any rebelling general would have to rely on the support of a province to bolster his province and provide food. Even in that situation, helseth would have to be relied on for an out of cyrodiil (I.E starting from a province goiing into cyrodiil) rebellion. The person with the best chance of seizing the palace is probably the commander of imperial forces in the Imperial city.

I don't want argue anymore becouse we will wait and see in the next Elder Scrolls what will happen. I simply want to show my position that Helseth does not have any arguments to be the next emperor:
- he is not imperial
- he doesn't have enough power(mainly military)
- he have to stop first the invasion of the Nords
- and Morrowind is in civil war by the moment
And I gave a example that any imperial general have more rights to be the next emperor becouse at least they have legions behind them.

Peace .

Why does an Imperial need to be emporer?
He does have power. The Dunmer can produce fierce defenses of their homeland.
Don't you think Morrowind would unite to support Helseth? You can bet your ass the first place he would look to secure is his homeland of Morrowind. Of course his people will support him and the Empire itself will support Helseth, as he is probably more pro-empire than anyone else.
I'm not saying he will be emporer, but his chances are just as good, if not better than anyone else.

By the way your first reason is the worst I have ever heard. Where is it said that the emporer must be an Imperial? Last time I checked it didn't matter who was in charge as long as they were fit to do the job. Also, Potentate Versidue Shaie was in control of the Empire for a time being, and he is Akaviri. So if a Tsaesci of Akavir can have the power over the Empire, why can't a Dunmer?

heh - a step into the lions' den

I read a book when I played Daggerfall that described a different background for Barenziah and Helseth and so I saw Barenziah as Empress ... it may be that in the many years since Daggerfall i mixed up my books ... but I have been suggesting that Helseth is a prime contender ... and not just fo rthat reason likely lost in the Dragon Break.

However, Morrowind has a small problem with Nords Invading as does Brittany. That may assist Helseth if they just hit on Redoran ... but if not? Remember that Helseth's sister beat him out of the Crown there ... what if she decides she wants to go for the Imperial slot? Wonder if Sis has her eye on Orsinium - wonder what the Orcs in that former Breton Territory want?

There is a Hist in the Imperial Capital for the first time ever known ... and it appears to be being treated like a tree ... oops it is - but what else is it?

Some Guy called The Precurser has arisen in Valenwood and says Yffre is re-awakening ... wonder what ideas Yffre has?

The Khajiit have been assisted by the Emperor in their reclaiming of land or stealing of land from Valenwood.

There are the Altmer who seem to think their time may be coming ...

Now you really have to wonder who is going to be brave enough to step up.

Guess the Empire would need another Hero otherwise I recon it's in very serious thingy.

And also you have to wonder how much of the Legions are left? Where were they during the Gates crisis - killed off or hiding or disbanded or trying to deal with other stuff?

Just a few details to be going on with.

Yes but the Emire of Tiber Septim was created by war. Why the Romans never had a Greek or Thracian emperor?

And who will be behind him House Indoril and House Redoran .House Telvanni which don't care much. I even think that House Hlaalu will more like to see him death.

there were several non-imperial emperors after Tiber, notably the empress Kintyra II, who was a dunmer. im not sure about the Roman empire, but i suspect they had emperors who were not 'roman.' i know other empires, such as the Egyptians, certainly did.

They had a Spainiard, Hadrian

Oh, snap! *edit- it was a bit harsh bliviongate:

Further more, the Romans are not the Cyrodiils.

@LadyN- Kintyra was already brought up and he didn't mind it.

Don't get me wrong I don't have anything against that the next Emperor to be from other race. But at least to have any reasonble reason(and should be different from that we saw only Helseth and he looks cool to some).
With the current situation I think that only Imperial could have any chance(if the Empire survive).





Hadrian's father was a cousin to the predecessor emperor. He was in Spain only like ruler of that region

Be careful some might start calling you a racist of elves or of Nords

"looks cool to some" really? Didn't know that was possible.. he sounds more like a tic to me. but that is my opinion.

So Helseth does not have a claim? Whatever, I thought it was obvious that claims no longer matter now that the dynasty is dead. A hand picked king's claim is better than a hand picked general.

About Hadrian... ok I'll take your word that he was not a spainiard. Then again I ask: Why do you compare the current situation in Cyrodiil to the Roman Empire? They are not anologous (much less now that the bloodline is dead). Best if you would compare it to the very very late romans, if any at all.

The Roman Empire probably had an emperor from each of the nationalities they conquered at one time or another.

:wacko:

Yeah! The British Empire conquered lots of people and colonized lots of places too, they must have had a king or queen in there from each colony they established. Long live the Malaysian king of England!

This topic is going, going... gone

I'll speculate the legion commanders in Morrowind decide their loyalty is better pledged to Helseth than Ocato. There's his army once the Houses are demolished.

Point taken, but the Gauls went to the circus in stone amphitheaters and spoke latin. The Malaysians never lived in stucco cottages, nor played cricket.

Jeeze, talk about absolutist logic!

However, I just woke up, and I don't see the point with what you posted there.

