Blah, it's actually been a couple years since I read about the selectives, though back then I remember the theory was that they staged a mega coup.


Vivec mentions it again during the Trial of Vivec after Azura is summoned. The fact that Sotha Sil is dead had a great symbolic place in his little speech.
Even then, why would he "upload" himself to the Clockwork City? What would that accomplish? The Dwemer became Numidium because it was their ticket to wholesale apotheosis (not things worked out to plan, mind you).

So, every Daedric Realm has mortals living in them? Excluding Dagon's deadlands. We have seen the nuthouse(Shivering Isles) and heard of moonshadow, Azura's realm.

Does Hircine have mortals in his realm? Houses? I mean, those drivers in the ES novel where hunting for Hircine. So, could there be inhabitents there? I remembered correctly, there was a house in a hunting realm in Battlespire?
http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Battlespire:Level_5

A cottage, right? Is it Hircine's realm?

I think this is the important phrase. The player has just assumed the mantle of Sheogorath, but the player, and the realm need some more time to adjust to each other. Say 1000 years to do so completely, and then it will be time to scrap that and try again. But right now, you're still mortal enough, and SI is still "Old Sheo" enough, to keep much of the status quo. Maybe with a completed Greymarch cleaning the slate, a transition would have been faster and easier, but that didn't happen this era.

As for mortals in other realms, you got to visit a few yourself. If the Prince is accepting visitors, and doesn't mind them staying a while, why not? Portals may be opened as invitation, and communication through the shrines is also permissible, so it can happen. Whether anyone would want to stay in any realm is another matter.

Read up on what Chimere did.

idk...what did he do?

The hunting lodge in Battlespire belonged to Mehrunes Dagon. It was a place where he and his top lieutenants hunted for wild game, presumably lesser Daedra. (The mental image of Mehrunes Dagon rampaging after deer and turkey is comical though.) It's also possible that this is the place where the souls of mortals killed by Mehrunes Razor are sent to, and that Dagon takes pleasure in stalking them cat and mouse style. He seems the type who would engage in such recreational activities.



Which brings me to another interesting point about the Daedra Princes and their relations to each other. Sometimes their spheres overlap. Hircine is the Hunter but that doesn't mean Boethiah, Molag Bal or Mehrunes Dagon can't hunt as well. In a similar fashion, the Mythic Dawn cult while worshiping Dagon used tactics more befitting followers of Mephala or Nocturnal - stealth, deceit, trickery, secret murder, etc.

These overlaps in the practices and abilities of both the Princes and their followers are common when you examine it. This may be due to the ever changing nature of Oblivion itself. This may also explain some of the friendly competitions between Daedra princes, such as the ways Sheogorath tricked his fellow Princes in those Shivering Isles books.

It's possible that occasionally Hircine invites his fellow Princes to his realm and challenges them to a hunt. A friendly competition. Perhaps with mortals or lesser daedra as the prey. That's an interesting scenario to ponder, isn't it? We know such a thing is possible and even precedented. So why not?

The UESP said players had to endure a hunt in Hircine's realm. But I guess it lied. That sounds possible though, the friendly competition thing. Haha mortal hunting sounds fun. But as mortals had their own homes in the Shivering Isles makes me wonder if there is a similar to thing in Hircine's realm. I mean, who the hell are those Nord drivers that rode on wherebears and do they spend most of their time hunting? No lodges or houses to sleep in? After all, we only saw part of Hircine's realm whichw as a forest. One would think he has seperate climates to meet seperate hunting conditions. Jungle, Snow, desert and etc. Like in the story, they ran left the forest and ran through an open Savannah.

But overall, I mean you had to kill Big-Head in Morrowind, it could be that he died and his soul was sent to Shivering Isles.

EDIT: Sul was kept by Hircine in The Hunting Grounds....but what the hell did he do all that time?

From Almalexia in Tribunal
"He spoke not a word as he died. Not a whisper. Even in death, he mocked me with his silence"

Probably because he was no longer in his body.

Given how wise he was, and that he didn't seem to want people bothering him, and foresaw Almalexia coming for him eventually(Vivec saw her instability too), It's not that surprising of an idea. He was obsessed with perfection and was said to be reshaping the world in his City.

how does that sound like Dagon? Dagon's Sphere is destruction of that which has carried over from previous kalpas. toying with mortal souls doesn't fit this description, and since the Et'ada *IS* the sphere, Dagon not only wouldn't but COULDN'T want to do that.

It has to do with the hunt. It's probably part of The hunting grounds (each realm infinatley explores the different aspects of the Et'ada ie. Shivering isles is part of Sheogorath's madhouse and it explore mania and dementia.

How does using secret agents to assassinate the Emperor and who are part of a cult which hid in the shadows for over 300 years sound like Dagon?

