*sigh*.. really?...I don't understand why anyone would even want nudity in a game like Skyrim, i see nothing wrong with human body, as other people said 'it's natural' but its different when you put it in your game and let people from all age ranges play it, you know how people are nowadays most parents (i know) let their kids play games without even checking the rating, it it's a fantasy adventure game! i don't want to accidentally press the wrong button to unequip my loincloth only to find my mother walks in to put my clean washing away... :facepalm: and if someone says 'for immersion' one more time i will frenzy..it's not a legitimate reason, you can still 'immerse' yourself in the game without having naked characters... :rolleyes:

The same parents who don't notice the nvde, mutilated bodies skewered on poles in these same games?

Something is rotten in the State of Denmark folks. (making a Hamlett allusion, not actually slandering Denmark. From all accounts, the Danes are much more reasonable and liberal about nudity than. . . others one could mention).

Frankly, if your (not you specifically ComfyCouch, but the generic "you" as in general persons unspecified) sons or daughters are simulating dragging around a deceased, nvde Bosmer for personal gratifcation. . . It ain't the video game you need to be worried about. But what of it? If your son draws a picture of a Naked Woman, are you going to sue the BIC ballpoint pen company? And from there? Do we sue Nature Itself for the fact that sixual maturation tends to take place in the mid-teens rather than the mid-forties? At some point it just gets ridiculous, and the more often people sit about and pretend not to notice that The Emperor Has no clothes (pardon the pun) the longer he's going to parade around like a moron thinking that he's actually wearing magical clothes that only the truly great and wise can see.

The larger point is, the Devs should not be afraid to show a trace more skin. They are not going to get an A rating for moderate nudity.

Larger than that is the point that they should not have to worry about such silliness. There should not be any carding for the games, and there should never be worry that moderate nudity is going to garner a more severe rating than gratuitious and often explicit violence, language about violence etc. There is something seriously warped :chaos: about any rating system (and about those who uphold and/or contribute to it) that becomes squeemish or pseudo-sanctimonious about basic nudity, but quietly accepts blatant violence and gore. Institutionalized madness is still madness.

As to the comment someone made about not having to see their neighbours naked. . . all well and good. I don't have to watch my neighbours eat, swim or play chess either. All that said, if you went home tonight and, upon preparing for your shower, found an unremovable burlap sack where the middle region of your body used to be, you would run screaming to the nearest emergency room. :ahhh: :bolt:
Just saying.

It's not that everyone is a pervert if they wouldn't mind some nudity in a game, it does add to realism and it's more than appropriate if it fits within the game such as seductresses and so on. I mean think about it. How many times did you sneak into a house and find someone sleeping in their full clothes. Then the much rarer case of in their underwear. Well why not have an even rarer case where someone will be nvde, I mean it's not like it doesn't happen in real life (myself included hmy:) and if someone is going to be offended by simple nudity that rarely shows up in the game and only in appropriate places, then there can be a toggle for it.

I agree with what you said entirely except this last bit. How much can the burlap sack hold?

Stop doing that. You're undermining the op's original argument, which was very logical, well thought out, and made sense. Even though I disagree, and think that gamesas should just roll with the norms on this one and not add nudity, I still appreciated it was a valid and intelligent argument.

The main argument is that nudity is not porm, and that if parents consider it to be so, they should not let their child have a game with nudity. Not, "kids already look at porm, so there's no reason not to include nudity." In saying that in the manner you said it, you seem to equate the two, which is exactly the perception this thread is upset about.

I think it would bring a whole lot more controversy than anything it would bring to the game. I agree it's a bit ridiculous we can massacre innocent villagers but can't see a boob without there being a huge deal made of it, but that's just the way of society these days and it's not going to change anytime soon.
I say skip over the whole nudity deal and save them the trouble. Not entirely fair no, but it isn't needed for a good game (we got along fine without it in TES so far) and they won't have to deal with the backlash of parents that buy the game for their kid without reading the rating first and then [censored]ing about how their "sons or daughters are simulating dragging around a deceased, nvde Bosmer for personal gratifcation. . ." or other nonsense along the same lines.

Well partial nudity has been in Arena and Daggerfall.

They didn't do it showing people having six or anything, it was things like seductresses that were winged woman demons that had their briasts revealed and other things, which fits just fine without being unnecessary, which I think is just fine in a game. But when you put nudity in the game for the sake of nudity, that's when it gets to be a problem.

I think the guideline is "Can you fap to it?". In most games where nudity is present it's in a controlled cutscene where it's shown briefly, but what I think people talking about nudity in Skyrim are talking about is no female characters wearing bras, in which case you could kill a person, strip them naked, and stare at their nvde corpse as long as you want, and you know some sick f**k is going to pull his pants down and start jerking himself. Plus, do you really want to see a Khajiit or Argonian naked?

I have no problem with nudity in real life, hell, who doesn't love nudity.
But I don't want it in my video games. If I feel like getting my kicks off I'll do something in real life that involves nudity. I don't need a video game for that. Just stupid IMO.

Lets put it this way-

Why would you want to run around staring at a woman's briasts all day while breaking someone's neck in a questionable manner with your spikey blood caked mace?

