Before I get this thread started I must make it clear for all of you,
so you don't verbally massacre me, that I enjoy this game and spend
quite a lot of my spare time adventuring in this magnificent world.
Love the scenery, the atmosphere, all the details and the rich ambient
sound.

still, in spite of everything that's good, I can't lose the feeling
that the developers did miss a few game-play contents. Of course it's
easier to moan and [censored] about this and that when it's someone else
that has to do the hard work.

To get this, what is probably a suicide considering all the fan boys, going
I'm starting with the most obvious discrepancy:


"Be whoever you want"!

Okey! Be whoever you want, right? It's true that you can be whoever
you want as long it's within the parameters of: slaughter, kill, kill,
slaughter, throw cool spells, thwack some poor sod, steal, kill, steal
and run like hell from guards, kill the giant flying lizard above you.

Nothing bad with that but it lends to some quite narrow choices.
So where's the choice to be a powerful merchant? The economical system
implemented are too weak to handle anything above carrying wood - my
own opinion of course.

where's the choice to be a forty years-something drunken ass hole
that pisses everybody off and father to three? Okey, I'm fully aware
of that if one want to play social simulators one can play sims but
I can't understand why Skyrim couldn't display something close to
natural developing interactions between NPCs and the player.

There's many more examples but I hope it's clear what I'm trying to say
that the game do not offer any real choices between being the fabulous
hero or the psychopathic murderer.


Animations.

Are a lot better but still stiff and fitful. And where's the damn
animation for CLIMBING!? Come to think about: why isn't there any
climbing at all? Jumping is still awful and every time you jump the soul
dies bit by bit.


RPG?

So between all the action and dragon slaying something else must fill
the space. A big hiking simulations comes to mind but relaxing as it is
to look at a misty mountain or a sunlit meadow it is kind of boring.
Anything else to find besides hack-and-slash and a hiking simulator?

For me the answer is sadly: no. It's entertaining enough but it
wouldn't hurt if there actually was things like mini-games, except all
the brawls. Why is the companions so bland and boring? In fallout
they did have some characteristics that you remember and they did
interact with you on their own accord and so on.

Is there any way to develop a personality that's recognized?
That is: a personality that isn't based on quests only. So for some
reason I play this hippie-cat that don't do evil, fair and simply he's
a good cat that rather purrs then curse.

He gives money to beggars and pays off true ass holes to leave peoples
alone to live their lives on their own accord. But he do not, for the
love of it, get any recognition for it across the epic land of skyrim!
There isn't ANY peoples whom came and visited him or searched for him
to ask for his help or whatever. Not a single word about his kindness.

This makes me wanting to massacre a village and celebrate with mead.

No, feedback whatsoever. You're destined to save the world, kill all
big bad dragons but so long as you don't do it you doesn't exist.
All your actions, or most at least, will never ever have a reactions.



And there! The rant, aka wall of text, are over! I could of added more
but lets start with this. This is the most important I could think of
right now so lets roll with it.

Look at it this way. I give money to some homeless guys near my work every day, and I once paid off a guy to stop harassing a coworker. You know, the kind of stuff your character does.

Have you ever heard of me? No? Then why the [censored] would people in Skyrim have heard of your character? There are dragons killing people all over the place, you think the few travelers on the road are going to talk about the nice kitty who gave some drunk a septim last month?

You missed one key part of play how you want. You can't really. You have to have a focus or you'll get steam rolled at bosses due to the level scaling system.

^ this

True you will get steam rolled if you don't level but there should be more to the game then just lvling. So that point isn't missed at all I just pointed out that there should be more then slaughtering things and stealing objects like some madman. One can level but one should be able to do other stuffs too, now it's more or less do this and almost only this.

My point about my character and being nice was not up to the task in explaining that actions doesn't create some kinds of reactions. Especially when you just saved some small mining village from losing it's income and the word doesn't travel about to say the least. Dragons are at large but then they could of skipped the whole sandbox gameplay and created a good narrative instead, as an example the narrative they have in Baldur's gate, NWN, Deus ex, fallout, Might and Magic or whatnot. Skip the sandbox game if you still going to force feed the players into a small array of characters but still claiming that "you can be whoever you want".

For them to include the kind of depth you're looking for in character interactions would essentially be asking them to make 2 games at once. I think they could add more to give characters more depth but not to that kind of level.

I think an evolving economy could work and would be a great addition to the game. You'd be able to buy stock in towns that specialise in certain areas and sell it in places where demand is high.

I think side games could be fun. I used to enjoy messing around at the games in Knights of the Old Republic.

You don't want big arguments, yet you bring up the "RPG" point and completely missing the meaning of the RPG...

Prepare to be massacred.

I'd definately prefered it if they designed the quests around the world instead of the world around the quests. If you want to get a house you have to do a quest. If you want to progress in a faction you have to do a quest. I'm not saying take quests out. But instead of haveing quests be the route you use to progress in the guilds. I'd have the rather the guild quests had nothing to do with rank. I'd rather houses be available with getting them free being quest rewards or something. Hell, I'd like it if you could fight dragons without haveing to do a quest.