By your logic and reasoning, each Daedric Prince is so incredibly limited in interests and powers that they can literally only do one thing. That's absolutely false and we both know it. The Daedra are extremely complicated characters.

If the Princes were that obsessed with their little "themes", Nirn would be absolutely teeming with books published by Hermaeus Mora worshipers. Everywhere, Clavicus Vile's little cultists would setup casinos. It would just be ridiculous.

Haha. And Molag Bal fanatics would be scheming and [Censored] people all over the place. Haha.

"How does using secret agents to assassinate the Emperor and who are part of a cult which hid in the shadows for over 300 years sound like Dagon?"
So that he can enter Nirn not on his summoning day and destroy the parts of the last kalpa that were hidden in Tamriel. Most of it was, as he lived in Skyrim as the leaper king and the greedy man livd in Vvardenfell.

You're completely ignoring my point.

By your logic, Dagon's realm is Destruction and he would be unable to use subterfuge or stealth at all, as that would be more in the realm of Mephala or Nocturnal. The type of one dimensional "big stompy demon" that he'd be reduced to in that scenario would be unable to plan things out so intricately, let alone have the patience for it.

And yet he's portrayed as a very patient, very intelligent character. He even wrote a book. What part of writing a book screams "Destruction"?

Let's face it. The Princes are not slaves to a particular mindset or attribute. They're flexible and can work in different ways.

As much as it may seem out of character, Mehrunes Dagon wrote a book and collaborated with mortals in a shadowy plot spanning centuries.

Molag Bal probably takes bubble baths now and then, too. And sometimes, when he's all alone, Malacath sings "Barbie Girl" while dancing in front of a mirror.

They do have personalities, yes. but multiple personalities. It's not like "This is mehrunes dagon, and among his many qualities is destruction," its "this is Destruction and among his many qualities is the giant stompy thing you see at the end of Oblivion." He takes up all forms of destruction, but only destruction. he doesn't take thrill in the hunt, because that isn't destruction. Yes, he kills people, but only when they are preventing destruction.

Dagon is also the prince of revolution and ambition. He's not all about destruction you know.

In regards to the OP subject: in the novel (I read it long ago so I may be missing some details), you learn that the inhabitants of the floating city are not actually born, but instead are created in a breeding pool starting like something resembling polyps and quickly growing into an advlt human(oid) form. six is only entertainment for them, and they don't really understand how could it be applied to reproduction. It seems the city could "learn" about the characteristics of the people that got abroad and apply them to its "polyps", so by the time the main characters get abroad there were individuals resembling the major human and mer races of Tamriel. Mere-Glim is informed that the city will soon "learn" of him, presumably so that it will be able to use his water-breathing abilities in future individuals.

So I was wondering if the inhabitants of the SI were only stray mortals ending up there for whatever reasons (which is the case of http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Shivering:Pyke at least) or included such "mortal-resembling organisms" created by Sheogorath.

Revolution is usually very public, however. While some elements contain subterfuge, I get the impression over 90% of the Mythic Dawn's actions involved it up until the very last - the invasion.

and although many terrorists worship a god i'm sure that the god the worship would't like them very much.

So why didn't it know any Argonians? Why only men and mer?

Purely supposition. Evidence points more strongly to the less convoluted conclusion: that Sotha Sil is dead, which is mutually exclusive to your hypothesis.

It also struck me as odd, but apparently the people in the city had never seen an argonian before questioning Mere-Glim. The city itself is an "stolen" fragment of Clavicus Vile's realm (a piece of Clavicus itself?), so I'm guessing there were no argonians there by the time it was broken free and started to float its way to Mundus.

As for people in the SI, it makes more sense to think they originate or descend from people in Mundus, but what about the isles' fauna and flora? If they are a creation of Sheogorath, could they be considered daedric?

I'd assume so.
Speaking of, there's been some speculation that the Grummites were originally the followers of Jyggalag, likely transformed by Sheogorath. That would explain their attraction to Order crystals. If this is the case and they were, in fact, transformed, that could have some implications depending on the nature of these followers... if they were once mortals, that could suggest that Daedric Princes have a lot of power over mortal inhabitants of their realms; though if they were Daedric (or something similar to Daedra, seeing as how the Knights of Order weren't Daedra but a different type of entity altogether if you believe the interview with Haskill and Dyus published on TIL), such an ability would be much less a point of concern.

The fauna, excluding the Hungers, seem to be mortal, as the reproduction cycles of both Grummites and Elytra are documented. Gnarls are an interesting case, though, as they're the attendents of the root channels, thus they could be considered extensions of the Tree of Madness (even if most of them seem to be feral). Perhaps they're closer to being flora than fauna.

He doesn't like them very much after they release him into Mundus? What a little punk, after all they did for him... bliviongate: