If Dungeon Siege can do it, why can't TESIV? Even Titan Quest doesn't have loading screens (except when teleporting).

It would obviously be possible on the PC due to it's higher graphical and processing power, however they are making the game for xbox 360 and the PS3 as well and it is going to be the same game. They are not going to make allowences in order to make one better than the other. Todd Howard has already said that the games are going to be the same on all systems so although it is possible it won't happen.

Which is fine anyway because loading times are near instant if you have a decent computer.

I don't blame them for Oblivion's closed cities, I know the story. I blame them for shadowless Fallout3 though. But what about Skyrim? I expected the atrocity of closed cities would go away in TESV because it was a technical limitation of that time(5 years ago) with an unoptimized game and a console they weren't familiar with. They have a new DX11 engine, they are familiar with the console. Now if consoles didn't make it for open cities by a small margin, why should PCs be punished for that? Am I asking too much? Only 5 open cities. It won't change how it looks.

The other option for me is having more clutter and more people and an optimized engine that can run it with open cities or open cities with same clutter and same number of NPCs. I will stick with good games like Elder Scrolls and Just Cause 2, thank you. :thumbsup:

I'm doing a loosely comparison, not a direct one. JC2 is the best I can find. If you have a better comparison, I want to hear it instead of a "you don't understand". Post something constructive. My titles are not important here.

Anyways, thank you for your opinion.

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In my opinion, they should try opening those remaining cities for PC version. Some modder will work for some weeks to do it anyway but if BGS do it, I will see it as a big positive sign for their ambition.

They are kings of the console hill hands down, but if they want the crown of PC rpg as well then they better have a look at The Witcher, there is real danger incoming.

While this is true, neither the Sahelian bushmen, nor the Amazonian tribe members, nor most of the inhabitants of places like Mongolia or Afghanistan are Bethesda's target demographic.

Actually, check out the hardware and software issues forums of any site and look for the people trying to run new games on decade old PCs. Heck, we've had a few people in the FO3 H&S trying to play on Geforce 4s and 5s.

The reason Fallout didn't have shadows and such is because it was just a more optimized Oblivion engine. Adding dynamic shadows to an existing engine is not an easy task. If they were going to the lengths of adding dynamic shadows, they may as well have made have remade the whole engine, which is what they've done for Skyrim. Optimizing an existing engine is a lot easier than adding new stuff in. The two engines don't have much difference at all, really, besides the optimizations. The point isn't "punishing PCs" (I play on PC, btw), it's about a realistic design goal. If they were catering to PC players, which would be nice, it wouldn't make any sense at all profit wise. Adding open cities for the PC is not trivial, and if they would do that, where does it stop?? You end up just making two games, which is never going to happen. PCs are now much better than the consoles, but that's not going to change anything, because the game sells best on the consoles. Making a whole new PC version for the minority that are PC customers doesn't make financial sense. Has it even been confirmed that the cities are closed in Skyrim, btw?? I haven't been paying attention.

I'm not sure when they started on the Creation Engine, but if they'd have used it for Fallout it would have added a good year or so onto the development time, I'd say.

And I don't have a good comparison. There is nothing that comes remotely close to the true open worldness that is TES/Fallout. They are technical masterpieces. Try spending a good few hours following one NPC around in Just Cause 2, and then do the same in Fallout/Oblivion. Or maybe pick up a random object from a table, put it in a random place, and see how long it lasts in each game, and then compare. There are plenty of places in TES/Fallout that don't respawn, so you can leave things somewhere and if you never touch them, they will always be there. The same can not be said for any other game.

I'm sure the devs wanted seamless world as much as we do, if they aren't there yet there must be a reason... but we can hope for Tes VI, new consoles, new possibilities...

Its very much possible but wont happen due to consoles.

'This doesn't make the statement "Most people do not have computers that could run an "open seamless world."" any less misleading and meaningless.

There is between one and two billion personal computers in the world right now. If Skyrim sells a copy for just 0.1% of them, it will already be a commercial success. So what if the other 99.9% can't run the game? It doesn't matter. They aren't Bethesda's target demographics.

I never thought it is easy. But I think it must be easier than adding dynamic shadows to an existing engine by hacking it from outside.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uxhl3y3zWZE



I'm probably just spoiled.


I think Morrowind(2002) remembers positions much better than Oblivion. And schedules were available in old games like Ultima V. I think these features are a bit overrated in terms of their performance demands.

PS. Only big cities will be walled, towns will be open. We assume, they are the five big cities.

And I still think they should open those cities for PC and they can stop there. (This is a personal request, maybe the only one I have. All other things from me are mere suggestions. I'm happy with everything, this is my only gripe. Like I said, it is a personal request. A little trivial thing for PC gamers? I would be very happy. :twirl: )

If they do it The Witcher 2 style, with minimal loading and very little noticeable separation between interior and exterior cells, I'd be fine with it.

Honestly, more developers could do things the way that CD Projekt Red did- Release an optimized PC version to appease the PC players and hype the game for a inevitable console port. It seems to be working well for them.

Yes, you could have a seamless world on PC, but you would have to tune everything down a lot. I don't know about you, but I'd rather wait for a loading screen than have my next gen game look like minecraft.

they have a new engine though

You know there still is like almost 6 months before release... It is possible, but just something I dont think they should spend their time on. Loading screens aren't that bad anyways

Check out Open Cities Reborn for Oblivion. The engine has incredible potential, but b/c the game is a console port, we will never it without mods.

Wrong. There are several ways to have a seamless world with no loading and still be able to make it look awesome.

Witcher 2.

Just cause 2.

Two good examples. It won't happen though for Skyrim as we know Bethesda isn't very keen on doing things for the PC.

Morrowind has been out for a long long time, and it's taken a long time and a massive hit in performance. The walled cities disappoints me, as they really should be able to do that now. Where is it quoted this is the case?? And that's the thing, it wouldn't stop there, and how do they justify your one PC improvement over someone else's PC improvement?




There are obviously ways to make it looks awesome, but there is not a way to do everything Bethesda does, and make it look seamless and awesome.

Gothic 3 was seamless.....its not like this requires year 2025 technology....

i voted other so my discription is darkfall did it so skyrim can too

It was, at the expense of poor interiors, poor caves and less objects that you can pick up. If that's the trade off, I prefer Skyrim with loading.

Its not necessarily the game but the system. My only computer is a seven year old hand-me-down. I doubt it would be able to handle skyrim streamlessly.

That's not really relevant at all. There point is there is a large enough minority of PC players with systems that could handle it.

I think performance hit is not big and it's well worth the improvement. During spare times of modders, working without any source code, it takes time.

Here is the insightful interview:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=db-o_HrpC-0&feature=player_detailpage#t=203s
(You can watch the whole interview too if you haven't seen it before.)

I think pointing the next gen for open cities is worrying because XBOX 360 was next-gen compared to XBOX but open cities were lost during that transition. As stated they got a list and they achieved the things in that list one by one. Open cities was not one of them but fishing was. My view is this is a priority problem more than a performance problem. Next-gen can cause more sacrifices and open cities could be that sacrifice, again. If they can make it happen for PC as a bonus, I can feel more secure for the future. Like I said, this is a personal request. They want it to look similar to consoles, open cities won't change the look.

I updated my graphics card twice before playing Oblivion with acceptable framerates. FX5200(1 frame per half minute), 6800(16 FPS with slowdowns, slideshow during combat with extreme slowdowns) and finally 8800GTS. For Skyrim, I will have to update my graphics card to DX11 to benefit those DX11 optimizations. Yeah, to run Skyrim smoother and not for BF3. I think open cities is a humble request.