Sometimes people complain about the lack of political intrigue in Oblivion like it had been in Morrowind. And I agree. And there a lot of potential since the game was set in the province of Cyrodiil.

It could've been great. And in fact there are several things that were in the game already, but Bethesda didn't do anything with them.

Ocato and the Palace council chamber: He's sitting there doing his important business (nothing) in a large room with a whole bunch of empty chairs. A lot could've been done with the whole Oblivion crisis thing and the different city rulers (and Ocato) trying to push their own personal political agenda during the main quest.

Gellius Terentius: The son of the Bravil count is a skooma addict. Aside from a rumour and loading screen message, and the fact that you can see him drinking, there's nothing that can be done and people don't seem to care.

Countess Alessia Caro:She hates Khajiit and Argonians. In Leyawiin castle there's even a In the town itself some people are also not so happy about the beast races.

Lady Llathasa Indarys: The wife of Count Andel Indarys, who died when she fell of the stairs. According to an in game rumor however she may have been pushed, by the count himself possibly. It is also strongly hinted at that the Count is aware of the presence of the Dark Brotherhood sanctuary.

Why didn't Bethesda expand on any of those things? They started something that had great potential, but then just decided to... stop.

Any thoughts?

first of all i capture your earth djiin from your avatar as i still need 1 at lost age
but back to the topic
i think they just saw no potantialin continuing in oblivion as they had fallout3 and the the DLC's by then wile the DLC's are now over i think there now focus on the rumored ellderscroll V so think atm they dont have intress in that anymore
a other explanation i think could give is that thise leave some fantasy for the modders comunity
other than that i dont know

ps sorry of the bad spelling

What I meant was for this to be part of the original game, not as a DLC/Expansion thing.

Me and Malchik (who wrote the quests) adressed many of these things in our Kragenir's Death Quest mod (Gellius, Llathasa, Leyawiin's beast race 'problem'). So these things have been on my mind now which is what made me realize what could've been.

then again wich game doesnt have loose ending parts at some places? also tought in the beginning they mention they had a season event in oblivion were every1 was suposenly wearing masks but that part also never came in the game

and still im gona get that earth djiin of yours

Both Daggerfall and Morrowind had political factions, as did Redguard have political stories and interactions. Oblivion is the outlier in this aspect, and I was very disappointed that it lacked politics. TES V ought to have politics, I just can't see a world that Infernal City describes not being full of political turmoil for the player to experience. And its not as if Oblivion wasn't rife with potential. The freaking Emperor was assassinated and there was no heir. What more do you want? Honestly, there should have been an immediate power race within the game and associated political factions.

sorry my bad i misunderstoot politics for potantial
but yea awell oblivion is now behind us i just hope if elderscroll v becomes skyrim that we still have some nord versus redoran rebelion fights

What kind of intrigue? The counts and countess are given territory and power by the government, they don't fight each other for it.

Pft, since when did politicians obey authority? Of course they'll be at each other's throats - import, export, taxes, duties, land, resources, border disputes, who can one-up whom, old rivalries, petty revenge for not being invited to a birthday party, you name it. If one count can convince the Council that another count is incompetent, then the first count can put forward his own candidate. It's all about land and power. TESIV's portrayal of a believable political system is abysmal.

They're Counts, not Councilers. They're basically governers given jurisdiction of a county, and the government can take it away if they wish. The intrigue would happen with the Elder Council, where the heart of the action is (although that's another can of worms). Counts pretty much just stay where they are and try to hold on to what they have.

Ha! The "government" wishes it could. Only if it's got a large enough army. These aren't the States, or counties, or what-have-you in 1st and 2nd world countries. The counties in Cyrodiil existed before the Septims, right?

Technically, wouldn't the "king' of a country in feudal times in Europe have the power to take away land? Yeah, okay, and he probably could... for lesser nobility, and only if the higher nobility royally screwed up (treason). You get a feudal structure here, delegation. The Emperor is too busy managing external politics to care what his nobility is doing - as long as it isn't to the detriment of the empire as a whole, they can do power grabs. Think of the Roman Empire, Medieval Europe, any empire. There's plenty of political intrigue going on at EVERY level.

This is more than a feudal kingdom, it's an empire. The counts don't even have armies, just city and castle guards. In addition, most of them are not career politicians, but either married into or were born into it, and more concerned with local or even personal matters than intrigue. Like completing an Akaviri collection, or finding a stolen painting, or a cure for vampirism, or trying to stamp out banditry, or drinking.

I really like this. Also there was some corruption in the Legion and that could have played in as well.

It appears they saved all the epic civil war stuff for the book, from what I've heard.

SPOILERS AHEAD (If you haven't completed the Oblivion Main Quest, but if you haven't, what is wrong with you?):

I mean come on. No emperor? Not only that but it is public knowledge that he was assasinated and his heir is out of commision too?

