Official TES MultiplayerCo-op Thread

Post » Thu May 03, 2012 3:13 am

I'd love to see something like what was done with Neverwinter Nights 1, with the relatively small, dedicated servers. Skyrim would make a wonderful persistent world if they could somehow implement the dungeon master utility.

Even something as simple as being able to connect to 1 or 2 friends would be great. I know my brother loves the game as much as I do.

Also, I don't know why everyone starts thinking of WoW whenever multiplayer is mentioned, i'm pretty sure Todd Howard already mentioned that making any TES into an MMORPG is not an option. And... seriously WoW? C'mon now you guys must be joking.
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Suzie Dalziel
 
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Post » Thu May 03, 2012 10:02 am

it shouldent be that hard to implement co-op into the ES series all they would have to do is up the difficulty of the monsters and maybe reduce the gold income you get from doing quests and selling stuff but mutliplayer a server with 1000 people on it is a whole different story the map would have to be much bigger make way more monsters and get rid of all the exploits such as the iron dagger smithing exploit for example but they problaly couldent do it in this es but maybe the next
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Claire Mclaughlin
 
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Post » Thu May 03, 2012 3:57 pm

Good for you? You don't have to play the MP and if implementing a MP and making a [censored] load more money, but losing you was the price they had to pay, they'd do it in a second.

Everybody against MP makes it seem like they HAVE to play it. That the singleplayer mode is completely removed and that isn't the case. You all also seem to think that we want Wow - which is just plain, [censored] moronic

No, everyone who doesn't want multiplayer know that any resources put towards multiplayer will take away from singleplayer. You can't create work out of thin air. Singleplayer WILL suffer with the addition of multiplayer.
That's why no one wants it.

Todd Howard expresses this clearly.
"You can never say never to anything like that," he admitted, "but it's not what our focus is. This type of game is where our hearts are, what we get excited about, and that's what we want to focus on. We don't want to lose that focus and we never want to sacrifice anything in the singleplayer game just to have it be multiplayer."
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elliot mudd
 
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Post » Thu May 03, 2012 7:03 am

A good multiplayer with maximum 3 friends would be awesome.
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Niisha
 
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Post » Thu May 03, 2012 3:16 pm

All I want is a short separate co-op storyline where you can run around Tamriel with a friend or 2 slaying monsters and decapitating bandits and after you finish the main quests you can still run around exploring and what not. If its made like WOW where there are 100 different people running around at the same time it would just ruin everything. Somebody also said something about a PVP type thing, but if they did that it should just be like the arena battles from Oblivion, where its 1-on-1 or you and a friend take on waves of different monsters.
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Lance Vannortwick
 
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Post » Wed May 02, 2012 11:51 pm

A quick reminder

Some discussion of the viability of multiplayer is alright, although it is best if this is in response to someone asking why multiplayer shouldn't happen, or suggesting that it would be easy to implement. Luke Skyrimmer's post a bit above this is a good example - he points out that adding multiplayer would requires taking considerable resources away from other features. Backing his assertion up with a developer quote is particularly helpful.

However, the purpose of this thread is to discuss multiplayer and the Elder Scrolls. The occasional comment on the problems of adding multiplayer is fine, but this discussion shouldn't be overrun with people saying they don't want multiplayer. I've deleted a number of posts, whenever this thread veers in this direction it becomes a mess. People should be able to discuss their ideas without someone running in and saying they don't want multiplayer at all.
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Suzie Dalziel
 
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Post » Thu May 03, 2012 11:54 am

It would be so amazing if they made a Co-op or Multiplayer online. I think there would be way too much lagging and glitches.
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Marnesia Steele
 
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Post » Thu May 03, 2012 12:06 pm

I just want to be able to play along with 1, maybe 2 other friends...would be fun! :)
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Alba Casas
 
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Post » Thu May 03, 2012 1:28 pm

Personally I am in favor of co-op with only 2 people if they were to ever do that. My reason being is that there is no need for more than 2 people playing together. Its messed up for people to think multiplayer is for sure meant for The Elder Scrolls series, because its really not the style of the game it has basically a limitless world to it and I love that I can explore places Iv never seen before or I can go to places Iv been before and have a little fun. But, overall I think it would be cool to have a co-op with a limit to 2 people and no more.
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matt oneil
 
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Post » Thu May 03, 2012 7:02 am

I just want to be able to play along with 1, maybe 2 other friends...would be fun! :smile:
It would be so amazing if they made a Co-op or Multiplayer online. I think there would be way too much lagging and glitches.
Co-op yes ~http://i271.photobucket.com/albums/jj125/Gizmojunk/multiplayer.jpg... I hope not for I'd not wish that on anyone. RPGs have their moments of intense action, but that stuff interferes with any other aspect except melee.
Now that Skyrim does not pause the world for dialog, it would seem that two players could visit merchants separately or not sit on pause ~waiting for the other to finish talking.

