I agree, I like the idea where you're off into this foreign land with no purpose or anything. Then you stumble upon a series of events that lead you to an EPIC adventure.

It's nice to meet another person who can "feel" games. People usually start thinking I'm nuts when I tell them I can.

I have played Oblivion for more than 750 hours and absolutely adored the game. It was my first TES, i might add.

With that out of the way.

I love the "character skill driven" combat of Morrowind. I have no hopes of it returning in Skyrim since it would alienate a huge part of the market and be a really bad decision on Bethesdas part, but there you have it.

(Edit: They could get away with dropping the GPS, and I hope they do.)

I'll tackle Skyrim with that in mind and just enjoy the hell out of it.

As for the topic.
Todays market don't want Morrowinds style of "figure it out yourself" gameplay and we "old fashion gamers" will have to live with that.

Even though i prefer Oblivion, i am afraid i'll have go agree with this. I liked the way the main quest in Morrowind was just much more relaxed. Go to Balmora and find Caius Cosades or don't... heck even if you do, the guy will tell you that you are too green and should seek out some freelance work or join one of the guilds. In Oblivion you end up with an amulet in your pocket and the death emperors last wish fresh in memory. The only right thing to do is to seek out Jauffre and the main quest offers your character few breaks. I don't agree however, that this makes Morrowind a deeper game but it definitely gives an excuse to the adventurous, which is great because that is what the Elder Scrolls is all about.

The world building in Morrowind was more detailed. As in the different factions made sense in the setting. They felt blander in Oblivion; yes part of the blandness was logical the old corrupt mage guild but it missed some of the edge in Morrowind.
Now add that all the glitches and exploits in Morrowind had its own charm, the jump 3*100 spell was insanely fun, just the small thing like why don’t cars in Fallout New Vegas explode? Yes some does but far too few. Again a small thing, unrealistic but fun.

I still don't know why everyone goes how in Morrowind you start out with no direction. You've been told to meet with Caius Cosades in Balmora, they've even given directions how to get to Balmora.
Then Caius gives you a couple of gold and sends you off to do some other jobs, he even gives recomendations, which I liked, and I wouldn't mind something like that to return. Then he tells you where to go next...

Thing is, you've always been told where to go and what to do, there hardly where anything that you had to figure out yourself, other than the game mechanics as the tutorial was pretty weak.

...and I don't know what does this have to do with the feel of the game, this is more like the feel of the beginning...

This is true. But again Oblivion gave the player a great sense of urgency in killing an emperor right in front of you and his dying wish. Where as Morrowind it was "Well now that your out of prison go see this guy" and you dont find out too much until later.

This. Also Morrowind wasn't tuned to your level and you could find really powerful items in dungeons.

And get killed in a "WTF is that" moment. You see it, its big, you fight, you svck, you die.

"You are on your own now. Good luck!"

Once you exit the census and excise office.
I sold the package to Arille and forgot all about it untill months later.
Never did a game have this feeling of openness and freedom.

Hit on the head. I had long wondered what exactly it was about Oblivion that made it seem, for all it's advances in graphics and combat, inferior to Morrowind. I really didn't like the story in Oblivion, this is a game where I want to take my time and explore and I get thrown into crazy cultists assassinating an emperor and trying to stop the world from being literally destroyed? Maybe in another game, a linear game, this would have been a good story but there was simply too much to do to have this to worry about. I mean literally I'm told to go rescue Martin and I could leave that gate open for years and he will still be fine and ok it was a little annoying.

The other thing about Oblivion is the "factions" were all totally and completely boring. Mages guild and Fighters guild... cool. The theives guild wasn't bad but most of the quests weren't terribly engaging until the last like 3 or 4 (I can't remember). The Dark Brotherhood had some outstanding quests (the first half...), but it came with the generic traitor plot twist plus the last half you weren't even engaging with anyone you just got notes and went to kill people you knew nothing about. There was nothing really especially interesting about any of them, unlike the Morag Tong or the Houses.

With Skyrim, I'll be happy so long as I'm not thrown in with some blades guy telling me how dragons are going to destroy the world instantly and I have to stop it RIGHT NAO! What I'll be happy with is you meet some guy who has some knowledge of the elder scrolls and sends you to learn more about the dragons, the grey beards, and whatever else we may not know BEFORE the story becomes all about the brutal destruction of the world.

They have a lot to work with, I'm not going to get my hopes up and wish for a faction like the East Empire Company (that was my favorite Raven Rock was so fun) but I really hope we have more than four bland choices, I'd really like to see Nord, Imperial, and Mer factions at the very least that behave similar to the houses in Morrowind.

yah

it was awesome how the game "unraveled" in MW while in OB the big stuff start from the get go

So, what stops you to just forget about the amulet of kings?

The fact that its stuck in my inventory?

Keep it as a memento, and ignore it?

The nice thing about Morrowind was the "frontier" feel, being dropped off in Seyda Neen with no idea what to do. Right from the beginning you encounter all of these eccentrics such as Fargoth and Hrisskar Flat-foot, and start to get an idea of what the different races are like and hear a little bit about politics. Wandering through the Bitter Coast with only the faintest of directions, I have fond memories of arriving in Balmora at night just as it started to rain - and finding myself out on the barren streets with the glow of lanterns in the distance was really the moment when I realized how great this game was going to be.

I remember walking into a shop, and liking how there was such an odd assortment of things - whilst I suppose Oblivion had its fair share of general stores, one thing I loved about Morrowind's traders is that lots of them had a very random assortment of things such as silverware and books, even if that wasn't what their shop specialized in. I felt like I was browsing a local flea market, finding little traces of culture interlaced into everything.

