[Sara Johanna Scenariste]

hey i know you guys are excited about bethesdas soon to be announcement, so am i. but i have a feeling that bethesda is going to announce a debut of a whole brand new video game series, and i feel it is not TESV...just gotta hope

I've had this same gut feeling too for a while now.

Gah! Imagine all of the disappointing fans after digging up every piece of a clue and all of these speculation threads.

[Lexy Corpsey]

I've had this same gut feeling too for a while now.

Don't be feeling that way. Zenimax has made a huge gamble in scooping up all these game studios. We know they have made great games in the past, but the real question is can they still make a hit that will sell? Who knows. What we do know right now is games like Fallout and, Elderscrolls are now instant cash cows because of the quality and quantity behind their name. If things don't go so well with the release of these new titles from their inside companies, at least they have the revenue of these future games.

[Rodney C]

I've had this same gut feeling too for a while now.

Gah! Imagine all of the disappointing fans after digging up every piece of a clue and all of these speculation threads.

Don't worry, it is.

i'm 95% sure of it.

[Sophie Morrell]

If it isn't TES V, by rights they should have put us out of our misery long ago with a definitive "the new project isn't a TES game" statement, just for the sake of showing mercy on the huge number of people waiting for an announcement of the next installment. ... I honestly don't think their marketing people would be that daft!

I do.

[Tammie Flint]

I do.

But do you realize it doesn't make sense to do so?

[kirsty williams]

But do you realize it doesn't make sense to do so?

Yes I realize that. If I were running the company I'd attempt to develop a good relationship with loyal customers. Particularly on a flagship game.

But that doesn't mean the marketers feel that way. From the actions of various companies, including gaming companies, marketers and others in the business seem to think very differently. So it would not surprise me if they aren't even considering the anticipation or disappointments they might cause to TES fans, or Fallout Fans. Note that on the Fallout NV boards there is a lot of discussion of how wrong it seems to some to announce a new DLC before fixing serious bugs. That's a good example of doing something that doesn't make sense. Or releasing games with invasive DRM, as other companies do, that doesn't make sense because some (like me) will not buy a great game if it has invasive DRM. Another example of not making sense, I think. It also may not make sense for them to announce a different game while inadvertently leading people to think it might be TES V - but that may not even be factored in. In fact, it would not surprise me if the marketers never really played any of the games.

I hope TES V will be announced soon. But I'm not counting on it.

[TOYA toys]

Yes I realize that. If I were running the company I'd attempt to develop a good relationship with loyal customers. Particularly on a flagship game.

But that doesn't mean the marketers feel that way. From the actions of various companies, including gaming companies, marketers and others in the business seem to think very differently. So it would not surprise me if they aren't even considering the anticipation or disappointments they might cause to TES fans, or Fallout Fans. Note that on the Fallout NV boards there is a lot of discussion of how wrong it seems to some to announce a new DLC before fixing serious bugs. That's a good example of doing something that doesn't make sense. Or releasing games with invasive DRM, as other companies do, that doesn't make sense because some (like me) will not buy a great game if it has invasive DRM. Another example of not making sense, I think. It also may not make sense for them to announce a different game while inadvertently leading people to think it might be TES V - but that may not even be factored in. In fact, it would not surprise me if the marketers never really played any of the games.

I hope TES V will be announced soon. But I'm not counting on it.

Exactly. And, While we feel like we would be disappointed if it isn't TES V there are millions of people who loved oblivion that honestly don't care. The disappointment of a few thousand people is insignificant compared to the masses, which is who bethesda cares about.
Also, as game designers they make the games they want to play. so if they are bored with Elder Scrolls, they don't really feel they have to make it.

[M!KkI]

But that doesn't mean the marketers feel that way. From the actions of various companies, including gaming companies, marketers and others in the business seem to think very differently. So it would not surprise me if they aren't even considering the anticipation or disappointments they might cause to TES fans, or Fallout Fans. Note that on the Fallout NV boards there is a lot of discussion of how wrong it seems to some to announce a new DLC before fixing serious bugs. That's a good example of doing something that doesn't make sense. Or releasing games with invasive DRM, as other companies do, that doesn't make sense because some (like me) will not buy a great game if it has invasive DRM. Another example of not making sense, I think. It also may not make sense for them to announce a different game while inadvertently leading people to think it might be TES V - but that may not even be factored in. In fact, it would not surprise me if the marketers never really played any of the games.

I think you're making marketers out to seem far more sinister than they really are. The truth of the matter is they're waiting until the time is right. There are factors that we simply can't be aware of. For instance, it could be MS or Sony delaying the announcement if it coincides with one of their announcements. My most recent example of this is I had the FO:NV update on day 2 through Steam, whereas the xbox hasn't received theirs yet because of verification policies (as far as I'm aware).

