Why not just run a check on files that lack identification and then spit out the file info into a text file? At which point it would just notify the user that unknown files had been found and to check text file for details. To stop this happening more than once, it would check the text file when checking to make sure it doesnt do the same one twice.

Thing is there are some mods I've looked at (e.g. a lot of the replacer plugins like Oriphier's) where there is absolutely nothing to include in mlox. They don't have evil GMSTs, there's no other plugins included in the download, there's no "patch" plugins etc etc. So, OK, one could create a Conflict rule for all the Umbra replacers out there but I like to think that there has to be some thought applied by the end-user. People should be aware that running two replacers for the same item are going to conflict.

If mlox was structured more like BOSS is then I could see it. The idea behind BOSS is creating a single, monolithic list of all plugins where each plugin has a single entry and that is its place in the load order list. mlox is more flexible in that a plugin can be referred to multiple times in multiple places for reasons beyond just load order. The conflict and other such rules in mlox go way beyond what BOSS offers. That, though, means greater effort is needed when creating a plugin's rules in mlox than is the case in BOSS. So, proportionately (a lot!) more mods are included in Oblivion's (and I guess Skyrim's) BOSS master lists than in mlox's rules.

I do like BOSS' approach and a combination of the two would be ideal: BOSS for a coarse sort of the plugin list with plugins grouped into general categories then a finer sort using mlox's plugin-specific rules

Don't look at me to assemble that BOSS-for-Morrowind list though. I enjoy having a potter with mlox rules now and again and that's enough for me

Well, obviously some discretion should be applied to whether there really is a need for a rule. However, you could have it output the file and then that would be that, there would be no need to do anything else. It would just help for those times that info is needed. So, it probably isnt critical, just helpful when needed.

So, based on some things http://www.gamesas.com/topic/1397841-relz-boats/page__view__findpost__p__21672610 about the current rules for abot's Boats plugin and http://www.gamesas.com/topic/1397841-relz-boats/page__view__findpost__p__21672651 in that thread I've uploaded a new set of rules. These additions had been sitting there for a little while. At the moment I seem to be spending a lot of time defending the Earth from the UFO menace so I'm not sure when I'll get round to writing some more.

Anyway, details of this update:
NEW
Berne Centurion Fix [Rellac]
BTB's Sorted New Alchemy Potions [Revan]
BTB's Unique Finery Equipment 1.5 [Revan]
Dark Town of Uvirith (Thorn's Lament Version) [Anonytroll]
Dark Town of Uvirith [Anonytroll]
Decorative Horses for PHR [Spoon Thief]
Domehome Improved Balmora 0.20 Fixed [Kiteflyer61]
Dwemer Sentinel [DoubleBrewski]
Entertainers-NoM Fix [Zobator]
Firemoth Moved [Anubis]
Fliggerty's Armor Project Rebalanced [jeclxohko]
Great House Dagoth/Darknut's Greater Dwemer Ruins Compatibility Patch [MoonAndStar]
NoM_BTB Compatibility Plugins [Stilleas]
Playable Dwemer Golem [SpiritofPower]
Prancing Ash Inn [Chaka ZG]
Sobitur Facility 5.2.1 [Dagoth Agahnim]
Unique Balmora [basswalker]
Vality's Bitter Coast Mod [Vality7]

UPDATED
Atmospheric Balmora for Vality's Balmora Addon [Enzo Dragon]
Boats [abot & Arcimaestro Antares]
Galsiah's Character Development Lean [Galsiah, Huskobar]
Magicka regeneration mods [Various]
Pegas Horse Ranch [MADMAX and Team]
Sea of Destiny [Various]
Unique Finery Replacer 3.2 [Alaisiagae]

https://code.google.com/p/mlox/downloads/list

Thanks to Raveblack for the NoM-BTB Compatibility plugins and Falc for the Boats & BTB Settings heads up.

[Edit: typos]

Thanks, Dragon32! I'll try to get back to looking at mlox rules soon.

Thanks for the update!