The honest answer is you can role play however you like. You can go out and hunt animals for their skin and get yo self a pick ax and tap some ore mines... Be a wondering hunter / armor maker... You could go around Skyrim harvesting various alchemy ingredients and become a world renown potion maker guy... Or become a thief and go through the towns robbing everyone blind... right down to their last goblet (imagine the look on their face when they wake up muhahahaha).

The mistake you are making is to assume Bethesda has to provide you a game mechanic, voice acting, and quests for a million different possible ways to play the game... And that is just impossible. So, sometimes you got to think to yourself, "I'm going to ignore the direction the game 'wants' me to go, and just do my own thing, use my imagination, and have fun". You don't have to have some random NPC proclaim the greatness of your hippie ways.

Also, remember that the modding community will provide a lot of more substantive 'alternatives', 'patches', and 'changes' to those who want a more legitimate 'off-the-beaten-road" approach (of course if you're a console player, you're out of luck).


I think what gets my feathers ruffled is when gamers get their panties all bundled up because Skyrim wasnt custom designed for -them- or didn't incorporate -their- favorite [insert Oblivion / Morrowind / ect] aspect of the game in Skyrim. Does anyone here (assuming we have a lot of 'young' players) know how much money, work, and time goes into a game like Skyrim? There is only a handful of game studios that can put anything close to a game like Skyrim out in the world. And of those, only a few are willing to put out a game that doesn't pander to the lowest common denominator (cough EA Games cough) and then svck their player's dry with a billion little expansion packs for $49.99 each.

True it's a lot to ask for when with what I'm implying but they did a far better job with stuffs to meddle with on the side in Fallout new vegas then in skyrim; I'm talking about some RPG elements and mini-games that is. No, I'm fully aware that they can't address the entire issue with sandbox games. They can't add the ability to be that poor sod whom made a girl pregnant or whatever with all the social dynamics attached to it. What they've could of added is some character development for your companions and for the NPCs in more general terms of course since that would be another huge task. But still it's quite annoying to run into the same NPC, whom you helped or did show to that you're better then him/her, and still hearing that you're a nobody. It kind of breaks the immersion a bit.

The thing with what I'm trying to say is that: if you're this very creative and productive denizen in the land of skyrim, doing all these hard, easy or fantastic stuffs you will leave some kind of footprint sooner or later and it must show somehow. Yes, I've played through most of the Stormcloaks quests and are aware that you play an important part in the progress of each quests but if the only way to get a reputation is through fancy quests then where is the immersion for your other actions?

Most actions, also actions taken in quests, will more or less go unnoticed and there's no way to discern if what you actually did in that cave/dungeon/castle/whatever did effect anything. Take this for an example about the quest called Light's out!: You talk to Jaree-Ra and, lets say, accepts his proposition about taking a very active part in his plans. Now you follow the entire quest-chain through and ends up slaughtering the entire group of criminals. Then what? what's the reward? Well the rewards is the experience, gold, random loot nothing else really.

What could they've had done to flesh things out a little? Or as I guess you will put it: what could they've had done to make me a happy little man-child? Simple: add the option to turn the scums in, add the little detail to see some kind of impact, then just hearing about it, on the community, perhaps less items available in the stores (?), lastly add the ability to claim it was you whom did put them under the sword and we have that little thing I would call immersion.

The last part could be huge work, I admit, but it isn't necessarily so. Think about. If they added the ability to state a claim of your greatness in regards to this quest they could of easily just added a small effect: ex. 5% off all items in Solitude, some random free item etc.

Also I'm not that spoiled to believe that this game was specially made for my desires. I know that, basically, all TES games are about dungeon crawling and looking at pretty things - more or less. I did expect that the combat and animation system would be below my expectations and wasn't that disappointed that it where in some areas; I still have a great time trying to lodge my axe in somebody's face.

I did also have low expectations in regards to, what I would call, true RPG elements. I do play D&D, even AD&D still to go back to the roots of it all, so I pretty much know how to make things interesting in games by applying my imagination. But still if the game lacks immersion then it lose some of the fun. And on a side note: when using ones imagination in games that's much more about visuals, then only about what you can picture inside your head, it kind of helps the immersion a bit if you could add, lets say if you play a character with one leg, a wooden leg etc.

So my point still is: if they want to have the sandbox game they've aiming for they could at least of tried to address the RPG-side of TES then just leaving it to the metaphysical realm of imagination only. Besides, on a side note, they've could of added much more interesting and thrilling experiences to dungeon crawling by forcing the player on his or hers stomach. Forced to crawl through twenty meters of rock on a cold and damp uneven surface just to be meet by a skeleton, or a aberration some would prefer. Considering that TES are mostly about dungeon crawling this would be a good consideration I would claim to look closer at.

But perhaps in having these wishes one is being spoiled and is pertinent to stand as an example of the lowest common denominator.

Take care.