Does Helseth have good friends?
He became count because he was rich and influential enough to buy the position. Getting that rich and influential requires talent of some kind. Inheriting a throne or title doesn't.

I take issue with the word "elected".

That is just a typing error. I meant to say "selected".

Indarys is in the House Hlaalu and thus is in Helseth's house. So he got set up with the duchess, who had an "accident". He definately had a lot of help. He wasn't even selected for Duke, it was already his job by then.

And Helseth does have friends. He is even happily married to a Dres woman. Now Elysana, she's one I can see not having friends. She's like all the bad traits of Helseth exaggerated, with no good traits. I hope that Helseth takes the Wayrest throne one day.

Off topic. It's a fuedal society. It is very hard to rise from the lower classes. Luckily for Indarys and Martin, they started from the privledged classes, and became more privledged. But Martin was the martyr hero, and thus would not be a good emporer. You know why? He had a tendency to martyr himself. Getting yourself killed, no matter for how good of a purpose, is no way to rule and empire.

When asking the others count's and countesses about rumors you sometimes get the following response:

Not quite. I wished to tell, that Martin possessed will to struggle which has been hidden for the time being. His will had a source in his inner life.
I apologise, if my words are not exactly clear. The language barrier and various understanding of words divide us.

But the first counts of Chorrol and Anvil got their job for heroism.

That's how it works. The Liege needed some good friends in high places, so he gave Umbranox a scummy port full of pirates and Kantus an empty hilltop. Rather different situation than the cross-border politics of old Nibenean cities.

They never would have become counts if not for their deeds. And Umbranox was the perfect candidate for cleaning up Anvil. And it looks like he did a pretty good job. Mostly, at least.

I know what you mean, and I agree. Martin possessed what some call a "great soul". All we are arguing about is whether that would have made him a successful peacetime leader of a fractious Empire. Any nation's history will do for examples of charismatic war leaders who were failures as peacetime heads of state.

I'm personally hoping the Empire becomes a republic as the Elder Council realizes that they're running the show from then on. After all, the avatar of Talos did say it's time for something new.

Three words: The Elder Scrolls.
Never saw that coming, did you?

He isn't blind, though. And it is said that the Nerevarine Prophecy was not in the Elder Scrolls, yet Uriel easily found one of Nerevar's reincarnations.

He's got the whole bunch of Moth priests to read him stories in the evening. Care to give a source of the Elder Scrolls not containing the Nerevarine Prophecy? Never heard of that one.

I am very glad, that you have understood me! All sense of the given subject in tragedy of an event. The person who could become the greatest of the great has given the life to save situation, but thereby he has doomed the citizens to the subsequent sufferings coming from vague time without the governor. If Martin was not great he would not give the life without doubts.

It's been kicked around alot, and I subscribe to it, but I don't know who started it rolling. And don't forget the Amulet, you can bet your behind Uriel was curious about the Warp in the West.

:lol: I love you.

I know for a fact that it is in a book in Morrowind, mentioning two prophecies not in the Elder Scrolls, one of which being the Nerevarine Prophecy.

The Elder Council were never an elected political body nor were they "representatives" in the democratic sense of the word.
"Since the days of Pelagius II, the Elder Council had consisted of the wealthiest men and women in the Empire, and the power they wielded was conclusive."
- http://www.imperial-library.info/obbooks/brief_history_empire.shtml
They were wealthy and politically influential individuals, surely with ties to some provinces, but not as a representatives of people but more representatives of their own agendas. I find it highly unlikely that the council, who has influenced the weaker Emperors throughout history, will turn matters into the hands of the people - and risk their own position of power with it.
"The Council so enjoyed its unlimited and unrestricted freedom to promulgate laws (and generate profits) that Uriel VI was not given full license to rule until 307, when he was already 22 years old. He had been slowly assuming positions of responsibility for years, but both the Council and his mother, who enjoyed even her limited Regency, were loath to hand over the reins. By the time he came to the throne, the mechanisms of government gave him little power except for that of the imperial veto."
- http://www.imperial-library.info/obbooks/brief_history_empire.shtml

As were the Senators of ancient Rome.

Couldn't resist.



I admit that this here is the first time I've heard something like that and I'd really like to see the source. To my knowledge, from the "Where were you when the Dragon Broke", the only instance where the Elder Scrolls cannot see, are untimes, the times of a Dragon Break.

Rome became a republic because they so hated their Minoan rulers that when they managed to overthrow them they didn't want any semblance of a king. When good 'ole Julius started acting like a king and calling himself imperius the senators killed him, because their hatred of monarchy was still alive and kicking after 700 years. When the United States of America was formed nearly two millenia later, they became a republic out of their hatred for King George, and the title of 'king' (or any title for that matter) was outlawed.

Neither the people of Cyrodiil nor the Elder Council have any reason to hate the idea of a king or emperor. Hell, the last two sacrificed themselves for the good of the Empire. Maybe Bethesda will have the Empire turn into a republic just because it appeals to our sense of "right," but it wouldn't really make much sense. A single leader is a natural thing to have, and it takes a lot for people to turn away from it.

I was actually thinking of the time during the Roman Empire.

Which wasn't a republic in the first place.

Nalion's right, there's no way the Elder Council is going to change itself into a body elected by popular vote, thereby putting their positions in real jeopardy and forcing them to cater to a public they really don't care about.

Yet they were the same thing as the Elder Council during the Septim Empire. And you never know for sure what will happen in the next game. And with their newfound power, they'll be reluctant to give it up to any emperor.