Still... These games have exceptionally interactive environments. The games would have to sync an awful lot of things... Just imagine two players in a room full of cups and dishes fighting bandits ~or each other. The games would have to sync up all the Havok changes to the clutter (to be accurate); they could fake it, but it would be odd to see the other player pick up a bucket from across the room because its in a different place in their game... Imagine if it were weapons or valuables and not clutter.

Side by side Co-op could be cool ~especially if it could be run on separate monitors ~ but who has a machine for that!? You would want some special build designed to run on non-sli twin graphics cards and two monitors ~or a split screen that would have to take a crazy performance hit for rendering two FPP cameras.
(Or perhaps it could be on SLI split side by side across two screens?)

If only the world was not so detailed. What if Multiplayer co-op mode disabled ALL havok, and made clutter and dropped items static until picked up? Essentially: What if it stipped down the game to the bare minimum that was practical... would it be as fun?
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W E I R D
 
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Post » Thu May 03, 2012 7:22 am

Side by side Co-op could be cool ~especially if it could be run on separate monitors ~ but who has a machine for that!? You would want some special build designed to run on non-sli twin graphics cards and two monitors ~or a split screen that would have to take a crazy performance hit for rendering two FPP cameras.
(Or perhaps it could be on SLI split side by side across two screens?)

Gizmo I can see what you mean about multiplayer and the different monitors but what about when it comes to console people like me? I play PS3 not computer so that wouldnt be possible for the system to do... You see what I mean? But, that would be really cool so kudos to you :D
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Elizabeth Falvey
 
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Post » Thu May 03, 2012 9:59 am

Gizmo I can see what you mean about multiplayer and the different monitors but what about when it comes to console people like me? I play PS3 not computer so that wouldnt be possible for the system to do... You see what I mean? But, that would be really cool so kudos to you :biggrin:
The PS3 (as I understand it ~which is nil), has a split memory pool that is restrictive for a game like this. I have to assume that double camera gameplay does in fact double some aspects of what they have to store in RAM ~though probobly not the textures. I got the distinct impression that they managed to get it to work on the PS3 by slim margin... I don't think they could have done so with even the most minimally functional Co-op option*. I don't think it is an option.

*Unless... they tried it with a forced third person view, and no split screen; how would menus work?.
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Mrs. Patton
 
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Post » Thu May 03, 2012 3:41 am

Luke Skyrimmer's post a bit above this is a good example - he points out that adding multiplayer would requires taking considerable resources away from other features. Backing his assertion up with a developer quote is particularly helpful.

The developer quote didn't say that though.

we never want to sacrifice anything in the singleplayer game just to have it be multiplayer.


I point this out because it's a big point of contention. Multiplayer won't necessarily take resources away from other features. There's no confirmation here that multiplayer will sacrifice anything from singleplayer, people are just reading that into it. Imagine simply adding the ability to co-op or join privately hosted servers, without doing anything else to the game as far as balance or content. You take what Skyrim already is and slap a multiplayer feature on to it. That's it. An even better example would be for the developers to finish the work that some modders started in trying to introduce multiplayer. That's all that's needed.

If the developers want to balance the game for multiplayer, then yes it could take resources away. It's not necessary though. Modders and world builders can take care of that. There's no need for resources to be taken away from the single player game. If anyone is familiar with Neverwinter Nights they know what I mean when I mention the potential of TES as a multiplayer game, and for those that aren't familiar with it, well you'll stay in the dark about this and really only have MMOs as comparisons. NWN was the best multiplayer RPG I've ever played, and that's because TES is perpetually single player only. TES can easily take that crown with it's more powerful CK and more dedicated modding community. No contest really.

Maybe the question should be: "What would have to be sacrificed in singleplayer to make the game multiplayer?" I can't think of a thing personally.
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Olga Xx
 
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Post » Thu May 03, 2012 7:50 am

I think what happens is you should be aloud to invite your friend to a steam xbox or psn party and invite them to your world and the monsters could be more difficult for every person that joins it should be kinda like black ops zombies and you could invite 4 people and do quests with them and stuff
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Harinder Ghag
 
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Post » Thu May 03, 2012 5:21 am

i think if there going to make a multiplayer it should be a dlc with no content in it because it would waste a lot of singleplayer experience
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Stephy Beck
 
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Post » Thu May 03, 2012 5:41 am

No, everyone who doesn't want multiplayer know that any resources put towards multiplayer will take away from singleplayer. You can't create work out of thin air. Singleplayer WILL suffer with the addition of multiplayer.
That's why no one wants it.

