In Oblivion and MW you couldn't be horrible really, I'd like more options to make bad decisions and be an evil character or antihero

This topic is NOT about introducing a Fallout style karma system in TES

What sort of bad decisions would you like to be able to make?

I always thought that just slaughtering everyone you came across was pretty evil...

[Edit: Oh, by this do you mean having the choice to actively work against the forces of good? If so, I think that would make the main quest line kind of difficult...]

Right,... In TES, there aren't Karma...

It didn't have any ramifications though, other than a bounty and infamy, even the Dark Brotherhood questline wasn't really 'evil' as most of the targets aren't good themselves


That wasn't what I was talking about, there are no quests to bbe evil, you are always a hero helping some family or some such, you never get a chance to crush dreams etc. (other than Daedric quests)

I hate the term stupid evil as I tend to like playing like that and thinking of reason why my character would do so.
But on the most part that's what you were left with in Oblivion.
The infamy system seemed if trying to be used as an intelligent evil role, as slightly flawed.
The thieves tended not to be evil, but performing their quests made you so.
The dark brotherhood and one or two other quest in the main none SI Oblivion were the only ones.

I'd like to see more depth of options.
I'd like to play stupid evil but in a smart way, not just hacking away at civilians for no reason.
I'd however like to play more mercenary, a neutral evil style.
Then of course the simple by the book clever / lawful evil.
Where you can twist your words and play really smart to gain advantages while hurting those around you.

So yes I agree with you JagarTharn12.

I understand what he is saying. I hope you don't mind, I will rephrase it for those of lesser levels of comprehension (No offense, some people just arent that deep, Im not saying you are stupid)


He wants an evil option in the Mainquest, and sidequests. He doesn't want to be the hero ALL the time. Oblivion's Dark Brotherhood was a start, but you could be a ruthless killer who ends lives just for gold. But you still save the world? You STILL help everyone you talk to?

Sheesh.

I think we'll see a much more indepth "evil" side of things in this game, even look at the difference from Fallout 3 to New Vegas, all of a sudden it went from having no choice to help the Enclave to being able to side with numerous different factions. I know those games aren't TES games but they're from Bethesda (well NV developed by Obsidian) but I think they may take some lessons from that release. At least I hope, eventhough I find myself incapable of playing an evil character.

Killing everyone you see is more psychotic than evil. I do not get why it gets pictured as the 'ultimate' form of evil. If you find a way to gain control over everyone and cause mass suffering.... that might be ultimate evil and it does not require killing anyone.

Skyrim needs a hero, not an antihero everybody knows that!!!

If you want to be an evil bastard, then be one. Kill a beggar while his sleeping, steel stuff and kill people. Watch silently while a necromancer kills a mage-guild apprentise. However it would add a whole new level of funn if we could poision a well, sett fire onto a house and basicly ask anyone with requests to please go [censored] themselfs. Sabotage an village' economy so they get mad and put a bounty on your head would be cool.

I hope the option of being an evil bastard is implemented into the game. But watch the danger sign, not a soul likes the Black or White & Evil or Good, infact it turns out we all like some middleground every now and then.

Being good is no fun without the presence of 'evil' options.

I have to agree, sometimes the temptation and even quasi-evil options can really get you into the game. As much as I hate them I really like the options that you don't really know the outcome of. You may think you're doing good but you have to do a little evil to accomplish it.

I'd like a Bandit faction where you get quests to rob caravans loaded with gold

I agree I want to be able to Unlock certain quests that depend on how good or bad you are. This would definitely make me want to play the game through again after I beat it the first time. POWER TO KARMA!!!!!

Agreed. I would not be against more evil choices for the evil character. There needs to be something at the opposite end of the scale to balance things out and give more opportunity.

But just to be nit-picky I don't think "karma" is the word you're looking for. "Karma" indicates Fallout's style. You mean simply "reputation" Karma is a system that even if no one sees you committing an act an invisible/make-believe force punishes you. I believe in the reputation system where only foul deeds that are seen by a person is punishable. Just being nit-picky on the wording you used, I understand what you meant.

if it makes since, like do evil choice for money, or better rewards. Maybe more illegal options like blackmailing counts or stealing money from the chapel or something

I see no reason (sadly) to expect anything new on this front, aside from the same old "Good = do good deeds, Evil = do same deeds as do-gooder but be a dike about it" gameplay and quests.