It's also important to remember that there are several smaller teams working on a game at any one time. The expansion/dlc team is i'm sure completely different from the bug-fix team. So delaying the dlc teams hard work because the bug-fix team is having to take some more time to find hard to fix bugs is unreasonable.

In short, they announced the DLC just like they will announce BGS's next game; because it was ready to be shown and the time was right.

*edited for punctuation and clarification*

[Sophie Louise Edge]

...Also, as game designers they make the games they want to play....

I also question if this is true. It might be, I just don't know.

Stated another way, I wonder how Bethesda decides when and whether they will do TES V.

Is it that a bunch of developers say "we'd really like to work on TES V now" or "let's not do TES V, I'd really like to do a WW II Zombie game"? Or is there a group or a person that make an arbitrary decision, and the designers are then told what to design? Or are there a bunch of proposals that go to the business development group to do a market anolysis of what they think will sell best? I honestly wonder how that decision is made. If we knew, it would help with out TES V speculation.

BTW, maybe the decision is based on technology. Maybe TES V is unannounced because have a bunch of ideas, but they are waiting on some next generation game engine that's needed to implement this. If something like that where true, it would be nice if they said something. But then that might affect "competitive advantage" or something.

[OnlyDumazzapplyhere]

I think you're making marketers out to seem far more sinister than they really are.

Impossible! Everyone knows marketers are trying to alienate the game's fan base. The die-hard fans aren't the ones building hype, it's the casual players, who only buy this game after reading a few reviews and asking for the game for Christmas!

Sheesh, some people have no clue what marketing is.

[Eoh]

Impossible! Everyone knows marketers are trying to alienate the game's fan base. The die-hard fans aren't the ones building hype, it's the casual players, who only buy this game after reading a few reviews and asking for the game for Christmas!

Sheesh, some people have no clue what marketing is.

As pessimistic as this sounds, I agree with Gabbo. For marketers it's quantity over quality, the loss of 500 hardcoe fans is nothing compared to the thousands of consumers that will buy the game if it was more orientated to them, point-in-case: The move to the more casual gamers' appeal for the TES series with Oblivion.

[kasia]

I'm detecting some financial stress in the video gaming industry as a result of these bad economic times. Perhaps BGS is in trouble and using their staff as contract programmers for iPhone apps these days. Who knows.

[James Smart]

TES attracted tons of players and thats true.

[Christine Pane]

As pessimistic as this sounds, I agree with Gabbo. For marketers it's quantity over quality, the loss of 500 hardcoe fans is nothing compared to the thousands of consumers that will buy the game if it was more orientated to them, point-in-case: The move to the more casual gamers' appeal for the TES series with Oblivion.

I completely agree.

Hype is built by the media, knowing who your consumers are, and not to mention having a fantastic product to show off and be proud of. I honestly think Bethesda are waiting to make a big splash, and Todd said the game is ready to show, so it's possible they're waiting for a time when all of the game industry is watching. Marketing is a delacate balance between hardcoe and casual consumers, and I would rather the marketers take their time to make sure that their next game sells well to insure that we'd see many more BGS games in the future.

Example: FO:NV shipped over 5 million copies using Bethesda's marketing strategy. They're doing something right.

One way or the other, we'll see an announcement and no amount of complaints will force Bethesda's hand. I would like to see and announcement sooner rather than later, but it's out of my hands. No sense is worrying about something I can't control.

P.s.
Oblivion's changes were made in part because of the comments on the forums, and we know that Bethesda listens to us. They're trying to build a game that will not only appeal to a large audience, but will be fun to play for hundreds of hours. A good example of changing a game to something more fun to play is Mass Effect 2; it was changed to be more shooter than RPG, and was a better game for it. I love Mass Effect and Mass Effect 2; as much as I adore Morrowind and Oblivion. Change is good, as is progression. After all, isn't that why we play RPGs?

[trisha punch]

I'm detecting some financial stress in the video gaming industry as a result of these bad economic times. Perhaps BGS is in trouble and using their staff as contract programmers for iPhone apps these days. Who knows.

That's ridicules, they have a team of 90 people working on what ever the next game is, in other word it's going to be huuuuge. Most MMO games don't have that many people on the team so they are cooking up something really, really, big and special for us. They have tons of capital rolling in from new vegas as well.

[Kelvin]

I completely agree.

Hype is built by the media, knowing who your consumers are, and not to mention having a fantastic product to show off and be proud of. I honestly think Bethesda are waiting to make a big splash, and Todd said the game is ready to show, so it's possible they're waiting for a time when all of the game industry is watching. Marketing is a delacate balance between hardcoe and casual consumers, and I would rather the marketers take their time to make sure that their next game sells well to insure that we'd see many more BGS in the future.