Todd Howard expresses this clearly.

not if MP is an alternative to a companion. and also if you will be able to recruit follower /tropes to mack bigger battles .... then some friends join the run will only be an alternative to fill out the spots what you can bring to


All I want is a short separate co-op storyline where you can run around Tamriel with a friend or 2 slaying monsters and decapitating bandits and after you finish the main quests you can still run around exploring and what not. If its made like WOW where there are 100 different people running around at the same time it would just ruin everything. Somebody also said something about a PVP type thing, but if they did that it should just be like the arena battles from Oblivion, where its 1-on-1 or you and a friend take on waves of different monsters.
battle-

a yes that a nice idea ... to unlock a co-op townbuilder/questing thing when main quest line is done....


A quick reminder

However, the purpose of this thread is to discuss multiplayer and the Elder Scrolls. The occasional comment on the problems of adding multiplayer is fine, but this discussion shouldn't be overrun with people saying they don't want multiplayer. I've deleted a number of posts, whenever this thread veers in this direction it becomes a mess. People should be able to discuss their ideas without someone running in and saying they don't want multiplayer at all.

yes maybe open a new topick for them to talk about whay not MP



Still... These games have exceptionally interactive environments. The games would have to sync an awful lot of things... Just imagine two players in a room full of cups and dishes fighting bandits ~or each other. The games would have to sync up all the Havok changes to the clutter (to be accurate); they could fake it, but it would be odd to see the other player pick up a bucket from across the room because its in a different place in their game... Imagine if it were weapons or valuables and not clutter.


i think they have to mack one the grope leader and every thing have to go via him/hear
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Izzy Coleman
 
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Post » Thu May 03, 2012 5:04 am

Multiplayer won't necessarily take resources away from other features. There's no confirmation here that multiplayer will sacrifice anything from singleplayer, people are just reading that into it. Imagine simply adding the ability to co-op or join privately hosted servers, without doing anything else to the game as far as balance or content.
Implamenting multiplayer would take developer resources, a lot of developer resources, and these then become developer resouces that can't be spent on other features.

First, you need the basic multiplayer code. I don't know how difficult this is, but it's still work that needs to be done.

Second, you need the rest of the engine to support multiplayer. This is difficult, and in the case of the Elder Scrolls it prevents Bethesda from streamlineing the game engine for single player. Currently the game only ever needs to worry about one player, the scripting system only ever has to worry about one player, and objects don't need to be tracked across multiple computers. Terrain, NPCs, and objects also only need to be loaded around one player, and if the system needs to juggle more balls it would really ramp up the hardware requirements.

Third, you need this to work smoothly. Multiplayer isn't something you slap on and it works great, and I suspect in a game like Skyrim it's particularly difficult to get everything running smoothly.

And finally you have the potential for design and balancing issues. Are locations large enough for four people to run around them? How should difficulty be scaled? How does the AI deal with the increased difficulty of two or more fully developed characters? Some of this needs to be considered anyway for companions, but they aren't nearly as formidable as a player both in terms of stats and intelligence.


As I mention in the opening post it's a real shame I can no longer find the Soldier of Fortune 2 portmortem online because it does an excellent job of discussing just how time-consuming it was for them to implament multiplayer. And this was with a game engine specifically built for multiplayer, so they didn't even have most of the hurdles Bethesda would. If Bethesda wanted their next engine to include multiplayer they'd have to put a fair amount of resources towards this, which would mean those resouces aren't being spent on other features. Perhaps if Skyrim had multiplayer we wouldn't have radiant quests. Or maybe they would have had to hire more programmers at the expense of designers or artists.

Now Bethesda may decide one day that this is worth pursuing. However I've been following their comments on this matter for a while and they've made it very clear, in my opinion, that they aren't interested in dividing their focus. If we do see another multiplayer Elder Scrolls game I suspect it will be a spin-off developed by one of their sister companies, and not part of the core series. (Note, there's precedence for this. The last multiplayer Elder Scrolls title was Shadowkey, developed by Vir2L.)
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Tiff Clark
 
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Post » Thu May 03, 2012 11:39 am

I don't understand how some people don't like the idea of Skyrim multyplayer
i mean think about it, and i mean think really hard until it hurts:P
how EPIC would it be to like start a clan take over a castle and then go attackt like other players and then the will get mad and the will come to attack your castle
how fricking epic would it be to be fighting with a other player and just after you defeated him there shows up a dragon
like give me a break, it would be epicness after epicness.
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Liii BLATES
 
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Post » Thu May 03, 2012 9:24 am

I would love for skyrim to have multiplayer option. For those who voice against it shouldn't play if they think it's going to ruin the game. That means that less lag and more enjoyable for those who actually want MMO since the servers will be less pack.
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Mashystar
 
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Post » Thu May 03, 2012 1:52 am

And finally you have the potential for design and balancing issues. Are locations large enough for four people to run around them? How should difficulty be scaled? How does the AI deal with the increased difficulty of two or more fully developed characters? Some of this needs to be considered anyway for companions, but they aren't nearly as formidable as a player both in terms of stats and intelligence.