I'd rather not see nudity simply because its irrelevant and takes away from their time spent on storyline creation(However little the time, its still important time spent). Gameplay =/= visuals IMO. I like decent visuals, but I don't like it to the point where they spent too much time and energy on the visuals, either way, that is only half relevant to the topic, the reason I'd say no to nudity is because the focus of the game is combat, questing, adventuring, dragon smashing and perhaps other, more shady things if thats what you do, and not, say, going to the strip joint and throwing septims at some harlet. XD

I know there was nudity in those games what I meant is MW and OB because most people today probably haven't played those (myself included), the difference from when they came out and now is that games weren't under so much scrutiny as they are today for unfounded reasons like causing violence and recklessness and what have you. If you reread my post again you'll notice I'm not against nudity I just think it would just be too much drama for BGS to deal with and it would hurt their sales, all for something that isn't needed for the game to be good. Like I said just skip over it. Not entirely fair maybe but worth saving the trouble it would cause if it were put in.

Yes. Its strange that people freak out if there is nudity but don't care when you blow limbs off and decapitate every living thing in a video game. :shrug:

I agree. To be honest, seeing someone's head fall off is more inappropriate than seeing a naked woman, but I don't care about other because its a game. Hehehe

An advlt rating is only possible for a PC games. Microsoft, Nintendo and Sony will not allow A rated games to be released for their systems.

I was so disappointed when there were no nipbles in Fallout 3!

Excellent points. ESPECIALLY your point about nudity not being pormography, but that still being the crux of the issue.

It is one of those "hate the sin not the sinner" type deals, but in this instance the nudity is no sin, and the "sinful" thoughts which it may arouse in viewers, natural and innate to mammals and to all humans aged puberty and up as they are, are the products of the way that those viewers think, NOT of the nvde imagery itself. If it is not depicting sixual content . . . then it isn't actually sixual content. It is just nudity, and is harmless and blameless. Will lots of people, both those desiring it and those detesting or decrying it, look at it and have sixual thoughts. Of course. And you know what. . . they were going to have sixual thoughts anyway, have already had them, and will continue to have them. If a person's thoughts are so sixually oriented that they are going to strip an AI NPC down to their barest essentials just to oggle them in an erotic manner. . . the mere fact that they are attempting to do so makes the censorship moot. Its like closing the barnyard door when the horses have already bolted and run afield. The person who strips down NPCs for any purpose related to the erotic is going to be thinking just as sixually about a character who is partially clothed in a loin garment or leather underpants, as they would about a completely nvde NPC. They might not get the same gratification, but that is beside the point. The point is, that the intended goal of curtailing "debauchourous thoughts" is not achieved by the removal of nudity, because the presence of nudity is not the source. The nudity only becomes eroticised when viewed by parties with, as the saying goes, "Lust in Their Hearts." And if you have lust in your heart. . . it is not going to go away because some game doesn't allow nudity, any more than the game allowing nudity will create an hitherto absent interest. This is more an indictment of the social mindset than the game, so I will not go too far off on this path, but your statement is full of truth and needed mentioning.

Your points are well made. And violence is certainly worse than nudity. The one being at all times an infringment and an evil, and the other being a blameless natural state.

Does Skyrim have to add nudity? No. But in refusing to do so it falls further short of realism than it has to, and supports an illogical and backwards ideology in the process.

Nudity doesn't always mean an advlt rating though.

Not only that, but has anyone heard of the "Hot Coffee Mod?"

It was a huge problem when GTA: San Andreas was first released. Im sure i dont need to tell you about how violent the Grand Theft Auto series is but check http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hot_Coffee_minigame_controversy out.

Its OK to have all this violence, but as soon as there is a FULLY CLOTHED "mini-game" they change the rating to AO. I'm not suggesting in any way that there should be something like this. Simply just saying that people have a huge problem with any hint of sixual content but extreme violence is just fine. I don't understand.

For one, Queen Victoria has been dead only 110 years.
Again with the "nudity" thing? It's pixels, people...

... funny things about immersion:

"you kill someone and take his/her clothes/armor, you should see 'em naked.." hmmm... of course, the clothes/armor fit you perfectly, whether you are a boy or a girl, they are clean, without a hint of the 20-30 whacks of a sword/axe it took you to kill the poor bastard, not a drop of blood... never mind fireballs.

"there's more nudity than violence in the world'... hmmm... bad comparison. Sure everyone gets naked, but internet porm notwithstanding, how many people get naked in public? Compared to public displays of violence... not even close, I don't think.

With a lead-in like that, I just have to post this link...

http://satwcomic.com/anything-but-that

What rating did GTA IV get? And what rating did Fallout 3 get?

:rofl:

oh and @DaMuncha

GTA IV got:
MATURE 17+
Blood
Intense Violence
Partial Nudity
Strong Language
Strong sixual Content
Use of Drugs and Alcohol

Fallout 3 got:
MATURE 17+
Blood and Gore
Intense Violence
sixual Content
Strong Language
Use of Drugs

i have all my games right next to me AT ALL TIMES

:rofl: Indeed :clap:

It depends on where you live and your interpretation of 'public'. Being a European and discounting sports, dares and sauna openness, I've still seen vastly more public nudity than I've seen public violence. Thankfully so!

:rofl:

Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha wha ha ha hahahahahahahah ha ha ha... hahahahahahahahaha

Soooooooooo Trueeeeeeeeee

In fact all of my Amnesia screen shots have been removed from Xfire.