:wacko:

I also would say King Helseth, but ... It comes upon my mind that Uriel Septim probaly has niences and nephwes who also wants to claim the throne

Just three things. It's ridiculous to say a colony or conquered province "probably" gets to be emperor at some time or another. There's no reason to assume that at all, and it's much more likely the opposite is true, that the conquered never get a chance to be in charge. Next is how power changes hands, generally the powerful stay powerful is the name of the game, and another fills the spot vacated. Lastly it's very easy to look up the Roman emperors to prove or disprove your statement.

:thumbsup:
Well that was my point but it seems I was not able to explain it correctly.

There is something more from the rummors we know that Helseth with his allies were destroyed House Indoril and that mean that on the land of Dumner was probably a Civil war on the other side the Nords are attacking the north parts of Morrowind. So with so much problems how Helseth could has a chance to be Emperor.

Not to mention that Helseth couldn't even beat his step sister for the position of ruler of Wayrest. He hasn't got a prayer at becoming emperor. Of all the kings in Tamriel right now he's likely got the least chance of becoming emperor, he's inexperienced, clumsy in his dealings, and his power base isn't there. He would be the one bending over in the prison shower if he opposed someone for the job.

No it is not rediculous to say Helseth is plotting to be Emperor; it is not rediculous to say he will be. What is rediculous is that he cannot be because he is a Dunmer, therefore he has no claim to the "throne"? Why do you insist on reverting back to the arguement that because he is a Dunmer, he cannot be Emperor?

Enough of Rome, wikipedia is a click away for anyone who gives a [censored].

There was no Civil War in Morrowind. The only "war" we hear of is that between some Nords and Redoran, which works to Helseth's favor if you care to think about why, which you probably don't. Helseth does not even need an army, the Houses have been destroying eachother for years the old fashioned way, murder. Indoril was ruined because their medium of influence, the Temple, is no longer the force it once was before the Nerevarine. It had nothing to do with an epic battle between the houses and Helseth, that is not how these disputes are settled in Morrowind. Clumsy in his dealings indeed.

It worked a slightly different way Lord Hyamentar. I believe that Hadrian is a fine example of the way the Romans worked - they did not accept Kings from the Provinces - rather they associated their Great Men with a Province thus dignifying the Province by that association and providing the 'natives' with a 'home team leader' who really had nothing to do with them. The Roman attitude was that they were more likely to drag a Provincial King to Rome in chains and turn him into a slave if he did not know his place.

I would draw your atention to the little dinner party that Helseth held if you want to know why his sister won - there is a thread here that details that nicely. Helseth made serious mistakes with his sister - not likely to be repeated. So I would not call Helseth clumsy, so much as blatant - not necessarily the same thing.

Bretons founded one of the Great Imperial Dynasties did they not? If Helseth's sister and he came to an arrangement they might make a formidable team and sway others to their cause. Does anyone remember who Helseth's father was? He was very close to the Emperor - an Dunmer Imperial General - or was it Chancellor at one time?

This is not to say that Helseth has to try for it - just that if he can deal with the Nords - and there his sister is well placed that they can assist each other with a mutual offensive and once the Nords have weakened the Redoran sufficiently Helseth can then come to their assistance for example, thus gaining a new and trustworthy ally ... long shot that, but both have to be dealt with.

Redoran do not like Hlaalu - but they do like Barenziah and a 'Dunmer' if Helseth can be called that on the Imperial throne might suit them. Big question is Dres.

Helseth did not give a pig's toss about the Temple - look at his attitude to Almalexia - he knew they were a spent force.

So there are a few moves that Helseth might make - question is can he set aside old emnities and rally Morrowind to his banner? If he can then that might heal a lot of deep injuries in the Province in time to look at the big picture.

Very well put. I hadn't even thought of Helseth and Morgiah forming an allience.

Another good point is, who Helseth's father was. Anyone who thinks Helseth wouldn't be a good leader, just take a look at Symmachus. He was a great leader, friend and general of the Emperor Tiber Septim, and loyal to the Empire. His ties with the Empire just fasten the stranglehold Helseth has on the throne. Ok its probably not a stranglehold, but is there anybody who has more of a case to be Emperor? And don't say neices and nephews of Uriel, or generals in the Legion. Make a case for somebody else. Lets hear the other candidates, right?

I think you are over evaluating, everything. I didn't explicitly say, or state anything, and yet you are trying disprove... something I have said.

Moreover, what I was trying to convey, though it seems unsuccessful, was that general Roman attitude to the provinces wasn't a xenophobic, detached elitism, and that the Roman hierarchies had little qualms with natives rising to high ranks.

Hence probably.



I haven't actually gotten out a list of all the Roman kings and emperors to peer over whilst posting. Have you?

I think you will that find that not all of them were Italians.

Indeed. Most Emperors of the Roman Empire were born in Italia, however, some were born in many other places such as Africa and what is now called Hungary.
Maybe they were Italian and just born in other places, but either way that didn't stop them from gaining the throne.

The same case is applied for Helseth. He wasn't born in Cyrodill but that won't stop him from gaining the throne. IMHO

I was just pointing out how silly this sounded:So by nationalities you weren't talking about descendants born in the conquered countries, you're talking about the conquered people themselves.

Sure did.

I don't see how that matters, nobody said they were all Italians. I was contending the notion that all 46 (or however many appropriate for the time) provinces got a chance to contribute an Emperor.

It's the lineage involved, not the birthplace. Or a big army.

Everything else will stop him.