There should have been a major power struggle. I mean you got the Imperial Legion, the Fighters Guild, the Blades, the Blackwood Company. I mean is the Elder Coucil really in control of the Imperial Legion? I don't think so. After all you have Knights of the Imperial Dragon. Besides, who would legionairres listen too in the absence of an emperor, their commander or some far away politicians? Not too mention you have/had the Blackwood Company, which could be hired for a coup. Plus the Blades owe their loyalty primarily to the Emperor, not the council. There were so many possibilities for attempted coups. They should have made it a more factional struggle that grows after Mehrunes Dagon is defeated. The Main Quest shouldn't have ended with Mehrunes Dagon. There should have been a struggle with not clear demarcation of good and evil. We should have gotten an expanded main quest instead of Knights of the Nine (though it was cool).

EDIT:
From UESP 'Elder Council':
"In the event the Elder Council is forced to assume a position of regency over the Empire, a state of martial-law is enacted, the Elder Council exercising complete control over the Imperial Army and Navy. Furthermore, said regency will remain until such time as the Council should deem any individual fit to preside as Emperor, as mandated by ancient custom. In order to ensure that the Empire is never left ungoverned, the Amulet of Kings was created to inform the members of the Elder Council in the event the current Emperor perishes."

This kind of system would not be politically sustainable, especially without there ever being another emperor. "Complete control over the Imperial Army and Navy?" Give me a break, is the Imperial Legion composed entirely of mindless lemmings, especially after the end of the Septim line?

Which brings us back to the question... Why did we not get to see the destruction of the Empire in Oblivion? Not from Mehrunes Dagon, but from within!

They couldv'e done what they did with Daggerfall and had a et of endings, one for each ruler

EDIT: They left these as loose ends to release TES4 for the Silly eason

The only counts who would be ambitious enough to think about going their own ways would be Count Indarys (Because he's a Hlaalu, and therefore a career politician) and Count Caro (because he feels County Leyawiin is being neglected by the Empire).

... in addition to any amount of lesser ambitious nobles who'd like to raise in power.

Just look at the events in the "A Song of Ice and Fire" series from George R. R. Martin. This is what should happen in Cyrodiil when the Emperor dies without heirs.

I agree, the palace roundtable shouldve been something more than something you would just dance on...

I also have strong doubts whether the Elder Council would be so quick to relinquish all that power and authority once it came to them, and as such would probably be unwilling to deem anyone fit for assuming the role of Emperor.

For a while, there were points in TES history where the emperor was pretty much a figure-head. Hell, the council had been running the empire towards the end of Uriel's days.

The point behind the whole thread is: the game did NOTHING with the political situation. SO MUCH wasted potential. The very core of the Empire, with all of the backstabbing, bickering, power-grabbing, and intrigue that should have involved, and we got NOT EVEN A GLIMPSE of any of it. The Elder Council "existed" in name only, Ocato made a token appearance, and that whole potential source of quests for the various councillors and competing nobles and factions struggling for dominance in the wake of the loss of the Emperor was thrown away.

The worst thing about Oblivion was that it "defined" the Imperial Province, and now it's too late to go back and do it "right".

The counts DO have armies. http://uesp.net/wiki/Oblivion:Allies_for_Bruma#Cities You need to close all the Oblivion gates near the cities and in return they send some soldiers. Every city state has its army, although some garrisons will be smaller than others.

The reason the counts (and countesses) are only concerned with local, banol matters is because Bethesda chose so. If the proportions of Cyrodiil were larger (both in number of people as geographic size) to a realistic degree, you'd see how foolish Bethesda's choice would be.

There are so many mines, ruins, caves and so on in Cyrodiil. There's treasure, ore and loot to be found everywhere. Don't you think there wouldn't ever be a feud between Bravil and Leyawiin (for example) because one operates a mine out of its region?
If they simply would've copied Hlaalu's questline from Morrowind, and modified it so it fits a certain city/town, there would've been a so much richer and intriguing political structure.

Adrian

if the counts, Cyrodiil and politics had been fleshed out alot more Oblivion could have been a more interesting game besides going to the same generic hell level 1256 times.

and do remember that the counties where once independant kingdoms before being unified under the empire, of course there would be internal strife between them.

and also why must the political strife occur just in Cyrodiil? why no news about how Count of Leyawiin have allied with the Bosmer/Redguard to grab some land in Hammerfell/Valenwood, or count of Bruma negotiating with Skyrim for assimilation? rumors about the legion breaking up to fight for different factions and whatnot? some legion general rising up to attempt to grab the imperial throne?

I just have to share http://www.gamesas.com/bgsforums/index.php?s=&showtopic=786130&view=findpost&p=11433683, because it's brilliant. Yes, wasted potential. I recall a suspicious mage, in Bravil's court, or something of the like. The most made of it was a single quest, and that was for the thieves guild.

But now there is no figure head. There's nobody important but Ocato really. You can't have much of a power behind the throne thing if there is no throne. All you would need is some popular figure, who maybe claims that he is descended from the Septims to have a coup. The best way for the Elder Council to maintain power is to have a figurehead. Without one, I don't think people will have much faith in them.

EDIT: On another note, Morrowind's MQ also had some wasted potential. Why is the player invited numerous times to join Dagoth Ur but never allowed to?