I don't really mind how its set up now although with so few random buildings around now it really cuts down the effectiveness of perks like scronger and fortune finder since theres not as many containers around to to loot.

Also the way the enemies are now makes it feel a bit more dangerous since you will rarely see any less then 3 enemies at a time in a certain area, where in FO3 you'd rarely see anymore then 2 randomly wandering around and now that they travel in packs it can make even little bark scorpions dangerous when you kill one and alert the 5 that are with it.

Well i have played for 35 hours and still have barely scratched the surface. I just got the explorer perk and there is still so much for me to explore. I have seen maybe 30% of everything there is to see. So i would have to disagree. I am very happy with the layout of the map.

What did you expect, though? Bethesda is the only Bethesda, which is a sad thing for me. Too few people can do what they do, and I believe Bethesda is the only game company that can properly make a sandbox.

That's an argument older than most folks posting here. FO:NV is a better RPG for folks who like stories, but to me, the world is lacking content for explorers. I've just made it to NV, and along the way i have been channeled like I would be playing a triptic game like Dungeon Siege: Here's the road, and hey, here's a strip of land between the road and the impassible mountains. Oh, and here is a clump of mobs to kill, and here is a gas station, and here is an empty shack.

I'm hoping that the game opens up now, and that i can go cross country more than I have been able to do, and that it's worth going cross country. I'd like to set the main quest aside and go explore.

I never expected them to match Bethesda's skill, and I had worries that they wouldn't for some time before getting the game. But I don't know, I guess I was hoping they'd be just a little better at it. It's a shame too because Obsidian really, really improved on what Bethesda did with Fallout 3, but they failed at what is my single most important requirement for a good Bethesda game. They were able to copy and drastically improve everything except the most important thing to me.

New Vegas will probably keep me busy for around 100 hours, which is how long I, being 20 hours in, expect it to take me to finish exploring and finish my remaining quests. But due to the non-Bethesda world, I'll have very little motivation to replay it much after that. On the bright side, I still have hundreds of hours worth of exploring and questing to do in Morrowind, so I'll just go back to that after New Vegas.

:sadvaultboy:

The problem with Fallout 3 is so much was superficial (and Oblivion was even worse on this front). Locations, characters, events.
I do think it's valid to say, Mojave is more spacious due to being a desert. Remember the Capitol Wasteland was not a desert before the bombs.

What I'm really enjoying about Mojave is that everything is well spaced out. I built a sniper/hunter character with stealth and survival. I stray off the beaten path keeping an eye out for enemies that I carefully pick off with my hunting rifle. Traveling from one place to another, I feel like a real traveler making the long trek on foot between wasteland towns.

I agree with the improvements and the lack of a personal favorite part, pretty much exactly as you put it.

The Mojave Wasteland might have fewer areas, but most of its areas make sense are have some sort of significance about them. There aren't anywhere near as many random dungeons in New Vegas, and that's a good thing in my opinion. I don't care much for Beth's much-vaunted ability to make 'stories with props but no dialogue' since said stories tend to be of the 'a couple hid here and killed themselves via morphine injection after the bombs went off and that's the entirety of the story' variety - in other words, if you put them into words the story is roughly one sentence long. Completely superficial and boring. Besides, running around subways killing ghouls was one of the worst parts of FO3.

If I discover a location I want it to be something that actually has some meaning in the world and the game, not just a random dungeon that was thrown in there in order to pad the location count like 90% of the areas in F3 and preferably involved in a quest somewhere along the line or, maybe, with some kind of special loot.

Really? I found it packed. To be honest, I'm still trying to get rid of the claustrophobia, since I'm used to the dead and empty Capital Wasteland. Hell, take the 'Explorer' perk on New Vegas, then try and tell me the Mojave is emptier than the CW.

FO3 does have more random encounters and monster encampments. However, when you think about it, a lot of the random encounters in FO3 made no sense. Who built all those wandering robots and set them loose? Where did theose large forces of Super Mutants come from and why haven't they overrun the tiny little towns around the area? Why are there people wandering around without any protection? Why is there so much loot left in the wasteland after almost 200 years?

I actually agree with you and this is exactly the way I feel. Perhaps I should have said that FONV is better as a story driven RPG but not as a free roam RPG.

I think some of that is the setting. Nearly everyone who plays Fallout 3 is familiar with Washington DC to some extent or another. Maybe even familiar with the surrounding area like the Pentagon, Adams AFB, etc. Plus you have the huge downtown metro area with the very memorable subway tunnels and all the historical buildings (Capitol, White House, Washington Monument, Jefferson and Lincoln memorials). Not to mention Rivet City and even the rust pile of a starter area with the airplane engine above the entrance.

Having personally spent time in DC, it was a very surreal and somewhat disturbing experience to wander around the ruins of DC. There's a lot less history (historical and personal) with Vegas, so I don't feel the same attachment (yet).

