Mortuaries.

Post » Sun Jul 04, 2010 3:43 am

This is for a mod I'm planning: Is there any lore on where the dead are kept before being taken for burial? Are Autopsies performed in Tamriel? I'm more interested in what the Empire does rather than the other cultures (I know that Dunmer cremate and that bosmer eat their dead).
Any information on this would be appreciated :)
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Kate Murrell
 
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Post » Sat Jul 03, 2010 5:59 pm

This is for a mod I'm planning: Is there any lore on where the dead are kept before being taken for burial? Are Autopsies performed in Tamriel? I'm more interested in what the Empire does rather than the other cultures (I know that Dunmer cremate and that bosmer eat their dead).
Any information on this would be appreciated :)


Bosmer don't eat all of their dead, just an opponent they killed in battle.

The only people who study cadavers are necromancers.

I'm pretty sure they leave bodies under churches for a while before burial (Like the faked death DB quest)
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Stay-C
 
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Post » Sat Jul 03, 2010 4:16 pm

The only people who study cadavers are necromancers.


Such narrow-minded, Travenesque thinking. *crosses arms and scowls, shaking head sadly*
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Felix Walde
 
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Post » Sun Jul 04, 2010 12:05 am

Such narrow-minded, Travenesque thinking. *crosses arms and scowls, shaking head sadly*

Not really. It is pretty much only necromancers that take an interest in studying the human/elvish body. In fact, that's what necromancers pretty much are in Summerset (if they're not being burned)
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Clea Jamerson
 
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Post » Sat Jul 03, 2010 5:52 pm

Not really. It is pretty much only necromancers that take an interest in studying the human/elvish body. In fact, that's what necromancers pretty much are in Summerset (if they're not being burned)


How is a person with an interest in healing mannish and mer bodies such as myself able to develop newer and more powerful potions and spells to repair bodily harm if we're not allowed to operate on and understand the inner workings of the bodily systems? It is a tragic and outdated law which doesn't reflect the best scholarly or altruistic interests of the modern Empire. I should hope that some serious legislation is passed soon to remedy this, or else healers are never going to figure out how to cure some of the nastier diseases out there, such as the Wasting Disease.
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Noely Ulloa
 
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Post » Sat Jul 03, 2010 3:51 pm

So, Necromancers are the only ones that study corpses? Seriously?
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louise tagg
 
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Post » Sun Jul 04, 2010 4:03 am

So, Necromancers are the only ones that study corpses? Seriously?


That's the state-sponsored propaganda, sadly. Yes, officially, if you study the remains of the deceased you are considered to be practicing some dark art, or must have some sinister intent. It's a darn shame. In Vvardenfell, the Telvanni were able to carry out many wonderful experiments on the flesh since Imperial Law rarely dared to intrude into their private affairs. I had the pleasure to study briefly in Tel Vos, and the theories contained within those walls were astounding. It's truly a shame that most of that data has been lost during Red Year. The practical medical applications of such knowledge could have vastly improved life in Tamriel.
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Anne marie
 
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Post » Sat Jul 03, 2010 10:47 pm

Okay then. What about storage? Any lore on where bodies might be kept before burial?
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Sara Lee
 
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Post » Sun Jul 04, 2010 2:28 am

Okay then. What about storage? Any lore on where bodies might be kept before burial?


Yeah that one's easy...during at least one quest in Oblivion a body was kept in the undercroft of a town chapel, awaiting buriel. That's also apparently the common practice in the Iliac Bay. I'm not sure how cultures such as the Bosmer or the Orcs inter their dead. Nords have barrows, at least in Solsthiem. Since a lot of Imperial High Culture is directly copied from Aldmeri culture, Summerset Isle should be very similar to Cyrodill.

The Dunmer had ancestral tombs, and some of their bodies were actually turned into tomb guardians such as skeletons or bonewalkers to guard the tombs.
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Marcia Renton
 
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Post » Sat Jul 03, 2010 11:54 pm

I guess I'll have to use my imagination and hope it doesn't end up too lore un-friendly. Thanks :)
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JaNnatul Naimah
 
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Post » Sun Jul 04, 2010 1:08 am

Yeah that one's easy...during at least one quest in Oblivion a body was kept in the undercroft of a town chapel, awaiting buriel. That's also apparently the common practice in the Iliac Bay. I'm not sure how cultures such as the Bosmer or the Orcs inter their dead. Nords have barrows, at least in Solsthiem. Since a lot of Imperial High Culture is directly copied from Aldmeri culture, Summerset Isle should be very similar to Cyrodill.

The Dunmer had ancestral tombs, and some of their bodies were actually turned into tomb guardians such as skeletons or bonewalkers to guard the tombs.

I think On Earth that bodies were kept awhile before being interred to make absolutely sure that the person is dead and not just breathing really shallowly and unconscious. Not as uncommon as you might think (or hope). But, with a "detect life" spell, it'd be pretty easy to check if your unresponsive body is alive or dead. Therefore, the only need to keep the body around would be for relatives to pay respects - assuming the inhabitants don't find it particularly odd to talk to a corpse. Otherwise, bury or burn the body, make a little grave or shrine, and leave flowers or other gifts for the dead.

