No, he coordinates supplies for Ranger outposts. You are creating lore that doesn't exist.

He still falsifies intelligence reports which mean that supplies aren't going to be effectively given to Army outpost.

Ok, wow, you are changing the subject. He falsified reports for Ranger outposts. Obviously he would have his own supply line for his Corp. that is seperate from the army supplies.

Yeah I understand that he doesn't do supply reports for the army, but he still gives intelligence reports which effect the army supply lines. If he's lying and saying, "O well around Base A I've seen some deathclaws" and [censored] nothing is happening at Base A, that means resources will be diverted from places like Forlorn to where they aren't needed. And even if his actions don't effect the army in that way, every added med kit etc that those outpost are given is one less the army or cilivans have to use. So yes he is getting people killed even if it isn't a one step process.

He just can't win with the NCR fans. If he was to attack CL all of the time then NCR fans would say "He's a bad general, he doesn't care for human life!" but he sets up a defense and waits for an attack they say "He's a bad general, he just wants to keep his soldiers alive!"

I feel bad for him.



What does that say about the NCR population?



I would actually blame Hanlon for that. He placed a ranger station right outside Cottonwood Cove to watch CL raiding parties and slaves being brought across the Colorado River.

That is a terrible stradegy. I would have the rangers lay out traps, I would place snipers along the mountains, and I would move rangers down the Colorado River by raft. After that's all set up I would send NCR troops and rangers into Cottonwood Cove, it would be a massacre with NCR attacking from all sides.


So he's responsible for the NCR's resource problems? Not their size, not their geographical location, not even their population but their president?

We do not know how long Baja has been under NCR cotnrol, it could've been theirs for twenty years now, it could be like NV where the Circle of Steel is hiding just like the Mojave BoS.

You can't blame a president for strategic issues when you have no idea who gave the command.

Presidents usually just handle political issues.

That's kind of bogus, he's commander and chief of the armed forces. I could understand if he's never picked up a gun a day in his life and he let the stragety be that [censored], but he was a general for christ sake. If Oliver sent a letter to my desk saying something like, "I told all the troops to just hold up for a bit." his ass would be gone espeically if I had over 20 something years of stragetic and tactical experience like Kimball! There is no excuse for Kimball for allowing Oliver to [censored] things up this badly even if he has to spend a lot of time dealing with Land Barons, politicians, and citizens. Hell you shouldn't be president if you can't handle that.

You are now claiming Olvier told all NCR soldiers what to do!

Generals look at the big picture, they do not place every single soldier. That's what their chain of command is for.

Again, we do not know who gave those orders, it could have been Hsu for all we know!

I'm not saying Oliver handles day to day tactics but when it comes to the General stragety and any matters large enough to come to his desk here are what he does.

A. No have a standing force, no offensive missions for you.

Now yes if they had more troops in a place like Mojave Outpost they could technically do some offensive and scouting work but no they can't do that either because if they had more than one person for a standing force that person would be sent East.

B. Let's just hold the Dam
So not only does he not want to risk the troop they have stationed but at the places they have more than enough troops for standing force they don't have supplies. Why? Because the unstaffed outpost don't have troops to secure supply lines, because the troops they would have are east.

Then theres the matter of where he's placed troops etc which I've already gone over a few post up. Oliver is the main reason that the Mojave Campaign is going to so badly for the NCR, and Kimball doesn't help.

Nothing whatsoever. I mean hey, the Americans elected Nixon, didn't they?

Moore is a [censored] man. Terrible leader, throws lives away. Kills people to gain influence... not evil? haha.

Yeah because ordering the death of Raiders (The Khans), Slavers (The Legion) and techno-religious nutjobs (The BOS) is evil compared to what everyone else does. And even if she was as evil as Caeser she's also damn effective.

Um, yes you can. I know in today's culture, Presidents are pressured to say "I trust in my commanders on the ground", but the truth is a President is advised by generals and has the responsibility of approving strategic moves.

If a general has a dumb strategy and the President is ok with that, then the responsibility falls on the commanders who came up with the dumb idea and the President giving a green light with it.

There used to be a saying that "The buck stops here." Obviously when I vote for a President, his foreign policy views and sometimes military / war time experience are a large factor for my vote.

That's why the President is referred to as the Commander in Chief. And especially considering that we have in today's real world the President feels like he can commit to conflicts in North and Central Africa without congressional approval, so yes it is his responsibility.

I saw what you did there.

-Nukeknockout

"Amateurs study tactics....professionals study logistics". No modern military can survive without the REMFs to get the stuff the front line needs. Maybe one of them deserves a turn at the helm, it might remind the Air Force they have important missions to do besides fly around in supersonic jet fighters. They actually wanted to scrap the A-10 because they don't consider CAS to be worth thier time, the A-10 is slow and ugly, and scrapping them would free up funds for something six-ay and supersonic. The fact it's the most effective ground attack aircraft ever built didn't matter to them. They were planning on destroying them lest the Army...the real Enemy of the USAF...try to get them to operate themselves. Congress had to step in and force them to back off.


Oliver is completely incompetent as far as being a Theatre Commander goes. Look at the position the Courier finds in the Mojave:

-The Legion has been allowed to establish a foothold on the west bank of the Colorado River. This has allowed them to roam free throughout the center of the area and harass supply caravans along I-95, take Nelson, utterly destroy Searchlight and Nipton, and forced the NCR to station troops just to keep the Dam's supply line from being cut off. The Ranger post some talk about near Cottonwood cove is completely ineffective. On top of the dire supply situation they are in, it is destroying NCR morale that the Legion effectively controls 1/3rd of the Mojave already and Oliver is doing nothing about it.

-He has allowed I-15 to be impassable, due to the NCRCF revolt and the Deathclaws in the Quarry. This is particularly inexplicable as the NCR Expeditionary Force's sole source of cement for fortifications is the cement factory in Boulder Springs...which gets all it's limestone from that same quarry. By ignoring the dire situation along I-15, Oliver denies himself the ability to bring in nearly unlimited supplies from the rail links to the NCR proper, the use of the most easily protected caravan route available to him (I-15), and the sole source of concrete for desperately needed fortifications.

-Oliver is paying no attention to rear area security....the Fiends and Khans are allowed to operate nearly at will. The situation in Freeside is allowed to fester, and the situation at NCRCF has been allowed to go on for far too long. By allowing these things to happen, he gives the locals the impression the NCR cannot protect them and is likely to be pushed out by the Legion. Who is going to support the NCR if they look like they are going to lose? And with the major caravan companies attacking and destroying smaller concerns to monopolize commerce in the Mojave on top of it....they are on the verge of losing control off everything outside thier bases. And that vacuum will be filled by the Legion.

-He cannot make proper use of his subordinates. His most well rounded officer, Hsu, is sidelined in McCarran, and given no authority lest he do something that gets him noticed....while he sticks his best field commander, Moore, in a defensive position that leaves her with plenty of time to meddle with issues she is ill suited to handle. She should be at Forlorn Hope trying to salvage the mess Oliver has made of thier tactical situation and Hsu and Crocker should be dealing with the myriad of rear area security issues. And then there is Hanlon...Oliver is partly to blame as he has sidelined Hanlon as well, but he needs to be replaced forthwith as he has become a defeatist.

If that isn't bad enough...how about the idiots in Shady Sands? Not only are they responsible for Oliver's mistakes, they are making huge strategic blunders of thier own. Rather than sending a Expeditionary Force into Arizona to pillage and destroy the Legion's infrastructure...they are running around Baja doing nothing, or guarding the ranches of the Brahmin Barons. Let Caesar fight a war on two or three fronts and see how long he can continue to threaten the Dam.

Lets not forget she wanted to send her own forces to kill a bunch of Elvis impersonators.

A. What's wrong with remaining on defence? And that is not entirely true. There are cases such as the fights with the Powder Gangers, the Kings, and the Fiends.

Well that is not a president or a generals fault.

B. They want one of the greatest resources they have ever gotten their hands on to be secure, so? And they are not just holding Hoover Dam, clearly they are holding most of the Mojave.

