Typical Altmer: "Oh, another day! Today I'm going to lecture the new Mages, berate them for not being as smart as me, ignore my enemies, and kill a couple of Mudcrabs! I love being alive!"

I get your point, but I actually liked that they weren't so racist in Oblivion, well some were, but overall they weren't too racist. I liked it because it showed the cultural differences between morrowind and Cyrodiil, I mean most of the racism in Morrowind seemed to stem from the culture.

There are some racist in Cyrodiil though, I mean the first person you meet, will be a racist no matter the race, and he's a dunmer!

yes, but had he been a Altmer he would have just ignored you so that he didnt have to talk to an inferior being.

well i read some of the inferno city (big disappointment) but bit and peices like the argonians pushing everything away the empire dumer (even tho the empire was tryin to help those beasts), then the dumer flock to my land solstheim, oh in the next game love to hear rumors about dumer and nords on a nord island theirs gonna be sum blows there, id go with argonians in the future but id say king helesh and his mother (their entire lives are a big lets screw everyone over to get what we want wounder if his mother even thinks about the poor stable boy with no tongue) so dumer present and argonians later on.

I want to add that the Dunmer of Morrowind called whatever race an outlander. Which might not be good, but it is not really racism if it is directed at all outlanders no matter the race. Then its just general bigotry. Same with the Dunmer of the OB prison cell.

Altmer - have their racists code against all non-Altmer
Argonians - ??? Racist? Why not? There are apparently racists Hist, so its not a big jump.

ay i kno this is abit of topic but solthiem is like a country in our world great britain lol people flock here from everywhere plus its small and an island hot at bottom cold up north, now all we need in a smaller island sat next to it

While that may sound accurate, remember that when a Dunmer refers to someone as an "Outlander", they're saying you don't belong here, and you never will. Unless my knowledge of Lore is wrong, I'm pretty sure the "Neravar" (Not Neravarine) is a Dunmer God that apparently drives the Imperials out of their province. Again, I'm not 100% with my Lore knowledge, but if thats true, they obviously want to be a province where no one is controlling them.

Well then is that resistive or oppressive?

A bit of both to be honest. They're "resisting" Imperial rule by being one of the most hostile provinces in Tamirel and their "oppressing" non-Dunmers by not making them feel welcomed in their settlements and towns.

Part of my earlier post.
They refer to any Dunmer that is not a native, as an Outlander.

They are not racist towards non-dunmer, they are bigots towards non-natives.

Non natives as in Dunmer influenced by Western culture or just in general?

They have a beef with a lot of people.
Dunmer from Black Marsh - traitor (anti-slaves), hate them
Dunmer from Cyrodill - traitor (anti-tribunal), hate them
Dunmer from Elyser - traitor (anti-slaves), hate them
Dunmer from Skyrim - traitor (Nords svck), hate them
Dunmer from...

I think the Dunmer are a bunch of drama queens to an extent, behind the gruffness.

When I hear Outlander as consistently as I do, its like hearing "you will never understand us" which may be true.
But its like getting weird looks when people are trying to figure out if you are talking of experience or from a script.

[edit] Not exactly the same oppressive racism. At least how I see it.

Tbh the dunmer are probably a little pissy becasue someone cursed their race, and made their skin black.

tbh if Azura thinks turning someones skin black is cursing them then she's a bit racist. However they did deserve a visually obviouse curse so everyone would know of their evilness. They were petty harsh and powerhungry only caring for themselves afterall... oh and they are pretty racist...

She didn't give much of a two poops about what they did, until the Tribunal wanted to be gods.

Dunmer get my vote.

Dunmer because they are really protective about their settlement in Morrowind.

Like all species, the races of TES are all racist to the same average extent. It is merely the way that they express their racism that differs. This then opens a completely subjective debate on what forms of racist expression are better/worse than others.

Dark Elves bu I think the least racist race (lol) is the bosmer. I've never seen a racist bosmer. Imperials are pretty racist, they always call me a fur-licker even the counts. bastards

This is always such a loaded topic. Those of us who did not play Morrowind are always left to feel outside ourselves (n'wah). In my experience Dark Elves, that's what we call 'em are not that racist, a few necrophiliacs, bar owners and town drunks - but not racist. You might be able to say that only one particular sub-region inhabited by Dark Elves is racists. That is to say it's not a trait widespread across Tamriel.

On the other hand, High Elves still seem hell-bent on killing everyone else and re-assuming their rightful place as the rulers of all Tamriel. This may qualify them as the most racist.

