Hi everyone,

Im looking for loot and enemy overhauls and was wondering if anyone could help me pick one. Im after mods that replace the random and level scaled loot and enemies/dungeon encounters with mostly hand placed loot and hand placed static level enemies, although some scaled and random content like in Morrowind would be fine.

I know some popular overhauls eliminate level scaled enemies and loot, but their spawns seem to be left random. Are there any that also hand place it for that Morrowind unique dungeon feel?

For those that have not played that game, most of the loot and enemies were either random but with much more limited scaling and a bigger spread of enemy types than oblivion (no uber wolves but also no hordes of lions replacing them - instead, both low level and high level enemies would spawn later in the game), and specific to the dungeon type, or entirely hand placed (for example, a special burial site might always have a daedric shield inside and be protected by a unique high level daedra - the loot and enemy are always there, unlike vanilla Oblivion's random loot and enemies, but the loot and enemy are not level scaled and means you can try and defeat the enemy at low level and gain a powerful artifact, or come back at a later level)

That is the experience im looking for but in Oblivion. Am i in luck?

Read this Overhaul Comparsion

http://www.gamesas.com/index.php?/topic/820948-scaling-overhaul-comparison/

There is Mod Psychics thread for requests like this, for future reference. However, it sounds like you want Francesco's Items Creatures mod. When you decide, there are links to all of the big overhauls (except for Tamriel Immersion Experience) here: http://sites.google.com/site/oblivionpoinfo/downloadmods.

Read the http://www.gamesas.com/bgsforums/index.php?showtopic=820948&hl by bg2408 to learn about their differences. I also have a list of http://sites.google.com/site/oblivionpoinfo/lists/readmes in which you can find the ReadMes for most of them. I suggest reading through Frans (and there is plenty to read.)

The closest mod that you will get, as far as I know, is Oscuro's Oblivion Overhaul. It uses a combination of limited levelling and static placement. A bandit boss will be 5 levels above the player, for example, but only up to a maximum of 25 and never beneath level 12. Loot in containers is randomized, but there are also *many* hand-placed objects... Examples being high-end armours, potions, jewelry, etc - often in difficult-to-find places. It also rebalances existing gear and enemies, as well as adding many new ones.

It's not exactly like Morrowind, but thusfar it's the closest that I've seen made. Give it a try!

Many thanks guys, my apologies to posting in the wrong manner, its been a while since ive been on these forums.

Thanks for the links, looks like ive got some reading to do! Given the work involved in this i didnt really expect mods of this sort, but it seems theres a lot more options than i expected!

Thanks modders!

Actually, I agree with the OOO nomination. I just cleared up a misconception I had about Fran. I love OOO. It is a wonderful mod, and all of the downloads you need to get the latest version are on that first page I linked. Fran does not change the scaling system for enemies (as I had previously thought.)

I definitely seem to be on the 'place centric' end of the scale according to that very useful guide, and OOO does seem to fit the bill best. The idea of a geography of enemies, loot and challenges definitely appeals to me. Looks like OOO fits the bill

Thanks for this very quick answer to my question guys!

Sure. Are you using OBMM to install mods?

Edit: I guess that does not really change the following: If you are going to use OOO FULL (recommended) install the 1.34b5 update on top of 1.33 Complete, else install the LITE update on top of 1.33 Complete. When you install OOO 1.33 Complete, do not install the bundled version of Harvest Flora. The latest version is available at TESNexus and includes a serious bug fix. The bundled version of Living Economy is not the latest version (available at TESNexus), but it is fine to use. If you are not using OBMM and use full, do not use any of the optional add-ons, those in the optional add-ons subfolder. Lastly, watch out with OOO-Waterfish (which comes in OOO 1.34b5) because it hits the CPU pretty hard. The same goes for the OOO 1.33 Waterweeds plugin (which probably hits the GPU more than the other.)

Thanks, invaluable advice. I was going to go for simplicity but i guess ill use OBMM now to customise what parts im running

OBMM is this simplest way to go for now, but I suggest switching to BAIN when you are feeling more comfortable (and before you have 100 OMODs to convert.) http://sites.google.com/site/oblivionpoinfo/index is (becoming) a complete guide to modded Oblivion, and it does have a complete guide for installing modded Oblivion with BAIN, Wrye Bash's installer.

Wrye Bash does sound desirable - I will have a compare and choose one of the two.

Thanks for another heads-up!