I disagree the wasteland is much better then it was in fallout 3. They're a lot of things I like about the mojave wasteland, Its much harder then it was in FO3, you can't just head straight north to New Vegas like in Fallout 3 when you can head straight to the DC ruins. They're more people out in the wasteland I'm always running into a patrol of Legion or NCR members. I don't think its empty like it was in fallout 3

I really love this, I've noticed the npcs react better, they run away if they're getting whooped, so on, it's great! one of my favorite things that's happened so far is:

Didn't read the thread, but i just wanted to say that deserts, in general, are pretty empty. If you've ever driven through that area...the really is nothing there to begin with. Add nuclear war on top of that....and, well...viola.

Amazing how desolate it feels when you're driving out there through the desert at night.

I get enemies all the time. Caeser's legion caught me in the perfect area. No defensible area, and they had the high ground. And it isn't scripted, as far as I can tell. It was awesome.

Wasteland seems fine to me. Seeing alot. Some places lack loot, but whatever. I just go Fiend killin.

Game is amazing to me so far. Couple freezes, but the rest of the game is great. I'm in love with it.

I'm just quoting this to back-up my original point.

I'm not saying that the Mojave Wasteland lacks in content or depth, but I can literally walk for 15 minutes and not come across anything interesting (which is strange, because by using console commands to look at all the map markers, they all seem packed together). Perhaps it's Obsidian's placement of locations/enemies that bugs me. A good portion of the map is inaccessible/completely empty (see for yourself, tmm 1 in the console, look at the far North, East and West), and what few enemies I do come across are easy and usually by them self (Radscorpians mostly).

...or perhaps my game's bugged and some new locations aren't registering. xD

Oh, and the bold bit of the quote is something I definitely agree with.

EDIT:

Read a few posts about how deserts are generally empty. Just to clarify, I'm aware of that. xD

Bethesda makes adventure games. Obsidian makes RPGs.

i've never once felt a drive to head far away from the road (except seeing the Yangtze Memorial once and wanting to go check it out), because there's enough interesting areas along the roads. settlements in New Vegas are huge and each has quite a lot of people to talk to and stuff to do in them, whereas in Fallout 3 most settlements were like four buildings at most and there was nothing to do but move between them and explore ruins.

i personally really like the way the Mojave is designed. it feels like a desert, but at the same it feels very much alive.

I was level 4, and was making my way to the Mojave Outpost from Primm. I figured i would take a shortcut and get off of the road, where I had not seen any enemies. I was jumped by 6 giant radscorpions.... i have not left the safety of the road since.

Im waiting for the FO3 mod to crossover to the new vegas


they have a mod where it spawns more travelers

http://www.fallout3nexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=6044


Marty Mutant Mod should make an appearance on new vegas pretty soon. it made it more playable.

Defiantly seems jam packed with good things compared to the Capital Wasteland.

Defiantly seems jam packed

Defiantly

I'm sorry, but that is the most amusing typo ever. Is it defiant to Fallout 3? To the OP?
I don't know...

Don't question it man...

My first few hours playing the game I agreed with OP. But having been from the very north to the very south of the map and most of the east and some of the west I can say that if the Mojave Wasteland is smaller than the Capital Wasteland, it is not that much smaller.

And as for the emptiness; I don't feel it at all. I'm coming across traveling merchants, abandoned shacks and camps (Fisherman's Pride, Cap Counterfeiting, Sydney Prospecting Camp, Lucky Jim Mine House, and more), and lots of encounters. If you stay to the roads you're only gonna get hit by raiders and the occasional mob that has ventured near the street. Also the layout of the whole Vegas metropolitan area is masterfully done. The Fiends surround vegas (except to the east but shops are there). There is North Vegas Square and the sewers, which I haven't fully explored but seem pretty big. And I love, love, Freeside and the Strip. First time I got to Freeside and had to work my way into the Strip was very fun.

And the desert is no exception. Lots of towns and people to talk to. I currently have like 12 open quests in FO:NV. Which I got by aimlessly exploring. When I would play FO3 I usually had no more than 5 open quests at a time by doing the same thing (yes, this point could be entirely circumstantial). Also in NV I feel that there are truly dangerous places that I should not go at my current level. I'm level 14 and I still can't take on swarms of cazadores with any ease (playing Very Hard:hardcoe), but in Fallout 3 by the time I was level 10 I felt I could kill anything as long as I played smart.

The game isn't Fallout 3. Fallout 3 was a very good attempt at converting Fallout to Bethesda's style but I always felt it was missing that special touch. I can only agree that the Capital Wasteland is insignificantly better than the Mojave Wasteland but NV blows FO3 out of the water overall (just gotta get a patch or whatever to stop the freezing, I've begun saving my game every 15 minutes so I don't lose important progress).