However, to complicate matters, Orcs profess that they want to 'pick their teeth with my spine' when I play as an Elf. I find that behaviour most malicious and racist ... Furthermore, Orcs are filthy beasts not fit to serve in the homes of Altamer. They should be killed or banished to Akivir or something. I hate they way they smell. Same goes for those crude, dirty Nords. They should all be drownd in a bucket at birth, there are far too many of them.

Well, the Altmer forbid non-elves to enter their cities, so my vote goes to them.

In Oblivion every race has individual disposition modifiers against every other race. And they are like this:

Argonians, Bosmer, Bretons, Khajiits, and Nords all have a +5 modifier towards their own race. They all like members of their own race a bit better, but have no hard feelings against anyone. Redguards have a +5 modifier against other Redguards as well as a -5 modifier against Bretons and Imperials. Imperials have no modifiers at all, not even a positive modifier against other Imperials. They actually treat everybody equally well, regardless of race. Orcs have a -5 modifier against everybody who isn't an Orc and no modifier against fellow Orcs. Dunmer have no modifier against Orcs and Dunmer, a -10 modifier against Argonians and Altmer, and a -5 modifier against everybody else. Almer have +5 towards other Altmer, no modifier towards Orcs, -10 against Argonians, Khajiits, and dunmer, and a -5 modifier against everybody else.

It would be easiest to assume that whichever race has the lowest average modifiers is the most racist, but I think we should instead look at the diference between the modifier for their own race and the average modifiers for other races. For example Orcs seem pretty racist at first sight, but when you think about it they just like everybody who isn't an Orcs 5 points less than they like other Orcs. That's actually the same as with most races. So Orcs are not really racist, they're just generally mean.

I define the racism score of a race as it's modifier against other members of it's own race minus it's average modifier against other races. This gives us the following racism scores:
1. Altmer: 11.11
2. Redguards: 6.11
3. Dunmer: 5.55
4. Argonians, Bosmer, Bretons, Khajiits, Nords, Orcs: 5
5. Imperials: 0

Note however, that this is derived purely from game mechanics and may not reflect lore. It's also based on the assumption that liking other races less than you like your own makes you racist. The assumption is fairly sensible, but it doesn't take into account that one might be racist without hating the race you are racist towards.

I think it depends how you look at it. Take Bosmer vs. Orcs, for example: do their scores simply mean that each of them gets on slightly better with their own race, or does it mean that Bosmer get on OK with everyone but like other Bosmer a bit more, while Orcs actively dislike everyone except other Orcs? Given how disposition modifiers work in-game, I think the latter makes more sense. It also seems a bit weird that Redguards come out as more racist than Dunmer with your system, even though Dunmer have far more negative modifiers (and far more modifiers overall).

Another way to rank them would simply be to take the absolute value of each modifier (i.e. ignoring whether it's positive or negative) and add them all together. This gives the following scores:

1. Altmer: 60
2. Dunmer: 50
3. Orcs: 45
4. Redguards: 15
5. Argonians, Bosmer, Bretons, Khajiit, Nords: 5
6. Imperials: 0

Of course, as you said, this is just a game-mechanic thing and doesn't seem all that consistent with what we know about lore. Argonians have no dislike for Dunmer? Altmer and Dunmer dislike each other more than they dislike any of the human races? Not to mention that in Morrowind, the mechanics are different: each race simply gets a 5-point disposition bonus towards their own race and no negative modifiers. And of course, there are plenty of individual characters in both games that don't fit into this pattern.

Well, to the altmer, they may see their fallen brethren (dunmer) as fallen and corrupt mer, and therefore warrant more hatred than men. Also, the dunmer did knowingly and willingly leave Summerset, and defiled one of their cultural heros (Trinimac) along the way.

Possibly. I still don't see how it works the other way round, though. From MW I definitely got the idea that the Dunmer think of Altmer along these lines: "Well, they may be arrogant and decadent, but at least they're Elves rather than smelly humans or beastfolk."

Yes, I think that's how it works. Bosmer like other Bosmer and are neutral to everyone else while Orcs dislike everybody except other Orcs. The overall effect is the same, Orcs just have 5 points lower disposition in general.



Yes, that is much like the Dunmer nobles described them. They said that Altmer achievements were notable, but that their culture became stagnant. Which is much nicer than how they describe every other race.

Though perhaps it could be considered that these values apply in Cyrodiil and in the provinces modifiers could be different.