Example: FO:NV shipped over 5 million copies using Bethesda's marketing strategy. They're doing something right.

One way or the other, we'll see an announcement and no amount of complaints will force Bethesda's hand. I would like to see and announcement sooner rather than later, but it's out of my hands. No sense is worrying about something I can't control.

P.s.
Oblivion's changes were made in part because of the comments on the forums, and we know that bethesda listens to us. They're trying to build a game that will not only appeal to a large audience, but will be fun to play for hundreds of hours. A good example of changing a game to something more fun to play is Mass Effect 2; it was changed to be more shooter than RPG, and was a better game for it. I love Mass Effect and Mass Effect 2; as much as I adore Morrowind and Oblivion. Change is good, as is progression. After all, isn't that why we play RPGs?

im starting getting used to the fact that they need their time to procced into any statement

[Mrs Pooh]

im starting getting used to the fact that they need their time to procced into any statement

I believe it's the 'taking their time' philosophy that's gotten them to where they are today.

[Cameron Garrod]

I believe it's the 'taking their time' pholosophy that's gotten them to where they are today.

yes thats also true

[Del Arte]

hey i know you guys are excited about bethesdas soon to be announcement, so am i. but i have a feeling that bethesda is going to announce a debut of a whole brand new video game series, and i feel it is not TESV...just gotta hope

no way if it was a brand new series it would of been released earlier like brink has

[Ashley Clifft]

As pessimistic as this sounds, I agree with Gabbo.

Gee, thanks. I will start with the slightly off topic stuff, and work my way toward being on topic. Bear with me.

My intention was not to be pessimistic; if companies want to make more money they will appeal to a wider audience. Mass Effect and Fallout have both turned more shootery (which I am hereby declaring a word) as time goes on, which is an attempt to appeal to a wider audience. It worked. Both RPG fans and Fallout fans play the games, and both games are making massive amounts of money. I am guessing TES will go in a similar direction. If the game doesn't outright have guns (blunderbusses and flintlock), I'm sure more shootery aspects will be in the game (as if Oblivion didn't go far enough).

TES:V ill try to appeal to a wide range of audiences. They will implement all the RPG elements the fans enjoy, while also adding content for people who would not generally play an RPG. They will try to implement as many features as they can before showing the game off, and because I'm assuming Beth wants to show a lot that means they will delay an announcement until they are ready. Beth is trying to make the game as broad as it can be, hopefully without destroying the game we know and love in the process.

All of this will take an enormous amount of time, but by now they should just be polishing the game as much as they can, and eliminating the bugs that have plagued the games in the past. New Vegas, while not made by the same people, is still associated with TES. If TES is flawed in the same areas (bugs), you can expect reviews to call Beth out on it. Because they want to have the shortest amount of time between announcement and release, they are taking more time than we would like.

The game is taking a while to be announced, but this is nothing to be afraid of. Once the game has been announced, you can expect hype up the hoo hah. Everyone will know about the game and everyone will be talking about it. The talk and anticipation before the announcement has already been calculated, and this talk will grow exponentially once the game has been announced. I think Beth knows what it's doing, and I fully expect the game to be announced soon. If not, that just means more polish and fewer bugs.

[alicia hillier]

I'm detecting some financial stress in the video gaming industry as a result of these bad economic times. Perhaps BGS is in trouble and using their staff as contract programmers for iPhone apps these days. Who knows.

*pukes*

that make me sad and sick at the same time.

give games and scrub everything else, their are a lot of things humanity can live without, weapons, private jets, custom cars, burn them all give money to GAMES TO THE PRECIOUS

[Jacob Phillips]

So Disclaimer: I do not have a degree in marketing and I do not work in the industry

That being said, there is a plethora of information regarding marketing strategies and advertising theory that is free to anyone looking for it. There are published studies from reputable universities respective psychology and sociology departments. There are also MANY documented marketing successes and cloned strategies. You can even read about the electronic arts and target marketing. I like spending time researching different aspects of other interests and spent a great deal of time finding what I could use from this information to better speculate on the marketing strategy. One thing is clear across the board, hardcoe fan service requires little effort and is seldom done. Simply releasing collectors additions is enough, but even that is a revenue generating endeavor. Marketers cater to the probable return on investment, not the wishes of their fans.

Let's take Coca Cola as an excellent example. People were able to drink Coke from a can just fine for many years. No one ever said, "Hey I really would love to get Coca Cola in my belly much faster than I do today". Coca Cola wanted to sell more product and they ran studies around consumption of liquids and found a correlation between the opening of the dispenser and the amount consumed regardless of the level of thirst. They then widened the opening on the top of the can, and viola! They were instantly selling more Coca Cola.