A few notes for Morrowind Rebirth, these mods are already included in the mod or contain similar changes.

* Most of Antares creatures are included in Rebirth (Cecila(spelling?), Gargoyle and Medusa are not)
* These mods that add a bridge in Gnisis are not needed since I've already added a brigde in about the same area.

http://planetelderscrolls.gamespy.com/View.php?view=Mods.Detail&id=8631
http://planetelderscrolls.gamespy.com/View.php?view=Mods.Detail&id=7053
http://planetelderscrolls.gamespy.com/View.php?view=Mods.Detail&id=2712

* "Adamantium Shields", by Dongle.
* "Skull Shield": http://planetelderscrolls.gamespy.com/View.php?view=Mods.Detail&id=5973
* "Repair Tools": http://planetelderscrolls.gamespy.com/View.php?view=Mods.Detail&id=9405
* "Foeburner Fix" - Same fix: http://planetelderscrolls.gamespy.com/View.php?view=Mods.Detail&id=9333

Others

* "Real wildlife 2b": Need to be loaded after Rebirth if people like to use its changes instad of Rebirth's, although the changes are very similar: http://planetelderscrolls.gamespy.com/View.php?view=Mods.Detail&id=5708
* "Animal Realism": Same as above: http://planetelderscrolls.gamespy.com/View.php?view=Mods.Detail&id=24
* "Enhanced Economics": Need to merge leveled-lists: http://morrowind.nexusmods.com/mods/42264
* "More detailed places": This mod wont work at all with Rebirth, no matter what you do with your loadorder. http://planetelderscrolls.gamespy.com/View.php?view=Mods.Detail&id=8284
* "Undead: Arise from Death": Need to merge leveled-lists: http://planetelderscrolls.gamespy.com/View.php?view=Mods.Detail&id=6777

That's it for now

You said http://www.gamesas.com/topic/1167004-relz-mlox-a-tool-for-anolyzing-and-sorting-your-load-order/page__st__150__p__20955404#entry20955404 that you had all of Arcimaestro Antares' creatures included. So, which is it?

That Foeburner fix mods thing is already listed.

I won't bother with telling people about merging levelled lists; really, that's such a basic requirement when you start running with mods.

The Real Wildlife and Animal Realism ones seem to me to be candidates for mlox_user.txt; some people may want Rebirth's changes and others may want the other mods'

I'll add the rest in one of these years

Oh, well I seem to forget things.

Regarding Antares creatures: I had all creatures included at that point, but decided not to include them in the final version. I forgot to tell you about it.

I understand your concerns about levelled lists, I'm fine with that.

JH2011 sent this report:

It sounds to me like these are valid concerns and I'll check in conflict warnings for them for the next release of the rule-base.

I didn't realize we could put rule suggestions here so here's some with Morrowind Rebirth & MGSO

MGSO installs Graphic Herbalism by ManaUser http://www.ornitocopter.net/mo_wiki/index.php?title=Credits
Rebirth conflicts and removes the herbalism scripts for about 21 items. Rebirth ads nothing in its place, just resets the item back to normal state rendering those items to the vanilla need to open and handpick items. (conflict verified via TES Plugin Conflict Detector)

Solution: Graphic Herbalism by ManaUser should be set to load after Rebirth to fix the problem

I checked in a new rule for that, and it will be in the next released update (not scheduled yet, but it won't be too long, I think, depending on whether Dragon32 has any stuff to get in, and when I can put a little more time into it).

Looking forward to it, no rush though. I've come to rely pretty heavily on mlox's sorting rules. So any errors in there would probably go mostly unnoticed by me


Oh, I have a quick question about how mlox sorts mods. How does it handle mods not in its database? Does it look at the records for those mod at all? Or do unknown mods automatically go to the end of the list? If a mod's name is changed slightly [i.e. "Area Effect Arrows.esp" >>---> "Area Effect Arrows (MD Edition).esp"] does mlox treat it differently than a completely different name?


edit: grammar

If mlox doesn't know the ordering for some plugins, it tries to keep them in the same order as they currently are. What it actually does under the covers is it looks at the initial load order, and creates "virtual order rules", which are used when it does not have any explicit order rules.

mlox can only identify plugins from their name. Any name change and mlox thinks it is a different plugin. The only exception to this is that mlox does know some general things about version number formats, so if a plugin has a version number in its name, mlox knows it is the same plugin.

