Hello,

From http://wrye.ufrealms.net/, GMST Vaccine (http://wrye.ufrealms.net/GMST%20Vaccine.html / http://wrye.ufrealms.net/#NotesandUtils):


So I would say that one of the easier way to fix the "French Dagoth Ur" (apart of fixing the mod itself) would be to use GMST Vaccine (but not GMST fix which is also included in the download) with its date changed in order to have it loading at the end of the mod list (or at least after Ald Vendras and any other mods that contains those scripts).
What do you think about it? :unsure:

Bjam

It would be an easier solution, but also more prone to break other things. Some mods intentionally modify the endgame scripts (Sixth House, DGDR, probably Great House Dagoth as well), and you'd have to take care to load those after the script fix. Mods which intentionally modified the other two scripts would have to load afterwards as well. It's the difference between curing the cause and curing the symptoms ... I prefer curing the cause. But I see your point. Perhaps we could add some info about this alternative solution to the database entry.

Thanks for the link btw, I hadn't known about this bug, and I guess there are two more scripts in Ald-Vendras that I can clean now ...

Are you proposing for users to put GMST-Vaccine in their load list? I don't think it's meant to be used that way. It would have the unfortunate effect of overriding mods that intentionally change GMSTs and those scripts (as I see Psyringe has already noted).

I think the real "fix" is to edit the mods to remove those unwanted scripts.

GMST Vaccine is only meant to be used during mod creation/editing - you should never include it in the load list. That's what GMST Fix is for with the caveat that it will reset any of the modded evil 72 GMST settings made intentionally by other plugins since it is suggested that GMST Fix load last.

Including GMST Fix in the load order apposed to carefully editing the mod using GMST Vaccine is the difference between using a sledgehammer and jeweler's tools.

i put in the latest version of mlox and now it has stoped responding. is there something else i should have done other then just replace the base file in the mlox folder. if it helps i use windows vista thanks
i put the old base back in and it works perfect . so till i figure it out i guess ill have to keep going back in the thread and see how far back it goes on updates that will work for me to see if i can at least get a bit more up dated version then the one i have now.

When problems happen, can you also include in your post the contents of the small file "mlox.err"? That would help me understand some of the details. Thanks!

Could this "SignRotate Contamination" be picked up by Tes3lint?

In a sense, they are already picked up by tes3lint as they will show up as "dup-rec" (duplicate records). But I have thought about flagging them specifically, to alert the user that they happened probably from accidentally hitting the "Compile All" button in the CS.

"dup-rec" would not find the scripts in Ald-Vendras, since those have French text, so they are not identical to the originals. Flagging the 5 scripts *might* make sense to catch this, although it's probably a very rare occurence.

I guess that about 95% of occurences of these scripts will be caught by dup-rec, and about 5% will be mods that intentionally modified these scripts (which would constitute false hits for an algorithm that specifically flagged such scripts for there mere existence). The number of mods that have unintentionally *modified* versions of these scripts (like Ald-Vendras) is probably less than 1%. But that's really just guessing on my part, I may well be wrong.

i dont see a file called mlox.err so im not sure where to look is it supose to be in the mlox folder? i dont even get any kind of warning . as soon as i try to activate it it just says at the top not responding then have to close it.

Yes, if there is an mlox.err, it would be in the mlox folder. It's possible the problem you are having is due to Vista, but I do not have Vista to test on, so I'm a little unprepared to deal with it. Which version of mlox are you using? the .exe or the Python script version (mlox.py)?

If you can tell me "it works with mlox version XX and mlox-data version YY, but not mlox version PP or mlox-data version QQ, that would help. Maybe I could spot some change between those versions that would give a clue.

ok instead of just downloading a new base like i did a few other times. i went ahead and redownloaded the exe version again and completly replaced the old one and stuck in the new base and its working now. sorry for the trouble . i just didnt know that i had to keep reinstalling the full exe version. i thought that just putting the new base in when you up dated would be sufficent .

Sorry, I usually say if the application has changed too and needs to be updated But glad you got it working! I was worried I was going to have to find a Vista system to test on

Here's some more:

[Note]  Under certain conditions, NPCs spawned by MCA will vanish. This is undesirable  when you have used Vampire Embrace to turn them into your children or thrall. The  "Vampire Embrace MCA Patch" keeps MCA-spawned NPCs in the game if they have  been touched by "Vampire Embrace".MCA.esmVampire_Embrace.esp

However, there's a problem with this rule when used in the context of the others. Here's how the problem emerges:
- User has MCA, The Undead 3.0, and Vampire Embrace installed.
- mlox recommends to use the MCA version that has been made compatible with Undead 3.0 (by removing undead-related scripts)
- mlox recommends to use the compatibility patch for Vampire Embrace and MCA
- However, this patch reintroduces the scripts which refer to the undeads.

This results in error messages upon loading a savegame ("Expression Error Unable to find object "_MCA_bm_draugr" in script mca_bm_draugr." etc.). It may cause more errors while playing the game, I haven't checked.

