I know, it's just that MMM is in a position to affect the vast majority of these problems because it has very pervasive scripting on them.

i like the idea of this mod already, just waiting for the bugs to be worked out before i play a new round with this mod. having characters react to comrades or anything like a near miss even would be fantastic. truly hope this can be implemented =)

Actors already react to near-misses though, at least those that hit something nearby. Bullets that just whizz by aren't detected AFAIK.

Maybe something could be done with an onDeath block containing CreateDetectionEvent. It would have to be carefully balanced though, as you don't want to screw stealthy characters completely. A low SoundLevel could let nearby actors know they should become active, without alerting the entire neighborhood.
I'm not sure exactly how the AI behaves after a CreateDetectionEvent though, so someone¹ should test it out.




¹Not me.

On a slightly different note, why the low experience count for Behemoths and Gargantuans?

I only get +62, the same as for an Overlord, but it takes a lot more ammo to knock off the Behemoths and Gargantuans.

It would have to be carefully balanced so as to not totally nerf stealth chars. Maybe if the NPC only reacts to his buddy getting killed after 5-10 seconds. Long enough for a fast moving stealther to kill them all, and would represent the shock value of seeing someone gibbed in front of you while you're not alert.

Bullets that don't impact anything are not noticed. Which is why, for long-range sniping, I make sure my target is skylit with nothing behind them for a very long way. If I miss, they don't notice as the bullet doesn't hit anything.

I am having a problem with the meshes of the creatures. Their skin changes with the environment. A dog skin will be rock , dirt , and then a sign depending on the location. My folder is set up as Fallout 3 = Data = http://forums.bethsoft.com/index.php?/topic/1045438-relz-marts-mutant-mod-10-rc-41-2/meshes = creatures & Fallout 3 = Data = textures = MMMF3

Anyone have any ideals on this ?

Installing the Fallout Mod Manager should also fix this. If not, enable it manually in FOMM.

I applied it after I made the order in FOMM , but it un-applied itself. Had to un-apply it and apply it again to get them working. Thanks. I don't know why it did that.

When I update the DLC plugins to add DLC creatures to the normal lists, I might play with how Overlords are introduced.



FaceMe edits NPCs and is incompatible with MMM (and FOOK) without a compatibility module, which currently doesn't exist. For now load FaceMe before FOOK and MMM. You will lose some of FaceMe's changes for geneirc NPCs (the type MMM deals with) while still getting its effects for unique NPCs.



I'll check it out. Also make sure your merged patch is updated or, preferably, don't use it -- only WMK requires it, among the mods I'm aware, and even then you should select only mods that interact with WMK when you make it -- and even then open it up and remove any entries that shouldn't be there -- creature and NPC lists for one. Let the FOIP modules do their job, as currently merged patches will undo FOIP changes (and FOIP modules are, quite literally, hand-built merged patches that merge what needs to be merged, and doesn't merge what shouldn't).



This is a good idea I'll look into it after the next update. Also, I'm not too familiar with all the game settings (there are a lot) but I think some of these may have an impact on how NPCs at range react to dead comrades. I'm pretty what you describe doesn't happen at close range, so it may be a simple game setting tweak. The FOOK team, Mez or Arwen may know. Even so I can still add a detection method -- but what would you like? For them to be aware something has happened and try to search the area weapons drawn, or something more evil and have them notice the player and come after you?



Actually Gargs are already scripted to give you +100 XP (in addition to the default XP) if you kill one, where killing is defined as the Garg died whilst you were involved in combat when its health was less than 25%.

If you're not getting this XP bonus let me know, might be a problem with the script.

To not render sneak killing a moot point, it'd probably be best to make enemies not auto-seek out the Player after stealth killing a comrade, and just have them go into a search.

I thought this was hard coded? In where when an enemy gets stealth killed they just shrug it off and go about their business as if nothing happened. This is what bothered me the most in this game. Although Mart if you can get it done (and I sure hope it can be moded in) that would go awsome with this mod.

The hope is that in an OnDeath script block, he can command a "Detection Event" to drop on the recently deceased, attracting the attention of the surrounding baddies.

http://geck.gamesas.com/index.php/CreateDetectionEvent

Fittingly in the "Godsend Function" category.

EDIT: Okay, played around with that function with the console, with the four raiders outside Springvale School. I hid outside the enclosed area with the collapsed roof, entered FreeCam, and clicked on a static and entered "Create DetectionEvent Player 100". Seemingly nothing happened at first, but then I could faintly hear detection reaction dialog lines. Eventually after a few more CreateDetectionEvent entries, I perturbed the four raiders' patrols enough that one ventured outside and sent my detection level into Caution mode. I then exited and reported my findings here.

Gonna go back in with a bag full of Stealth Boys and do some more experimenting.

ooo... :ahhh: Now I'm intrigued. Yes please, let us know how it goes and to further test your hypotenuse, stay a fair distance away. I noticed this problem happening most often when i'm far out of range, you know when the AI pop into screen at AI max distance settings.