I'd certainly love to be surprised and wrong, make no mistake.

good it is not, because i hated fallout karma system, if we will have any way to look like evil, let the npcs say it to us, they should run in fear, or simple walk way with a "uh, this is a big badass evil one! i better move way fast!!" espression :flame:

Everything has a solution... if it screws up the main quest simply make alternate endings and some way around it if a character important to the main quest dies (altho i think the way around it if some character dies has already been semi-dealt with according to rumors about radiant AI where his son might just take his place)

and what if i'm just a psychopath that gets a kick from tasting NPC blood? like a distant descendant of Hircine maybe? or if i'm just a damned vampire what will i do? not kill everyone and be a nice little vampire then get my ass bit when i turn my back to someone? no thanks :toughninja:

I agree, a mad dog could just kill everyone if given the opportunity. Serfs could be evil if this game has serfdom.

that would work great with the dynamic quests based on who you have talked to and the things you've done so if you were more evil, strangers would come up to you and contract you to kill someone or make it seem like they killed someone sending them to jail and if you do good things though out the game a helpless mother whos child has been kidnaped or run off into a cave would ask you to save her children and being good = people praising you as you walk past but not as overdid in fable 2 and vise versa if you were evil. e.g. people calling you a [censored]

Yah, I'd like to see more... meaningful decisions. Like most of you have already said, the "kill everything in sight, I have bloodlust" thing only goes so far; it has no depth, no meaning other than a bounty, and that guards may or may not chase you. You're basically just a one man(or lady) army, against the world. No one except guards treat you differently. And you can't rule anything, or have followers or minions or be a part of a faction that does bad things, or affect the world in anyway other than decreasing some of the NPC population. :ahhh:

But like I said in another thread, I probably wouldn't explore these options very much. I'm always the good guy. Or a neutral kind of anti-hero/wanderer :poke: .

I don't think that there will be anything that will effect the main quest, but i would like to see that implemented in the guilds and other groups

Well I must admit that among it's many glitches, New Vegas certainly did a good job about having an EXTREMELY flexible storyline and a decent moral system and effects there of.

But I'd like to see something original more than anything else.

If I had to choose, I'd like the good or bad non-linear storyline of New Vegas combined with some sort of Red Dead moral system. Except make them both a lot cooler and 1,000,000,000 times better.

Skyrim 11/11/11

Huzza! :celebration:

actualy another idea came to mind like if you were know to be bad guards would take extra attention to you making it hard to do a evil deed and if your bad enough they would trail if your walking alone at night. and vise versa if you good like they wouldn't notice you as much making it easy like a reduced area of noticing a crime and if your good enough they would let you off for a minor crime you commit by keeping it quite but the opinion of you for that guard lowers in your "goodness" but just a idea

Maybe this is a reason Radiant AI has been introduced. perhaps finally our reputation will have an actual influence on differing quests. if we are good, we will open up a certain line of quests, but if we are evil, that line of quests is closed, but a different line of quests will be opened up. I would absolutely love that, would finally give me a reason to play a truly evil character beyond just my own standard roleplaying.

An example of this would be: You're reputation is that of a champion of good, virtually on par with a paladin. Because of that, you are given a quest by a church/order of paladins/some other holy institution to go off and find their holy grail. Doing so will reward you with a new ability to restore health or cure disease on self. Now, if you find this as an evil character, watch out, they will automatically assume you stole it and will attack you on sight(also, they'll never think of asking a ne'er do well to help them out). On the other hand, because you're such a paragon of virtue, a crimelord of the area will not approach you and ask you to rob an approaching caravan of all it's goods and possibly murder a guardsman or two of said caravan in order to send a message to his competition. Of course, said crimelord would jump at the opportunity to hire a true blackguard of villainy with a reputation that makes murderers blood freeze in their veins. Completing his quest would get you lowered prices in all shops owned by him, though it might also put you on the bad side of the opposing crimelord, but hey, who cares, you'll just go off the bastard cuz thats just who you are.

That is the kind of stuff I would like to see. Varying pathways opened and closed due to your reputation. It would increase replayability because it would be impossible to receive all quests in one playthrough(because once you get far enough one way or another reputation wise, you can either never swing back far enough to get a vile enough reputation, OR it would automatically close those other pathways once you reached a certain path). As long as they put enough of these in, it would certainly be worth it to a good many players to go through and play both a good and evil character so they can see the various quests/storylines for each side.