Magnetism Discussion

Post » Wed Mar 09, 2011 5:42 am

Dice attack rolls have nothing to do with turn based mechanics... though many TB games utilize it; it is not a requirement ~just popular.

I realize that. I'm just saying that's where I like them. I don't like how they play in live action games, like Morrowind for example.
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lolli
 
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Post » Tue Mar 08, 2011 10:22 pm

I realize that. I'm just saying that's where I like them. I don't like how they play in live action games, like Morrowind for example.

Yeah. Its an artifact of the 3d FPP. Its just awkward when you miss, but are in close enough to see the limitations of the game (collisions and clipping). In a game like that the movement is for show, but irrelevant to the events that the engine deals with. Personally, I don't mind the trade off... but these days the hardware is such that the game could roll dice [behind the scenes] and pick a corresponding animation to play. A miss or a stumble, a scratch, nick, or a good solid chest puncture or decapitation; Parries would be more believable too I'd think, as the engine would know that the strike was blocked and play the clashed weapon animations for both ~or a canned struggle and riposte.
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Jessica Stokes
 
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Post » Wed Mar 09, 2011 1:17 am

I think magnetism only slightly locks your camera at your target, so whenever it moves the camera will follow it.

It shouldn't lounge/teleport you next to the enemy if you're far away, at most take a step forward, but that's it.
Basically it shouldn't be an instant hit.
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jeremey wisor
 
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Post » Wed Mar 09, 2011 3:31 am

Simple explanation of Magnetism

-Your weapon = (-)
-Your enemy = (+)
-Your ally = (-)

Weapon (-) and enemy (+) = attract
Weapon (-) and ally (-) = repel

Since it's a slight magnetism, you can still hit your ally if you aim right at them.
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Michelle Chau
 
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Post » Wed Mar 09, 2011 2:28 am

It'd be nice if they store the "strength" value for this in the INI.

(Or better yet, make it a slider in the game settings.)
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XPidgex Jefferson
 
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Post » Wed Mar 09, 2011 3:51 am

Yeah. Its an artifact of the 3d FPP. Its just awkward when you miss, but are in close enough to see the limitations of the game (collisions and clipping). In a game like that the movement is for show, but irrelevant to the events that the engine deals with. Personally, I don't mind the trade off... but these days the hardware is such that the game could roll dice [behind the scenes] and pick a corresponding animation to play. A miss or a stumble, a scratch, nick, or a good solid chest puncture or decapitation; Parries would be more believable too I'd think, as the engine would know that the strike was blocked and play the clashed weapon animations for both ~or a canned struggle and riposte.

That I'd like.
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W E I R D
 
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Post » Wed Mar 09, 2011 5:05 am

I thought the system was just to help avoid friendly-fire issues - fighting with any allies nearby in Oblivion was a pain and a half. :(
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Lucy
 
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Post » Wed Mar 09, 2011 11:53 am

Its funny... (and ironic in a way). I would not mind a magnetic 'auto-target' that ensured a hit ~if the game was rolling attack dice and scored a high ranked hit; but I would loath an "auto-helper" for melee combat. Is this not the epitome of literal hand-holding?

Not really, no. You still have to be within range, putting you in range of an enemies attack as well, you also have to know when to block, single blows will deal more damage than before, so you can't afford to take a hit. Taking a swing with your sword is supposed to matter more in Skyrim, a swing and a miss could mean a large chunk of health, or even your death. It would be really frustrating if you constantly died or got hit because it's difficult to accurately perceive depth on a two dimensional screen and you barely missed your swing. And again, I can't tell you how many times I've hit friendly-NPCs that were helping me fight an enemy.
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Dan Scott
 
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Post » Wed Mar 09, 2011 4:58 am

I thought the system was just to help avoid friendly-fire issues - fighting with any allies nearby in Oblivion was a pain and a half. :(


Yeah. I really, really don't think it'll mean you cannot miss, just that you won't keep hacking your companions to pieces. I think the speculation on this is running away with itself a bit.

Is this not the epitome of literal hand-holding?


No. Egregious or excessive, but not literal hand-holding, unless Todd Howard is sat next to you with his hand in yours whilst you play. :P
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Iain Lamb
 
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Post » Wed Mar 09, 2011 6:45 am

unless Todd Howard is sat next to you with his hand in yours whilst you play.

If only. If only.
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April
 
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Post » Tue Mar 08, 2011 9:57 pm

No. Egregious or excessive, but not literal hand-holding, unless Todd Howard is sat next to you with his hand in yours whilst you play. :P
No... I meant the game was holding the weapon hand ~pulling it along literally, this way and that... trying to help you hit, or avoid hitting an ally.
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Kirsty Wood
 
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Post » Wed Mar 09, 2011 12:58 am

My feeling (and hope) is what has already been said: it will adjust the animation to make your attack do what it should realistically do. For instance, if you are trying to hit someone right in front of you, the sword will move a little to make sure you get the hit instead of cutting through the air.
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Steven Nicholson
 
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Post » Wed Mar 09, 2011 1:12 pm

I don't know exactly what magnetism is, but drawing inspiration from another action-RPG, I'd like a fully optional lock-on system such as what Demon's Souls has. I don't think that's what magnetism is, but what I mentioned is the type of thing I'd like to see.
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Blackdrak
 
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Post » Wed Mar 09, 2011 7:02 am

Im turning it off. If I miss, then I miss. Are we trying to take missing out of RPGs now? I agree that its good for companions, but companions need it too. Everyone knows what happens when you go into battle with an entourage.