Oh, yes, and then there's the Dunmer custom of turning your corpse into a tomb guard. Here's your stuff, now why don't you go guard it from looters, hmm?
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Latino HeaT
 
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Post » Sun Jul 04, 2010 7:35 am

An examination is carrid out on the Emperor's assassin (who somehow manages to change from an Altmer into a Breton) as the note and knife next to it show.
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Louise
 
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Post » Sat Jul 03, 2010 8:05 pm

So, Necromancers are the only ones that study corpses? Seriously?

It's like when somebody asks why the people of Tamriel haven't advanced technologically (Dwemer creations excluded) over the eras - specifically, concerning gunpowder. Simple - because it's just much easier, much more publicly acceptable, and much more fun to just learn a simple fireball spell and blow everything to bits that way. :evil:

Same thing here. Beyond Alchemical/herbal/spiritual healing practices, I'm sure there's little reason to study the body or delve into our equivalent of "medical sciences" in Tamriel. Of course, as Galosh stated, even these fields of practice should require at least some study of the body. It's a silly law indeed, but with The Infernal City and the dissolution of the
Spoiler
Mages Guild
, things may change in due time.
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Avril Churchill
 
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Post » Sun Jul 04, 2010 1:16 am

well, there isn't a law against necromancy anywhere but in Vvardenfell and Summerset. It's just socially...weird.
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Carlos Rojas
 
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Post » Sat Jul 03, 2010 11:51 pm

Remember the quest in Bruma, where the guard says "We found two bodies stashed in shallow graves outside the city walls. The bodies had puncture wounds on their necks." So they do some studies of the body, but I imagine they don't try to open you up.
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April
 
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Post » Sun Jul 04, 2010 9:52 am

Dunmer are burned when they die. Right? All the crypts in Vvardenfell are all just urns with ashes. The Imperials, Nords, Bretons, .. are all buried I think. The Bosmer are eaten when they died in a battle or a fight. That's about all that's known I think.
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CxvIII
 
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Post » Sun Jul 04, 2010 7:57 am

I'd like to point out that necromancy is 100% legal in the Empire, despite the illegal activities of some mage's guild members. I guess murder on an almost genocide scale was fine when Ocato, a former archmage was running the place. The atrocities committed by the mage's guild during that period will never be fully uncovered due to the nature of the event, and I hope something of the scale never happens again. As a well meaning and forward thinking mage have dabbled in the art of necromancy. From personal experience I find that such knowledge could be extremely beneficial on many scales, were laws not so strict and stigmas so high concerning the practice. Once the soul has moved on to the dreamsleeve, the body is nothing but an object which can be used to the advantage of man and mer. Anyone who thinks any other way is giving way to primitive superstitions.
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R.I.p MOmmy
 
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Post » Sat Jul 03, 2010 7:47 pm

The bodies had puncture wounds on their necks." So they do some studies of the body, but I imagine they don't try to open you up.

That doesn't really count. That's like a guard saying "we found an Imperial male, dead, outside the city - his head was chopped off". More of a quick observation than an actual autopsy/examination. :P
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Laurenn Doylee
 
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Post » Sat Jul 03, 2010 11:43 pm

I doubt any autopsies done would actually be meaningful. In the real world, to understand why/how a person died, you have to know all the parts of the body. You have to label them and know what they do in order to figure out what went wrong. I don't think that sort of scientific mindset and knowledge is present in Tamriel. Also, keep in mind that there is magic to cure poison and disease. Ruling out disease (and other body problems, such as blood clots, organ failure, and so on), the only reason a person on Tamriel might die would be exposure to the elements, drowning, starvation, alcohol poisoning, or being killed by a creature or other person. Or not getting treatment for diseases/poison/venom in time. So, you won't have people dying from kidney failure, deep vein thrombosis, heart disease, clogged arteries, necrosis of internal organs, etc -- as long as there is a potion, scroll, or spellcaster nearby to fix you up.
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Alkira rose Nankivell
 
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Post » Sun Jul 04, 2010 4:56 am

I figured even potions and spells required some knowledge of the body, at least in targeting the desired area of effect. I'm sure some basic studies of the body, but more on an herbal/ritualistic level of knowledge, akin to Tibetan and Nepalese self-healing and Buddhist Ayurveda. I could be wrong, though. Maybe it is just as simple as a "cure all" spell.

Remember that we can't use the games for reference as there is some degree of artistic license there. There would just be no reason to complicate restoration spells in the game by making them specific to certain ailments (then again, few such ailments exist in the game beyond a few diseases/curses/physical health damage). For the time being I'm going to assume that in TES canon it is more complex than "Heal # Points".
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CRuzIta LUVz grlz
 
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Post » Sun Jul 04, 2010 4:21 am

Such narrow-minded, Travenesque thinking. *crosses arms and scowls, shaking head sadly*


Sure, most necromancers out there are evil, but necromancy itself isn't an inherent evil! By studying the forces behind life and death, one can better learn how to preserve life, or even create True Resurrection.

T_T
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phil walsh
 
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