Nebulae? : The Elder Scrolls Series Discussion

» Tue Mar 08, 2011 8:52 am

An excerpt from the newest Skyrim hub update:

Three prominent nebulae dominate the Skyrim heavens – the thief, the warrior, and the mage. Each of these represents one of the three master skill sets. Each nebula houses six constellations, each of which represents a skill.

How does this fit with the lore?

Here's the article in its entirety: http://www.gameinformer.com/games/the_elder_scrolls_v_skyrim/b/xbox360/archive/2011/01/28/skyrim-menu-system-overhaul.aspx

» Tue Mar 08, 2011 4:53 am

This really got me wondering; how does this fit with the lore?

This doesn't break lore at all. The warrior/mage/thief is a main concept in TES. http://www.imperial-library.info/content/morrowind-firmament for one example.

edit: Enantiomorphs are a combination of warrior, mage, and thief.

» Tue Mar 08, 2011 5:09 pm

Aren't the Mage, Warrior and Thief supposed to be constellations?

» Tue Mar 08, 2011 1:56 pm

Aren't the Mage, Warrior and Thief supposed to be constellations?

They are. Gameinformer just wanted to sound like they'd done their book learnin'.

» Tue Mar 08, 2011 5:02 am

Looking at the screenshot they provide, yes, Mage is now a nebula. Now the thing is, the new sign for destruction could indeed double as the head of the old sign of the Mage. They could intend to dissolve the old signs and explain it to have happened during the 200 missing years. The TES cosmos is wacky enough for that.

» Tue Mar 08, 2011 8:49 am

They could intend to dissolve the old signs and explain it to have happened during the 200 missing years. The TES cosmos is wacky enough for that.

The fiction hasn't suffered. This needs no explanation.

» Tue Mar 08, 2011 6:21 pm

Looking at the screenshot they provide, yes, Mage is now a nebula. Now the thing is, the new sign for destruction could indeed double as the head of the old sign of the Mage. They could intend to dissolve the old signs and explain it to have happened during the 200 missing years. The TES cosmos is wacky enough for that.

Wouldn't a much simpler explanation simply be that the constellation is in the Nebula?

» Tue Mar 08, 2011 6:39 pm

The nebula is shaped as the mage. There is no mage constellation anymore. Instead, there are skill constellations, inside the nebula. The other constellations are, for all we know, still present. This requires editing the books, mentioning the big three constellations. Brief editing, not some knee-jerk numiditions.

» Tue Mar 08, 2011 2:54 am

We can probably still pick birthsigns, so those constellations (well, nebulae) are probably still present, it's just that The Tower or The Serpent don't exactly have any skills in them, probably. They're just big clouds of cosmic dust (or broken Magna-Ge).

» Tue Mar 08, 2011 6:00 am

Only the Mage, Warrior, and Thief have been changed.

» Tue Mar 08, 2011 4:30 am

Wouldn't a much simpler explanation simply be that the constellation is in the Nebula?

Yes, but where did that nebula come from all of a sudden? It sure was not there during the reign of Uriel Septim the VIIth.

» Tue Mar 08, 2011 4:39 pm

It was not there because it doesn't exist and neither does Uriel VII. This is a silly thing to worry about. It's even consistent with the imagery of the other constellations as the charges of the major three.

Stars change because the waters of Oblivion are always in motion. Does that sort of mumbo jumbo handwaving answer really satisfy you?

» Tue Mar 08, 2011 7:00 pm

Yes, but where did that nebula come from all of a sudden? It sure was not there during the reign of Uriel Septim the VIIth.

Meh, It's a retcon probably. Thus the nebula was always there, just never mentioned before.

» Tue Mar 08, 2011 1:07 pm

If it is a retconn, it's a retconn I really don't care too much about. The constellations were never that huge to begin with anyway, nor had much impact to begin with. Or it could just be that some star gazers got better at looking at the stars :shrug:

» Tue Mar 08, 2011 8:51 am

Its a retcon. Easy as that. Just like Cyrodiil the Jungle. Except smaller and not as noticeable.

» Tue Mar 08, 2011 7:49 am

Its a retcon. Easy as that. Just like Cyrodiil the Jungle. Except smaller and not as noticeable.

Woah, these don't parallel. The loss wasn't the jungle, itself. The loss was Cyrodilic culture, to a really bad Renaissance fair. This is amplitudes of loss, around the mere appearance change of a texture.

» Tue Mar 08, 2011 7:53 pm

The bigger deal is that instead of 12 constellations, there are 18 - one per skill. The thief, mage, and warrior are almost certainly retained (in addition to the nebulae) to reach this number, but what could the additional six be?

» Tue Mar 08, 2011 1:18 pm

Whatever the V-man decides

» Tue Mar 08, 2011 2:37 pm

Do we know if the Nebulae have actually replaced the three Guardian Constellations?

I say we wait till we have more information on the sky; the Firmament constellations may still exist.

» Tue Mar 08, 2011 8:46 am

It seems rather unimportant either way. If they do exist we know the constellations have a matching nebula which making the constellations rather pointless as the Nebula is more distinguishable. If they no longer exist we have a nebulae that has the same function.

Though I'd be interesting to know if the appearance of the nebula varied per person per religion. Even if just to kill of that "under the same roof, looking at the same sky" sentimental junk that occasionally pops up in a film.

» Tue Mar 08, 2011 5:35 am

Even if just to kill of that "under the same roof, looking at the same sky" sentimental junk that occasionally pops up in a film.

But that was my favorite part of "An American Tail."

» Tue Mar 08, 2011 6:42 am

The bigger deal is that instead of 12 constellations, there are 18 - one per skill. The thief, mage, and warrior are almost certainly retained (in addition to the nebulae) to reach this number, but what could the additional six be?

The article doesn't count the Firmament constellations, only those within each nebula. Six constellations, within each of the three nebula. These are the 18 constellations.

What surplus are you referring to?

» Tue Mar 08, 2011 5:17 am

It's a menu. It's an abstraction. Yes they're trying to root the menu into the game-world, but here's a question for you: How are you going to see your skills in the daytime if you can't look at the stars? How about underground?

When they finally show off screenshots of the night sky (and I'm pretty sure they will), look for your Nebulae and new star-signs there.

» Tue Mar 08, 2011 7:37 pm

Yes, but where did that nebula come from all of a sudden? It sure was not there during the reign of Uriel Septim the VIIth.

It could easily not be. Until we see a screenshot of the night sky, what you saw is just a skill menu's background.

» Tue Mar 08, 2011 9:33 am

The article doesn't count the Firmament constellations, only those within each nebula. Six constellations, within each of the three nebula. These are the 18 constellations.

What surplus are you referring to?

12 constellations in lore, 18 constellations in the game