A solution is to stop the Vampire Embrace MCA patch from reintroducing the scripts. I've also ripped out the script mca_necromancers, although this is present in MCA.esm, but the VE-MCA patch seems to reintroduce a Zombie id which causes problems. Removing the script from the patch file means that the patch's functionality will not exend to necromancers; if someone wants to have that, he'll probably have to edit the script.

Suggested mlox rule:

[Conflict]  If you are using the version of MCA 5.2 that has been made compatible with  The Undead 3.0, then "Vampire Embrace MCA Patch" will reintroduce scripts that  were removed from MCA.esm to achieve that compatibility. You can either deactivate  the patch (losing its functionality), or you can remove the following scripts from  "Vampire Embrace MCA Patch.esp": mca_bm_draugr, mca_bm_draugr_reavers,  mca_bm_skel_reavers, mca_bm_skeletons, mca_bm_wraiths, mca_necromancers,  mca_skeletons, mca_undead, mca_wraiths, mca_zombies, mca_zombies_weak.MCA.esmThe Undead.esmVampire Embrace MCA Patch.esp

Thanks! I was aware of that conflict from seeing it in my own game, but overlooked that rule for the MCA/VE Patch when it went in the rule-base.
I think I'll add a SIZE check to discriminate between the 2 versions of MCA 5.2, and see if I can get things sorted out that way.

Edit: Here's what I've come up with:

[Note] Under certain conditions, NPCs spawned by MCA will vanish. This is undesirable when you have used Vampire Embrace to turn them into your children or thrall. You might consider using the "Vampire Embrace MCA Patch" which keeps MCA-spawned NPCs in the game if they have been touched by "Vampire Embrace". See: [src="http://forums.bethsoft.com/index.php?/topic/938026-relz-mlox-a-tool-for-analyzing-and-sorting-your-load-order/http://planetelderscrolls.gamespy.com/View.php?view=Mods.Detail&id=5983"]http://planetelderscrolls.gamespy.com/View...ail&id=5983[/url][ALL [NOT Vampire Embrace MCA Patch.esp]     [SIZE !2519851 MCA.esm] ;this is NOT the MCA/Undead 3.0 compatible version     Vampire_Embrace.esp][Note] Under certain conditions, NPCs spawned by MCA will vanish. This is undesirable when you have used Vampire Embrace to turn them into your children or thrall. You might consider using the "Vampire Embrace MCA Patch" which keeps MCA-spawned NPCs in the game if they have been touched by "Vampire Embrace". However, "Vampire Embrace MCA Patch" is NOT compatible with the version of MCA 5.2 that is compatible with "The Undead 3.0", unless it is edited to remove some scripts. See: [src="http://forums.bethsoft.com/index.php?/topic/938026-relz-mlox-a-tool-for-analyzing-and-sorting-your-load-order/http://planetelderscrolls.gamespy.com/View.php?view=Mods.Detail&id=5983"]http://planetelderscrolls.gamespy.com/View...ail&id=5983[/url][ALL [NOT Vampire Embrace MCA Patch.esp]     [SIZE 2519851 MCA.esm] ;this is the MCA/Undead 3.0 compatible version     Vampire_Embrace.esp][Conflict] This version of MCA 5.2, which has been made compatible with The Undead 3.0, is incompatible with "Vampire Embrace MCA Patch" which reintroduces scripts that were removed from MCA.esm. You can either deactivate the patch (losing its functionality), or you can remove the following scripts from "Vampire Embrace MCA Patch.esp": mca_bm_draugr, mca_bm_draugr_reavers, mca_bm_skel_reavers, mca_bm_skeletons, mca_bm_wraiths, mca_necromancers, mca_skeletons, mca_undead, mca_wraiths, mca_zombies, mca_zombies_weak.[SIZE 2519851 MCA.esm] ;this is the MCA/Undead 3.0 compatible versionVampire Embrace MCA Patch.esp

I see ... I wasn't aware that mlox could parse regular expressions of this complexity. Opens new possibilities I think.

New rules look good, filtering is tighter than in the rules I suggested, which definitely is an improvement.

Regarding "The Undead" - I know that "Tombs Expanded - The Undead Addon" doesn't work with The Undead 3.0, but I didn't know why exactly, so I took a look at the data. It seems that the Tombs expanded addon uses a leveled list (_NP_MW_all) that isn't present in newer editions of "The Undead". However, "The Undead 3.0" has a list called "in_tomb_all_lev+0" which seems to fulfill the same purpose. So I think that replacing the two occurrences of "_NP_MW_all" with "in_tomb_all_lev+0", which uis easily done in the Enchanted Editor, should make Tombs Expanded - Undead addon compatible with The Undead 3.0. I'm not sure whether that's worth a note though, and in any case I'd like further confirmation since I didn't look very deep into the way how both ods function.

Just in case I have used the terminology too loosely in the past, strictly speaking, the expressions used by mlox are Boolean (logical) expressions. Whereas "regular expressions" are pattern matchers, they are for matching patterns in strings, for example.

mlox should be able to handle any number of nested Boolean expressions. for example,

[Note blah][ALL [ANY P Q R]		[ANY X [ALL Y [Not Z]]		A]

and so on to any arbitrary depth of nesting.
The "ALL" and "ANY" functions are Boolean in the sense that they represent lists of logical "ANDs" and "ORs".
So, I could have implemented mlox rules like this instead:

[Note blah][[P OR Q OR R] AND [X OR [Y AND [NOT Z]]] AND A]

But prefix operators seem a little cleaner than infix

With respect to "Tombs Expanded", I hope the updated Tombs mod by Mainframe will make the issue obsolete! But I will keep my eye on that. Maybe we'll see new versions of MCA (6.0 was in the planning this last summer) and The Undead from Neoptolemus too.

I believe there is a revised "Tombs Expanded" in the works also.

sieboldii

Other than Mainframe's "Tombs of Vvardenfell" (TOV)? It is based on Zappara's "Tombs Expanded". Maybe we are thinking of the same one.

Perhaps, if I understand your post correctly. It is supposed to be compatible with TofV according to Mainframe.

sieboldii

[edit] I did a quick check and it was "Haunted Tombs" by Ivza that was being updated and was going to be compatible with TofV.

It's actually a vanilla list. Contains skeletons, bonewalkers, and ancestral ghosts. I wouldn't be surprised if Tombs Expanded already affect it.

In short, if all the addon does is add compatibility with a leveled creature list that has been dropped since to be replaced by a modified generic list, then the addon itself is useless.

You're correct. I just checked - the list that did included the _NP_MW_all list already included in_tomb_all_lev+0 as well. So actually Tombs Expanded already *is* compatible with the Undead 3.0 and the add-on is simply obsolete. Thanks for pointing that out!

I've noticed I made a mistake in my naming of Modman's Window Lights ESPs. Here's the rewritten section:

;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;; @ModMan's Windowlights[Conflict] Choose only ONE of these plugins. "Modman_windowlights_Full_2.esp" - Lights added to Telvanni architecture "Modman_windowlights_Purist_2.esp" - Does not include Telvanni lightsModman_windowlights_Full_2.espModman_windowlights_Purist_2.esp[Note] ! Modman suggests changing your morrowind.ini so quadratic lighting is used. ! See "readme_modman_lights_2.txt"Modman_windowlights_Full_2.espModman_windowlights_Purist_2.esp

The Illuminated Windows section also mentions Modman's work, so here's the rewritten one for that:

;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;; @Illuminated Windows[Requires]Illuminated Windows.espTribunal.esm[Requires]Illuminated Windows - Bloodmoon.espTribunal.esmBloodmoon.esm; based on file dates in archive[Order]Illuminated Windows.espIlluminated Windows - Bloodmoon.esp[Note] ! Dark Angel suggests changing your morrowind.ini so quadratic lighting is used. ! See Illuminated Windows.zip/"DrkAngel readme.doc"Illuminated Windows.esp[Conflict] Illuminated Windows includes ModMan's Windowlights (Ref. Illuminated Windows.zip/"DrkAngel readme.doc")Illuminated Windows.esp[ANY Modman_windowlights_Full_2.esp     Modman_windowlights_Purist_2.esp]; The ASE Expansions are included in the Illuminated Windows archive, they're; add-ons for Atmospheric Sound Effects[Requires][ANY ASE Bloodmoon Expansion.esp     ASE Tribunal Expansion.esp][ANY AtmosphericSoundEffects-3.0.esp     AtmosphericSoundEffects-3.0-Tribunal.esp     AtmosphericSoundEffects-3.0-TBM.esp]; Not mentioned in readme but the readme does say that an ASE mod's required for ; these mods to run, so...[Order]AtmosphericSoundEffects-3.0.espAtmosphericSoundEffects-3.0-Tribunal.espAtmosphericSoundEffects-3.0-TBM.espASE Bloodmoon Expansion.espASE Tribunal Expansion.esp

Finally, a new entry about the NPC Enhanced MWSE patch, I don't think everyone knows about this:

;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;; @NPC Enhanced MWSE add-on by Charles Cooley[Note] The NPC Enhanced MWSE add-on was made primarily for those who do not run both MWE and MWSE. There is only one script in the original mod that uses MWE  functions, and the MWSE version is the same way. That script is the one that  cycles through NPCs searching for those in combat with the player. MWE handles that function a little bit better...it's a bit faster and requires less CPU  power. So if you are using MWE anyway, I don't recommend using the MWSE version.(Ref: [src="http://forums.bethsoft.com/index.php?/topic/938026-relz-mlox-a-tool-for-analyzing-and-sorting-your-load-order/http://www.gamesas.com/bgsforums/index.php?s=&showtopic=816189&view=findpost&p=11869393"]http://www.gamesas.com/bgsforums/index.ph...&p=11869393[/url] )[ALL MWE_Base.esp     npce_mwse_patch.esp]

Thanks! I'll put out a new release soon with your update in it.

So under WWoL

[Order]
Bloodmoon Landscape Overhaul 1.0.esm
BT_Whitewolf_2_0.esp
BT_WWLokpatch1.esp

or under Bloodmoon landscape overhaul

[Order]
Bloodmoon.esm
Bloodmoon Landscape Overhaul 1.0.esm
BT_Whitewolf_2_0.esm