Your first three issues are genuine issues without real solutions. The last one though, the one I quoted, shouldn't be an issue. Let the modders and world builders take care of design and balancing issues. For me, I would prefer playing in custom worlds, like I did in NWN. I never played NWN multiplayer in it's single player world, it was always custom built worlds, rather good ones too, full of custom textures, classes, spells, models, sounds etc. not to mention quests and items.

That's what I'm talking about in regards to TES multiplayer. The incredible power of the CK along with the talent of the modders would make for some incredible multiplayer worlds. The single player world, quite frankly, would not work. It's not designed for multiplayer, nor would I ever want it to be. Code to allow multiplayer, with perhaps an ingame server browser, is all that's needed. I don't remember if NWN had an ingame server browser or not (it's been years), but something similar to what that had would work. From there let the modders and world builder do their stuff, and pretty soon we'd have a bunch of incredible custom worlds to choose from.

I played on a hybrid LOTR server, so customized you'd hardly recognize it as NWN. It went so far as to have reincarnation options for when your character reached max level. If you started out as an orc in the service of Mordor you could eventually reincarnate into an undead through a chain of reincarnations, or an elf druid could eventually reincarnate into an ent. There was tons of customized content for that server, and I'd say 40 people or so playing at peak hours. It was eventually shut down then changed due to fears of cease and desist orders, but it was the best multiplayer RPG experience I've ever had, and that was with the lousy NWN engine and it's mediocre CK. I used to drool thinking about what it would have been like had Morrowind allowed multiplayer the same way.
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Jeremy Kenney
 
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Post » Thu May 03, 2012 1:10 am

Your first three issues are genuine issues without real solutions. The last one though, the one I quoted, shouldn't be an issue. Let the modders and world builders take care of design and balancing issues.
I actually used to espouse something rather similar during the Morrowind days. However back then PCs were the primary design platform, and PC gamers made up the majority of the audiance. Neither of these are true any more, and it doesn't make sense for Bethesda to do so much work when it would only be available to a fraction of the community.
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Jack Bryan
 
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Post » Thu May 03, 2012 8:56 am

I read the explanation as to why bathesda didnt add Co-op .

Is it possible however to just add Co-op as a DLC however the only thing you can do in Co-op is dungeons? You know just choose who you wana play with and what dungeons to do maybe add some new ones just for Co-op. Or maybe add some quests (on DLC) that you get on your own but need to do Co-op inoder to complete.
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Ezekiel Macallister
 
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Post » Thu May 03, 2012 10:51 am

Beside the obvious hardware problem of creating a world in which multiple players could adventure, or even a dungeon for starters there is a big gameplay problem that Skyrim have right now - the menu. The game pauses when player enters the menu, and even if that wasn't enough the game pauses when player enters the favorite quick choice option - and unpausing the game at that point would make it nearly impossible to play.
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ANaIs GRelot
 
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Post » Thu May 03, 2012 1:38 am

yes MP is far more sensitive to lag then singularly. a single play can have a 10 sec lag without any major problem, .....

and the other problem is how to do when ppl die!
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Rachie Stout
 
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Post » Thu May 03, 2012 11:31 am

http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Fallout:_Resource_Wars


"Fallout: Resource Wars is a hypothetical Fallout spin-off mentioned several times by http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Van_Buren (canceled Fallout 3) and http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Fallout:_New_Vegas lead designer http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/J.E._Sawyer as something he'd like to make at various points, both when he worked at http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Black_Isle_Studios and recently when working at http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Obsidian.
It would be a game set in the http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Fallout_world http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Europe during the Euro-Middle Eastern war that took place there around the http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Timeline#2060. Focused on team-based multiplayer, the gameplay would be a blend of Motocross Madness pacing, Battlefield: 1942 foot and vehicle combat, and slightly longer-than-CS duration rounds. A saluaging element would be included giving the player the choice of either repairing damaged vehicles/weapons for use in the next round, or scrapping them for parts.
The plot would involve a crew of soldiers from the http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Royal_Armoured_Corps who become stranded in a war-torn anarchistic northern http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Italy and have to fight their way to the English Channel in quickly degrading vehicles, scavenging replacements, fuel, and weapons as they go."


i think this is a good way to work around the MP thing. to mack this work well and mack it so you can implement it to normal fallout and TES.
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chinadoll
 
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