Knowing this, how difficult is it to create custom rules for my merged and customized mods, such as the example listed above ("Divine Domina Complete.esp" being a merged example). I haven't delved in there yet.

Some of my recent mods may warrant a few custom rules:

White Suran 2 - MD Edition

WhiteSuran2_MD_edition.esp includes the changes from http://planetelderscrolls.gamespy.com/View.php?view=Mods.Detail&id=7155 by basswalker - do not run WhiteSuran2_MD_edition.esp and WhiteSuran2.esp at the same time
If you do not want the fixes from WhiteSuran2_MD_edition.esp, use WhiteSuran2_Interiors.esp alongside WhiteSuran2.esp by basswalker

If both Suran Underworld and WhiteSuran2_MD_edition.esp are active: Use WhiteSuran2_Suran Underworld Addon.esp to make the abandoned house in Suran use the unique textures added by White Suran 2 - MD Edition


Sorry if that is too convoluted. I'm not sure what format is best to make rule suggestions in.



edit: spelling

You can create custom rules for anything and put them in "mlox_user.txt" in the same directory as "mlox_base.txt". Adding [Order] rules to "mlox_user.txt" is really pretty simple, other rule-types may be more complex. You can load up "mlox_base.txt" in any text editor and search for rules that refer to "divine_domina". There really aren't any (known to mlox) ordering issues for a combined Divine Domina plugin, but there would be some conflicts, such as with "Sandman101's H.E.L.L.U.V.A. Armor" mod. In the case where you do know of a conflict between plugins that mlox doesn't handle, it's usually best to order those plugins so the most important one loads later. So, you could add something like this to your "mlox_user.txt":

[Order]
Some conflicting plugin.esp
My important plugin.esp

After that, whenever you tell mlox to sort your load order, your important plugin will always come after the conflicting one.

Oh, that's awesome. I never noticed the user file. I thought I'd have to always update the base text file. This will be so much more convenient. Love this john.

Oh yeah, normal users should really never touch mlox_base.txt. Any custom changes for your particular Morrowind play should go in "mlox_user.txt", and mlox will use those custom rules in preference to stuff in mlox_base.txt.

I'll take a look at the White Suran rules, your description will be easy to add to the rulebase.

Nothing planned, I did check some rules in for the various Herbalism mods (although not what Hordane reports about Rebirth, above) a couple of weeks ago but don't wait on me.

Dragon's busy killing E.T's, pew pew!

And, unfortunately, being killed by them too

Well, another unfortunate occurrence.

I removed the sub-records, other than NAME and CNDT for all the containers in my .esp. I loaded it by itself (and Bethesda's ESMs) and got the following error (which crashed a new game):

Model Load Error:  in Meshes\.Will use the default object Marker_Error.NIF.

Looks like the engine's not happy about the MODL sub-record being missing. To see how the game would handle it, I loaded my .esp after MW Animated Containers. Same result. I then loaded it before MW Animated Containers. Same result.

I didn't really have any other ideas for how to go about testing this idea, so I think it can be called debunked.

Oh well, I guess we'll have to stick to merging objects...

No problem. Then I'll probably try to put out an update within a month.

Your contribution to the mlox cause has been beyond fantastic.

Looks like you did the right sort of thing to test, and the result is that object definitions are not merged at run-time.
I guess it was to be expected.

Yeah, I didn't really expect a different outcome but it sure would have been nice

I've compensated by providing a simple "patch" which is the container data from each mod merged together. This is accompanied by instructions that if a full merged objects .esp is created then it should be used INSTEAD of the patch not in addition to it.