Hmmm... Is there any way to increase the time that an actor will search? They seem to give up the search pretty quickly, even with a maxed out sound level. I'm in amongst them now, and my detection level goes up to Caution when I drop a detection event, even with an active stealth boy.

Ooh good work. If it's that simple I'll add it to RC 4.2/5.0, shouldn't take long to add and test.

On that note I'm thinking of actually finishing some of the work I'm doing now on the Zeta and Pitt plugins and, combined with some more work I've already done, release that as RC 5.0 this weekend. The changelog is already long enough for a version increment, and that's before I finish adding IS to the other DLCs, but will take some time and since the RC 4.2 beta has been received so well, might as well get those changes out publicly.

EDIT: heh after checking this out there's quite the potential for some advanced intelligent responses, like creating a detection event applicable to the cause of death (bullet vs explosion etc), and forcing them to look for cover. I'm off to experiment. Dang it, guess I'm not doing my RL work this arvo, I'll have this feature done by the end of today

EDIT 2: At what distance, roughly, is detection not usually occuring for you? If you can, find the limit between when they normally react, and normally don't (if after hitting them in game their pals don't react, click on them and do 'getdistance player'. Keep moving closer and hitting them until they do react). This will help set a range that I can do some more intelligent reactions.

Oh hey, see if this will work for ya.

http://geck.gamesas.com/index.php/Combat_Search






Oh you guys are making my night




For me:
Non reaction is around 6000 to 7000 by vanilla default in daylight.

With reaction is around 4000 to 5000 in daylight by vanilla default.

2 things.

1-maybe the death itself can be cause for reaction , but if not maybe a dead body would be enough? if the game makes any distinction between the two?

2-sound, i know when im stealth via stealth boy or stealth suit im kind of invisible but still visible. even though i think this is more for the player to have an idea of where they are in the room. i still bang around. making noise should be very much apart of stealth. if its possible to have enemies here me when i bump a barre, glass bottle etc. this kinda forces the stealther to be quiet as well invisible.

wondering if anything can be played with whilst folks are tinkering with these idea's =)

A quick, unrelated question, if I may. Is MMM limiting the number of corpses that are present in a cell? I was attacking the raider overpass near Megaton, intending to loot all the corpses after I'd cleared the entire place, but as I worked my way back out I realise that all but 6 corpses were gone, taking their inventory with them. I found 4 globals in MMM.esm named iRemoveExcessDead.. but before I modify them I thought I'll just ask how they work and how they should be modified. Thanks.

Great thanks.



Some of these may be better implemented from a stealth mod, but I'll see if I can get the basic desired result first.



Actually, MMM is increasing the maximum number of corpses before cleanup occurs. Vanilla is quite low, MMM extends this.

Hi this is my favourite mod in fallout 3 ^^ it isn't as good as the oblivion one yet though!

I think that death claw young are very anoying they appear everywere even at low levels (at level 3 or so they already appear) Deathclaws in vanilla didn't appear much until very high levels, even at level 20 they didn't appear every time you fast travel and I think they only appeared in some areas (north-east and south-west I think, maybe I'm wrong because I played vanilla long time ago xD) They were misterious and scary now they aren't, I remember the first time I saw one t was pretty amazing... and it's uneralistic... how'd the weaker creatures or de humans still live with so many dangerous deathclaws around lol

by the way I havent seen the nomal deathclaws yet...and I find the mmm young ones as big as the vanilla deathclaws... so they'll be very big ? xD

Robots appear everywere too, that's unrealistitic too...where do they come from? It should be REALLY rare to see a pre war robot which hasn't been destroyed yet wandering around ??

And more ants in ant dungeons would be realistic too. Well the spawns in the dungeons are fine, there're too many creatures in the exterior !
So, a no-deathclaw-young.esp or something would be nice ^^ and a lessrobotspawns.esp too I like a lot the new creatures (well not wanamingos but there's already a .esp) and everythink this mod does appart from that thanks



aaah!!! and I've seen enclave soldiers before doing the waters of life quest is that normal? They are incredibly strong (I'm using fook and xfo too) they're called "enclave epsilon soldier" or something like that not sure if it's MMM or other mod.

Sorry for my bad english

Speaking of reactions... would it be possible to replace the dead glowing one explosion with an invisible grenade PlaceAtMe'd at the spot to induce fleeing behavior in NPCs?

So, um, which global should I increment to increase the number of corpses further? All 4?

Increasing it too much will cause instabilities. MMM already has a fine-tuned optimization between stability and as much NPC activity and detritus as possible, on more GMSTs than just that one.

I just encountered a bunch of friendly Super Mutants in the GNR area, i have zones respawn activated, so there should be those, but why were they friendly? (there was one hostile too).