I agree. You try and have a 5v5 battle in a hallway with axes and bows there will be friendly fire. I would rather everyone can accidentally hit anyone, it can be just as useful to me fighting many foes as it can be to them fighting me and a companion. It would be much better to keep it out and work on better combat AI, letting the players who are stupid die a lot imo.
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Harry-James Payne
 
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Post » Wed Mar 09, 2011 1:12 pm

I assume it's how they said it is. They want to avoid friendly fire in large battles so it will move slightly to not hit your ally and hit your enemy instead. I often had this problem with just a split second movement of the enemy/ally forcing my cursor to be about 1cm (on screen) too far to the right to hit the enemy, and 1cm too far to avoid hitting an ally.
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Conor Byrne
 
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Post » Wed Mar 09, 2011 4:07 am

No... I meant the game was holding the weapon hand ~pulling it along literally, this way and that... trying to help you hit, or avoid hitting an ally.


Ah, I see, and withdraw my earlier pedantry. But not my opinion that people are reading too much into this.
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Adriana Lenzo
 
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Post » Wed Mar 09, 2011 10:29 am

It worked fine in Oblivion sans the companion problem. Dont really see the need for magnetism other than the companions. Sounds like they are just dumbing the game down. Basically aim assist in a shooter. No Thanks. Dont wanna hit companions? Have a toggle that allows you to swing at friendly's or not.


"Dumbing down"... *facepalm* I SO [censored] HATE THAT EXPRESSION!

This is a RPG, not a shooter. Why do you care so much about it anyways? The game won't totally prevent you from hitting other random people, it's just there to prevent the usual problem of hitting allies when you clearly weren't aiming at them.
Besides, it might be so light that you won't even notice it
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Amie Mccubbing
 
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Post » Wed Mar 09, 2011 4:43 am

"Dumbing down"... *facepalm* I SO [censored] HATE THAT EXPRESSION!

This is a RPG, not a shooter. Why do you care so much about it anyways? The game won't totally prevent you from hitting other random people, it's just there to prevent the usual problem of hitting allies when you clearly weren't aiming at them.
Besides, it might be so light that you won't even notice it

Er, if magnetism worked how the first couple people tried to explain it, whether they were right or wrong, would be dumbing down the game. If its there just so you dont hit companions (and is in no way an aim assist), fine, but the first couple examples were terrible.
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Heather Dawson
 
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Post » Wed Mar 09, 2011 12:52 am

I have a bad feeling. will this mean that i cant swing at certain things? that like cod or gta 4 i will end up getting magically pushed into swinging at the air? and i honestly think it is a bad idea. sure it will stop you from swinging at your friends, but it's a small price to pay. it takes away from the game in my opinion.

your opinions?

ps. dont try to hate on me. it's my opinion and i will stand by it.

Keep in mind, Skyrim will not have full-blown magnetism. Todd Howard specifically said the game would have a slight magnetism, which means you still have to do most of the aiming, but it would assist you "slightly." It is likely you will barely even notice it if BGS implements it correctly. This is just an effective way to prevent friendly fire and make battles more engaging and less sporadic.
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Jimmie Allen
 
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Post » Wed Mar 09, 2011 4:40 am

I think its just to line up combat animations. If you are too far away, I believe you will still swing at air.
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Karine laverre
 
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Post » Tue Mar 08, 2011 8:50 pm

Er, if magnetism worked how the first couple people tried to explain it, whether they were right or wrong, would be dumbing down the game. If its there just so you dont hit companions (and is in no way an aim assist), fine, but the first couple examples were terrible.


It would not be dumbing down the game even if the first couple posters are guessing right. It would be making one specific part of combat a bit easier,which does not mean it is dumbed down in any way. Easier does not equal dumb. And on the easier front, this does not mean combat will be easier. The rest of the combat engine will be taking the slight magnetism into account when it is designed. Combat might be more difficult and more complex than previous elder scroll games while still having magnetism.
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Julie Serebrekoff
 
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Post » Tue Mar 08, 2011 11:47 pm

It would not be dumbing down the game even if the first couple posters are guessing right. It would be making one specific part of combat a bit easier,which does not mean it is dumbed down in any way. Easier does not equal dumb. And on the easier front, this does not mean combat will be easier. The rest of the combat engine will be taking the slight magnetism into account when it is designed. Combat might be more difficult and more complex than previous elder scroll games while still having magnetism.

It would be dumbing down the game. Auto aim hit detection=dumbed down hit detection.
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RaeAnne
 
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Post » Wed Mar 09, 2011 10:55 am

It would be dumbing down the game. Auto aim hit detection=dumbed down hit detection.


Ad hominem much?

To put it bluntly you are wrong. Easier, different, not to your liking maybe but not dumbed down.
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Yvonne Gruening
 
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Post » Wed Mar 09, 2011 2:36 am

I'd rather not have it all. But since its in, I better not notice it.

I just don't want my arrows suddenly changing ditrection. I want my self to go through trial and error.

Or just make this for NPCs.
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Mylizards Dot com
 
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Post » Wed Mar 09, 2011 5:35 am


To put it bluntly you are wrong. Easier, different, not to your liking maybe but not dumbed down.

Not really, the first couple of comments basically said: They dodge, you ignore this and magnetize forward and hit them anyway. That would be dumbed down hit detection, get over it.
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Laura Simmonds
 
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