I don't really know how to fix it but exploiting the load and save thing is just really annoying. I have done this a lot of times now not going to lie and I want to stop it, but I can't for some reason. People would save. When they get hurt or [censored] up on something, they would just load back to where they were.

This isn't Dark Souls.

lol i knew that would the first comment

since alot of the games that fathered most of the games made today were about trial and error i don't see this going away soon

That has nothing to do with developing an open world game, which always requires a solid save function.
But you as a gamer, need to exhibit self control.
If you're in control of when/how to save your game, than the entire experience of when/how you reload after dying is your responsibility.

Let me guess, You are an old school console gamer?

Saving It an sort of difference between old pc and console games. You have pretty much always been able to save anytime on pc games as soon as you got games more complex than pure arcade. Exception is if the game has an separate combat mode you can not save in it.

Old console games had save limitation because they was not run from diskette or drive, you had to use battery backed up memory or very early flash, both had strict limits in amount of data you could save.

Solution was save at end of level only as you only needed to save a few byte. Save spots came later.

This has the effect of making the game far harder and more unforgiving, console games the last generations has mostly had pc style save.

I heard about what happened to you, Pluto. That's messed up. But in all seriousness, it really is the player's responsibility to handle their saves. I'd rather have a save system that can be abused than have one that doesn't meet my needs. If you don't want to abuse saves, practice self-discipline; don't ruin it for everybody else.

This, in Skyrim I tend to not save in dungeons, that is unless its some situations who tend to give multiple fails.

Just came from NV and an cave full of deathclaws, plenty of reloads before I cleared it.

You care how someone else chooses to play enough to try to dictate it why...?

You mean save scumming? I agree to an extent, but it's impossible to get rid of it completely. Based on what Todd Howard said about companion immortality and failstates that just motivate the player to reload, I think they'll change their approach to some things.

The worst offenders for save scumming are hacking and pickpocketing, and I expect those to change completely. For hacking, they can just change it so that when you run out of tries, the password scrambles and you have to try again; functionally identical to save scumming and how people hack terminals anyway in these games, but without the fuss of just reloading. They could also mess with it and change how many tries we get with the Hacker perk (maybe 2 tries by default and one extra try for each rank of the perk?). Or maybe they'll give us a completely new minigame.

For pickpocketing, I'd rather we weren't allowed to look in someone's inventory at all (or maybe we only could with a perk), and we'd just fish for something at random. If we weren't detected by the target, we'd have a few guaranteed attempts to pickpocket something at random (number of tries and value of the item can depend on what our stats/perks are). Planting explosives could be done by attempting a pickpocket while holding an explosive, or maybe hitting the grenade hotkey instead.

I don't think they can or should change the save system to prevent save scumming, but giving us a better reason not to reload after a failure would be a huge help.

Huh?
Your argument is the exact same as mine.

That is what I am saying. It's the player's game, and they can decide how to play it.


(and I assume that was a planet joke at the start)

As others have noted, this is really more of a you thing.

I've never had a problem with this. Though that's mainly due to how forgetful I can be. Other than autosave, I rarely ever make a save, and so far it hasn't blown up in my face.
Long story short, git gud

At least they're handling consequences better this time around. It's really about disciplining yourself. If you want to feel like any choice you made should carry on, then simply don't reload a previous save. It's just like fast traveling. I choose not to do it because I feel the exploration along the way brings new opportunities and simply teleporting to a location will cut out the experience. It's there, but I don't have to use it. You choose how you save.

This is the only thing that needs to be said.

i am confused here. How is this a problem? You save the game later you die. The game doesn't give you an option to continue without loading after you die how are people exploiting things? You died and reloaded you are such an exploiter! What i should play all my games with self imposed perma death? Getting hurt in Bethesda games mean zero as heath either regens automatically or food and stims are easy to come by. I never lacked for food on hardcoe in FONV because well there were plenty of animals to kill that respond so food was very easy to get. And food heals you. So what exploits are linked to Bethesda games with regards to reloading?

Mass Effect disallows saving during combat. Personally I like that system, it's very tempting to save during a firefight and savescum your way to victory, instead of thinking about your actions.

New Vegas has a cooldown system for saving and reloading during gambling, I like that system too, its fair enough.

Just getting hurt out in the wastes though? If you're reloading after taking minor damage you're playing video games wrong.

Yeah I really dont want the ability to save regularly, so I can get the enjoyment of having to replay the same area again and again after the game crashes.........that is sarcasm by the way.

Idk, Lots of save slots and the freedom to save and reload at will is a sort of given with these kinds of games, Its a godsend when you run into glitches and need to take your world-state back a few pegs.

" I can't exhibit self control so please remove this function/ ability/ option etc, etc"

Pretty much the norm on these forums these days.

Saving during an fight might be dangerous, save fast as you killed a deathclaw, 0.5 seconds later you notice the deathclaw right behind you.

Only time I had reason to do multiple saves during an location in FO:NV outside of the sadistic dead money was a cave full of deathclaws.

Should have made an hard save before entering the legion main base as a bug resulted in having to shoot my way out, yes I would probably become hostile to legion anyway.

I make TONS of save games for several reasons. I mod a lot of Fallout-3 and mods are notorious for causing crashes, when entering new areas, or interacting with things, etc so having a "clean" save that you can back up to is necessary. I also save when I am in a safe area, before I am about to venture into a dangerous area. If I have fought through a dangerous area and I am in a temporarily safe spot, I may make a save there, so I don't have to trudge through the same fights I just finished. And of course, Quicksave is used a LOT (but only the one slot there).

In Fallout-4, aside from the issue of mods, I can see even MORE reason to use save-games.

Constructing settlements, for example. I can easily imagine that you start constructing and spend all kind of resources and create this and that and move that there and this over here... and then decide you don't like it and want to configure things differently. Assuming there's no loss in destroying things you created to try again later (there may be scavenging loss), it would be a LOT easier to just load up the savegame from before you started construction.

With the dialog system the way it is, I can guarantee I'll save before every conversation I have. I don't want to select "Sure" from a dialog menu and then have my character narrate a long story that totally is NOT what I meant to say. The fact we don't know what our character will say until we hear it means I'll be reloading before conversations a LOT. Sometimes just to see what the other options ARE. I may still end up using the dialog choice I would have chosen first... but I may find out that what I thought was a boring answer actually leads to a conversation thread I want to pursue, which the other seemingly-better dialog option does not lead to.

Yup they should remove the save function so when your game crashes you lose everything...

Sure I save every 5 minutes but I would feel better if they removed it for other peoples imurshun.

Not sure what it is that you are talking about.

Why would you need to save before hacking? You can just exit the terminal if you want before you run out of attempts in order to reset it.

For pickpocketing, what about when I want to reverse pickpocket better armor or a better weapon onto an npc in order to keep them alive?

Completely against this.

See, for me a good robust saving feature is vital as I'm frequently plagued with power outages.

Nothing is more annoying then redoing things because you got [censored] by the power company again.

So, sorry that you lack self control, but why should that screw others over? It's your problem, overcome it and stop pushing it off to others to solve for you.