I just finished the BAIN version of the MMM+OOO install guide, but you could follow its instructions to install just OOO as well. I am working on the OBMM portion now. You can find the guide in the "Walkthroughs" section.

You may also want http://www.elricm.com/nuke/html/modules.php?op=modload&name=Downloads&file=index&req=viewdownloaddetails&lid=3372 It's not an overhaul though, but places a number of static encounters in the game world to add some spice.

Can I use that plugin along with OOO?

I think they shouldnt clash, since that mod seems to add new encounters

By PetrusOctavianus's comment, I would assume that to be the case.

Just a little update.

So i went ahead and installed OBMM and followed the instructions in the (very) long manual for OOO (read the whole thing too, got a fishy stick), and got the mod working. I wont say its 'easy', because in actuality the process is long and complex with many pitfalls, including the load order. However the manual is very thorough and the process is not 'hard' - follow the instructions and you will succeed. I installed OOO full 133 over a patched oblivion with knights of the nine and associated DLC's, along with the 134 beta patch and the 'unscaled loot and encounters' addon mentioned above as well.

With the thorough instructions in the OOO manual and an understanding of how mods work and what load order will do (and therefore what it should look like) i got through just fine. I have made my own mods and this is not a testingly difficult process (that would be trying to use BAIN to get FCOM OOO and other mods working concurrently - '50 easy steps' guide is very thorough, but its still far from easy) but it is long and tedious. Compared to Morrowind it is dissapointing that we have to go to these lengths to get a decent sequel. Nonetheless, it is extremely evident that the modders have done everything and more to remedy Oblivion's shortcomings. I am extremely impressed with the level of detail and dedication of both the modders who created these extremely ambitious overhauls, but also the invaluable advice ventured by the writers of the many guides, particularly TESIV: POSItive, which try and make a rather long and unpleasant process as palpable as possible.

It is still a longwinded process - the only problem i had was OBMM becoming unresponsive when i tried to query whether there were two OOO esp's active (I thought the 'lite' esp might have been active as well) and after i forced it to close with the task manager, OOO showed up as inactive when i restarted OBMM (despite all its components being installed). The fix was simple - reactivate it and overwrite everything - but unfortunately that led to about 10 000 popups of 'do you wish to overwrite this file?' That made me appreciate both the immense work that went into this project and the great utility of a 'yes to all' button. It took about 5 minutes to get through the popups even with my enter key held down.

Despite it all, i got the mod installed within a reasonable timeframe and it was very much worth it. Finally i can enjoy a challenging game as well as some excellent additions and added depth. Dungeons, locations and loot are interesting now, not generic. The very moment i got out of the sewers (started a new game) i tried both the elven ruins nearby (my mage/sneak/fighter cross got killed by one clearly superior enemy, but surprisingly it was not overwhelming - had i used my character to the full, including my excellent alchemy and poisons and lover's kiss to paralyze him, i would likely have won) and randomly shot at some flitting shadowy creature several hundred meters away. The latter engagement resulted in some kind of invisible imp flying over to me, over-encumbering me (which hit me because spells actually move at a decent speed now) and then proceeding to beat the crap out of me. I was doing it for fun, but needless to say i was pleasantly surprised and impressed at the added challenge.


So thankyou everyone, for finally making this a game worth playing!

First - if anything I suggest you take to heart at all - upgrade OOO to 1.34beta5 - do that! Really really. The full 1.34beta5 version is the one supported here. What will happen is that you will report a problem and be told to upgrade anyway.

Now if you want basic and, hopefully, thorough instructions on BAIN then read the first couple of long posts I made http://www.gamesas.com/index.php?/topic/1084204-bain-mod-installation-projects/. I know I will get guff from people here for recommending that, but it really is a step up from OBMM and if you are familiar with Morrowind and Wrye Mash there is not that great a learning curve.

Now expect more rational beings to contradict me.

I probably didnt make it entirely clear, but i did upgrade to OOO 1.34 beta 5 already.

BAIN and the more advanced combinations is something i will look into in the future, but at the moment i just want to play a 'fixed' oblivion. In Morrowind i mostly made my own mods to suit myself and some graphic updates, but never felt the need for any 'overhauls' or 'corrections' of content and so never used Wrye Bash. I was never the sort of player that felt the need for dozens of mods or had played so often that they had exhausted the default content and needed more. it It is unfortunate that this is necessary in Oblivion, but my motivation here is not the best possible combination of mods which BAIN and Wrye Bash can deliver. I merely wish to play an Oblivion which imho has its main shortcomings fixed and more closely resembles Morrowind in terms of variety of content and enemies.

