadroth"

a quote from mankar camoran. Are we to say that malacaths realm isn't a deadric realm because he used to trimac? no. So why should nirn be different. And the different rules on nirn are caused by the 9 divines. They only sheild the mortals from the truth in my oppion they imprisoned him. But then again everyone has their own oppion its what makes these disscusions fun. And about the moons who says they are decaying?

You sound like Camoran now

Like I said Lorkhan is dead, and he's not dead. The different rules in Nirn are because Lorkhan created it to have them. Akatosh went one step in creating time, that was one limit. Lorkhan furthered the creation of definition and limit when he created Nirn. The aedra helped him in the creation and stayed. This is why Nirn is so different, it was created through a different process to incorporate different rules and properties; it became the mortal realm while the daedric planes are essentially immortal realms that are on a kind of infinite loop. Trinimac didn't die, not like Lorkhan at least, he was corrupted because of Boethiah's actions and became Malacath.

By this point he's just rambling. Since Shor gave his essence, thus, putting his hand into creation of Mundus. He cannot be daedric. The daedra only came to arise, in that they were Padomay aligned spirits that did not participate in the creation of Mundus. Shor, while at first fitting the bill due to his alignment towards Padomay, cannot be called daedric, because he put his essence into the creation of Mundus. As such, he is just Shor. The aedra are Anu aligned spirits that gave themselves up to creating Mundus.


The other princes do not consider him a daedric prince, nor is he technically one. But one could summise to say that once Trinimac passed through the lower intestines of Beothiah, he transformed into a Padomay aligned being. And since he did not participate in the creation of Mundus, he could be called a daedra. Also, he had the power to change, and this is evident when the aldmer that fallowed Trinimac turned into orcs

so then lorkhan is not deadric nor aedric. so that puts him in a class of his own between the two between pretty much everything life/death, aedric/deadric. so what does that make him?

That makes Shor, Shor. He doesn't really have a fancy title that I know of being called something like aedra or daedra

alright then is it possible for him to make a full return? yes his physical body is decaying from what I'm told. but his heart still lives. One thing I was thinking is the god of worms is pretty much the necromancers god and well a couple of very nice dead god peices up there.

Mannimarco's goal seems to pretty much be to tell Arkay to piss off and go home.

As for Shor's full return...it may be possible. There's speculation that with his heart "missing" and the return of Jyggy that some interesting things may happen.

would make an interesting story for elder scrolls V

on a completely unrelated side note do you think it is the god of worms what makes it possible for the flying city thing in the new book thats comeing out to be able to kill and revive people by defying arkays laws?

Sure we do. The city was raided by Daedric invaders and he was captured. That means he's most likely trapped in the Deadlands.

Nooooooo. That's a rumor. Plus, he even said in the Trial that he was going to retire into Aetherius, if I recall correctly.

That rumor is the only in-game info we have to go on. People wouldn't spread around the info that Vivec City was attacked if it didn't happen.