Farmville is another example of marketing genius! No one ever said, "Hey I really wish I could pretend to plant wheat, wait a day, harvest it, and do it all over again for no reason at all". What they did is take a social network and have a construct to the users where they had a new way to interact and be social... the money came when they rigged the game so that people were bound to a reward system that was supported by the social network. It took off because of the strategy behind psychology.

Right now, all the fans are begging for a new TES game. People who aren't current BGS fans could care less. Bethesda has a choice:

1) They could feed the hungry fans (of both TES and Fallout) and release TESV (you know fallout fans would play it even if they never touched Oblivion)
2) They could make a risky but likely lucrative move, releasing a brand new IP targeting a completely different audience. All current BGS fans would jump on board too since BGS makes a specific and ultimately unique gaming experience you aren't going to find anywhere else.


So in one sense you can grow by giving more of what you already have (i.e. Coke) and in another you can build upon an existing architecture and gain old and new business (i.e. Farmville).


Now there is always option 3... but that would just be crazy... so we don't even have to mention that.

I am hoping that they go with Coca Cola on this one.

[Jack Walker]

New podcast out NAO. http://www.bethblog.com/podcast/

[herrade]

Just had a very brief idea, that as far as I can recall hasn't been mentioned yet. What if the Skyrim trademark is for expanding the TES universe into mobile platforms, facebook etc (whatever the kids are using these days) to plug the next TES game which may or may not be also called Skyrim? Kind of how Bioware are doing something on facebook for dragon age. That could be how they handle an announcement, make a mini-game that gets people interested and as you complete is some subtle message about a new TES game in the near future. Could be a bit complex when really all Bethesda has to do is say: "New Elder Scrolls this year" and lets face it we would go nuts and spread word for them for free just though hype, but to play devils advocate to myself just saying yeah new TES this year would be a bit underwhelming for what is sure to be a huge event.

[Tikarma Vodicka-McPherson]

So Disclaimer: I do not have a degree in marketing and I do not work in the industry

That being said, there is a plethora of information regarding marketing strategies and advertising theory that is free to anyone looking for it. There are published studies from reputable universities respective psychology and sociology departments. There are also MANY documented marketing successes and cloned strategies. You can even read about the electronic arts and target marketing. I like spending time researching different aspects of other interests and spent a great deal of time finding what I could use from this information to better speculate on the marketing strategy. One thing is clear across the board, hardcoe fan service requires little effort and is seldom done. Simply releasing collectors additions is enough, but even that is a revenue generating endeavor. Marketers cater to the probable return on investment, not the wishes of their fans.

Let's take Coca Cola as an excellent example. People were able to drink Coke from a can just fine for many years. No one ever said, "Hey I really would love to get Coca Cola in my belly much faster than I do today". Coca Cola wanted to sell more product and they ran studies around consumption of liquids and found a correlation between the opening of the dispenser and the amount consumed regardless of the level of thirst. They then widened the opening on the top of the can, and viola! They were instantly selling more Coca Cola.

Farmville is another example of marketing genius! No one ever said, "Hey I really wish I could pretend to plant wheat, wait a day, harvest it, and do it all over again for no reason at all". What they did is take a social network and have a construct to the users where they had a new way to interact and be social... the money came when they rigged the game so that people were bound to a reward system that was supported by the social network. It took off because of the strategy behind psychology.

Right now, all the fans are begging for a new TES game. People who aren't current BGS fans could care less. Bethesda has a choice:

1) They could feed the hungry fans (of both TES and Fallout) and release TESV (you know fallout fans would play it even if they never touched Oblivion)
2) They could make a risky but likely lucrative move, releasing a brand new IP targeting a completely different audience. All current BGS fans would jump on board too since BGS makes a specific and ultimately unique gaming experience you aren't going to find anywhere else.


So in one sense you can grow by giving more of what you already have (i.e. Coke) and in another you can build upon an existing architecture and gain old and new business (i.e. Farmville).


Now there is always option 3... but that would just be crazy... so we don't even have to mention that.

I am hoping that they go with Coca Cola on this one.

Marketing is a lot more complex than that...it's a lot more than how to make the brand sell it's self and retain quality so that your customers respect the brand. One key aspect your forgetting about how marketing works is that it needs to get infectious, and you have to keep your Evangelist in the loop or your product falls on it's face. Let's bring up Evangelist for a second, evangelism is how you infect the market. The hardcoe gamers are the ones that will get other people to play the game. If we, the hardcoe gamers are not on board with what the company is doing you can't expand the market. What if all of us said your game svcks, as in ALL of us and the hardcoe reviewers did as well? Bugs aside that's like taking a sledgehammer down. A company CAN'T survive with out it's evangelist to spread the infection.


I'm CS and ]part of the job at the company I work for is marketing research.