Even in Arena/Daggerfall, the cities were so vast that you were still overcome with this "overwhelming" feeling when you first made your way out into the world, as you did in Morrowind despite the fact these games had conventional medieval settings. I'm hoping that, with Skyrim's cities being so much larger in scope and NPCs having more to do, we'll have this wonderful feeling again. Finding entire streets lined with shops, bustling markets filled with characteristic NPCs, peculiar trinkets everywhere. Does anybody else really miss the colored lanterns from Morrowind, for example?

Whilst all the games have equally open worlds for the most part, Morrowind was interesting in that there was still some progression going on - you started out as a nobody with nobody to trust, but gradually you started to become familiar with what to expect from different factions and the Great Houses. There was some development on a personal level too, with the Dagoth Ur dream sequences and the gradual realization that you're the Nerevarine. In Oblivion, everything is just kind of there for you from the git-go. There's nothing wrong with that, but between the level scaling the urgency in the Main Quest it felt as if the world was a bit more static.

Morrowind plays better than Oblivion in a few places, but for the most part Oblivion is more fun "as a game". I can jump into Oblivion whenever I want, but I will only ever play Morrowind if I have several hours set aside and I have a compelling plan for my character set out before me. The way I see it, Morrowind was written to be a world first and a game second, which is why it can be quirky and inconsistent in places. Oblivion tried to be a bit more consistent, much to my disappointment.

Quit nitpicking?
Ive said before that I feel your mode of conversation is akin to a political debate. You never have any interest in what anyone has to say, as long as your point is perceived 'best'. And therefore you insert a crowbar in carefully selected minutia and ignore everything else.
So I humoured you and gave an example not mentioned before. But, as is your wont, it is immediately refuted again.

Like you ignore how people have stated a few times that the Morrowind quest did not have the sense of urgency the Oblivion quest had, and thats just a fact. The way the story is written.
Just.. let it go man, sheesh.

Glad to see some people not Blinded by Graphics and gameplay and even more so saying Morrowinds Gameplay svcks When most games of the time were exactly like that, not to mention it was the only open world game of such expanse back in the day, all Oblivion has over Morrowind is Graphics and gameplay, aspects that are a given with time, Had Oblivion been made at the same time exactly as is -without- the Graphics,Gameplay, and voice acting Morrowind would Triumph even farther, I don't even think anyone can say it wouldnt with a straight face provided they read my statement properly.

Then why haven't you said that?

By the way, I would argue about the sense of urgency too at the beginning. You're given a package, to give to somebody and you've been told how this is Emperor's orders and very important. After that things get more relaxed, I agree.

It's just that everybody goes how everything is more open at the very beginning but really, Oblivion is just as open if you ignore the main quest.


So if Oblivion wouldn't be Oblivion, it would be a lame version of Morrowind... :confused:

I hope the execution is only that, an execution because of past crimes. Delving deeper into who wanted you executed will reveal a story, but you actually need to search for it a bit. I don't want to be forced into anything, that's not what TES is about for me.

I think the increased emphasis on culture will do a lot to bring back the feeling that made MW so immersive.

I just hope they don't skimp on it. Things like children having to work and learn a trade (as mentioned in the children topic) and a big age difference between husbands and wives (girls being married off at age 13, etc.), especially among nobles, would do a lot to jar people out of the typical "modern world lifestyles and values in a medieval setting" garbage that passes for fantasy culture in most video games.

And let's hope they don't downplay religion. A bigger emphasis on beliefs, burial practices, religious tensions, etc. is essential, as religion is usually one of the most fundamental building blocks of a culture.

I personally couldn't care less if they dropped the execution point entirely and never brought it up in the game again. We should have full control over our characters' background, and aside from the whole Dovahkiin thing there isn't exactly any other objective excuse for people trying to kill you.

Hopefully, when Esbern rescues you it won't be even more sudden a jump into the main quest than Oblivion's dungeon was. I'd rather he not swing onto the execution platform Robin Hood-style and escape with you out into the wilderness with guards and dragons everywhere, and then him telling you he's rescued you because you're the Dovahkiin or he "has a feeling" you're part of a prophecy or some nonsense. Total garbage. Being a Blades member, I'd much rather he pull some strings with the law and your character is simply released and thrown out onto the street, with you having no idea what to do next. He wouldn't contact you again until much later. Daggerfall-style!

That′s like if Frodo had just kept the ring as a memento and ignored it after Gandalf told him it was the ring of power.

"Yeah, I′ll just keep it in the envelope on the cabin, maybe even put it inside of it, then I′m gonna smoke some fine pipe-weed, laugh merrily with Sam and knock boots with some Hobbit wenches. Aaaahhhh good times."

Those that like to immerse themselves in the game would be greatly disturbed by the lack of Ring Wraiths knocking on the doors to pay them a visit, but I suppose that′s how it goes in games. So I′m starting to think it may be even better then to have the dragons destroy Skyrim if you don′t face them soon enough, if we don′t get to choose when the main quest goes into full momentum and when it doesn′t.

This....

I liked Morrowind a bit better then Oblivion, but Morrowind wasn't without its flaws either.

no one is claiming Morrowind had no flaws what so ever, the point is Morrowinds -feel- was much more apparent, it was -there- akin to Oblivion's....blandness, I still think to this day had Beth kept to lore, Oblivion would be BRIMMING with its own distinct and true to TES feel, undoubtedly.


that said I also feel, if one puts away preconceptions and accepts Oblivion as is, one will find it has its glimmer too