Besides, i dont really know what to expect yet. After ive played around with OOO, I may want more and look into other combinations. More likely i will have started to replay Morrowind or started waiting for TES V though

BAIN is not that complicated. You can read the basic portions of his post, along with my BAIN instructions for MMM to do it pretty easily. Also, when you get prompted with an override installing an OMOD when you know you want to overwrite everything, use shift+click (or alt+click ?) as you answer "yes."

Thanks for the shift click tip. However, now that my game is successfully working i dont feel i need to use BAIN at this point.

One thing i have come to wonder however - i have done a good bit of fighting and wandering, getting up to Kvatch after killing quite a few bandits, wildlife and making a good bit of gold. However, im still level 1 a good 5 hours. I know the levelling is slowed in OOO, and was much slower in the original OOO mod, but isnt this a bit much? Im not even close to levelling, with 2/10 of the way. At this rate i will have decent mid-range equipment well before i reach level 2 (i can already afford bits and pieces of mithril).

Just how many hours did Oscuro envisage as being 'enough time to play oblivion'? Is his levelling geared toward a 1000 hour game? If levelling up gets even slower as you progress, like in Morrowind, i really have to wonder what was running through his head.

That is hard to answer.

Slow leveling was implemented by many different modders to address the issue with suddenly being level 20 and only completing about 20% of the content - which would mean no new challenges.

Overhauls were created to create more challenges and at higher levels while leveling and skill mods were created to slow the leveling.

My current character is level 18 has about 200 hours play time and for me that is has been across several months. The leveling rate I chose is 5x slower the reason being that I play with many quest mods that are themselves long so I chose that leveling rate to give the character time to do them and there still to be a challenge. He has many levels yet to go.

So I would balance the question with how much content there is versus how much challenge you want. You may be familiar with the scaling overhaul comparison but then there is also the leveling section of http://www.gamesas.com/index.php?/topic/790175-bgs-list-of-base-mods/ by the same author.

There is a mod called http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=14304 that allows you to change the rate of all skill gain with minute control - it does require OBSE though. There are others that do not but also offer less control.

I'm not sure of the leveling rate of full OOO is adjustable.

OOO 1.33 comes with bundled modules for changing the leveling rate. You really do not have the same control, but there are plenty of flat-out rate changers that work fine with OOO. I have not heard of compatibility problems with those.

I can certainly change the levelling rate through OOO's plugin choices, but i dont know whether i should

Let me rephrase that: leveling seems slow to me and looks like it will be a problem - I dont plan to spend any more than 100-200 hours on Oblivion again (thats about all of my playtime in Morrowind) so a levelling structured for hard core 1000 hour marathoners is not desirable; but it is as recommended by oscuro and i dont know the rationale behind that well enough to judge whether it will be a problem. Hence i ask what others think and look at what level they might be after some length of time. At the current rate, with a good 5 hours played, it doesnt look like i will hit even level 20 by 200 hours (and i dont expect to play that long anyway).

I seem to have designed a character that is a general alrounder but slow leveller (which stopped levelling too fast in oblivion). However, i now seem stuck in a rut.

Perhaps i will just have to wait and see

The slow leveling is recommended so that you do not miss parts of the mod. Things will disappear as you advance, you know? If you really want to push through quickly, do not bother adding a slow leveling mod at all. It is not about whether or not you "should." Slow leveling mods are compatible with OOO, so there are no problems from a technical perspective...

Hey there!,



I though I could share my personal experience: the first time I played through OOO, I wasn't fond of slow leveling at that time, so I used the option of Vanilla (or Stock) level rates, and took me about ~400 hs to get to level 50 with that char, more or less... so, I think, you should be OK to your expectations, if you select the Stock level rates. I bet you'll get to level ~20 in around 150 hs or so...

But it would depend mainly on the Majors you selected, some of the skills progress too much slower than others...

That was the first time I played, though... Now, after the years of tries and tests, I would suggest you to take some time and take a look to Progress (the mod suggested by Psymon above), and tune it to your liking... It's configurability is exceptional, and it comes with some setups already bundled, some of them similar to the OOO standard setup or more close to the vanilla one... so you could start with one of those, and tweak all you want...

Hope this helps somewhat,

Best regards,
leandro