The NCR's leaders are not responsible for most of the problems in the Mojave, it is also their lieutenants and sergeants. A nation's leaders can be the source of big problems but not the source of every problem.



Nixon was alright until he hired somebody to spy on his opponents for him, but we're not supposed to talk about real life politics.

And what I said before speaks volumes about them if he really is as much of a bumbling idiot as NCR fans believe.

I'm gonna make this statement short so we don't get off topic and I will leave it at that. Terrorism isn't the only enemy of U.S., with practically our entire manufacturing shifted to unfriendly countries like China, and a hostile North Korea, when tensions rise and we find Soul leveled by the largest artillery force in the world and a million screaming infantry or an aggressive China with a developing airforce and a million screaming infantry, it's not gonna be a bunch of Navy Seals that saves the day, but those sixy aircraft that the defense department feels are useless.

Everyone involved is incompetent 'cause no one suggested flying Kimbell's virtabird over the legion and bombing the bejesus out of it.

I guess our million screaming infantry don't count for anything...

They aren't the cause of NCR's problems in the Mojave.

The political mood of the NCR is to not fight the Legion in an all out war. Their goal is to contain the Legion. Military thinking is that there is enough troops in the Mojave to do just that. Oliver believes Caesar will through the bulk of his forces at the dam in a second attempt to take it. So logically he has most of the troops stationed at the Dam, waiting for Caesar to make a move. The rest of the Mojave other then the Strip and Helios isn't really their concern.

NCR is having troubles getting supplies and men into the Mojave thanks to the Divide and Powder Gangers.

The real cause of NCR's troubles in the Mojave goes back to who ever decided to send the package to the Divide which caused it to blow up. If that never happened, it would be smooth sailing in the Mojave.

We don't need them, we have got us!
USMC to the rescue!

You can't win a war with air power alone. Vertibirds have limited range and it would be only a matter of time before the Legion set up anti-aircraft measures. Vertibirds are not designed for bombing. If they lost a Vertibird, that's a loss of valuable equipment.

What they could use Vertibirds for is flying in squads of rangers behind enemy lines, but the problem with that is the Legion has great scouts, so the odds of them not seeing a vertibird flying in troops in their land is slim.

The marines make up part of that million infantry.

They may only really care about the Dam...though the potential tax revenue from the Strip must be of interest to Shady Sands...but it's clear the NCR means to annex the whole Mojave. To do that, they need to secure it. Oliver is completely ignoring rear area security, thusly his logistical position is precarious and Eddie has been allowed to open a new front against the NCR from the south and create problems for them everywhere else. Allowing Eddie to hold Cottonwood Cove is the height of stupidity...it allowed Eddie to destroy Searchlight and Nipton, and take Nelson. For that alone he should be sacked.



The Divide is in the past. NCR is having trouble getting supplies and men into the Mojave during the game because they used prisoners to maintain the vital rail links between NCR and the Mojave, then Oliver transferred most of thier guards so they could revolt and use thier new-found freedom to cut those same links. Then rather than squashing the revolt and bringing in sappers or civilian workers to restore the rail links and put an end to all thier supply problems, they merely try to keep them from spreading South of Primm and abandon thier workers in Sloan who were mining the limestone that went into the cement that was thier sole source for building bunkers for defensive works. He could be bringing in thousands of men and thousands of tons of supplies every day by rail but once again he is ignoring the most basic military doctrine.

Personally, I have to wonder if Oliver is yet another Frumentarii sabotaging the NCR from within. A senior at West Point, Sandhurst or St Cyr could do a better job than he has. Getting the railroad functioning, not to mention the quarry and the cement factory at Boulder Springs must have cost a fortune. The whole situation smells of someone making careful preparations to hold the Mojave and incorporate it into the NCR only to have Oliver promptly screw them up once his buddy Kimball appointed him. If Hsu were in charge none of these problems would even exist...even the new problems Moore created while solving the existing ones her way would be better than what Oliver has done.

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have any of you guys seen my silver/grey guitar pick? i can't find it anywhere :sadvaultboy: