Have they actually confirmed that youll be able to use horses? :unsure:

The differences are
-it is explained
-it requires interaction with the world
-it shows how other people get around as well
-it is another service that exists and makes the world more lively
-it makes more sense for being instant (because it is FAR faster)

I never understood how merchants get stuff form other cities in Oblivion. Did they walk everything there? There are no carriages or huge pack beasts or anything.

Only carriages - excluding playtesting and general messing around, for which fast travel is quite convenient.

I'd also like to say that "magic map" is a much more appealing term than "fast travel".

Todd Howard was rather tentative about that question, he said they're looking into it, as with many other things. But to me, it sounded like they're not likely gonna be in the game because it needs to feel like real horseriding, "you're riding an animal" and not a vehicle. For the Skyrim landscape, I don't think horseriding will be that relevant and in Oblivion it was a most useless feature IMO. Besides, horseriding typically svcks in games, Red Dead Redemption being a rare exception to that. Sacred horseriding svcked and Two Worlds was a [censored] game overall.

Horses also contribute to making the world feel smaller. Gothic 3 worked rather nicely (in the area of travel) without the existence of horses, so IMO Bethesda should learn from Gothic 3 (as well as Diablo 2 and 3, Titan Quest and even their own game Fallout 3) in those specific departments (which they seem to have done).

Personally, I don't think you'll be able to ride them and I'm fine with that as long as we got carriage back. Besides, modders will definitely change that (although I highly doubt I'll ever bother to DL those mods myself, but that's me) and then you got DLCs, of which horseriding might be a very valid theme (because they're able to focus more on making it good).

Overall though, horses are generally bad for the feel of personal, visceral combat and that leaves traveling to be the horses' main use - to which I feel horses are greatly redundant for a game such as Skyrim. It remains to be seen whether that is truly the case, though - Whiterun being one such location where horseriding is potentially great fun.

Neither did I. But I also failed to understand how Morrowind's merchants got their goods. They stood erect in the same place all day long.

I call it "representative world design". You don't actually have to include something into a world in order for player's to imagine that it's there. Have you two people never read a book before?

NB: Moderators, the multiquote feature doesn't seem to work atm.

What does 'carriage' actually mean though?

Is it just you sitting in some sort of vehicle (I imagine a small wagon or horse-draw cart in Skyrim terms) whilst it takes you to your destination in real-time? Such as the taxi's in GTA?

If so then whats stopping the player killing the original 'driver' and operating the carriage himself without having to pay?

That also brings up another question; can we expect gold coin to be the payment of this journey or will we be required to complete some sort of mini-game/mission in order to gain access into 'the carriage?'

/sigh

That was just a counter-argument. Also, yes, I suppose we're all aware that imagination plays a vital role while gaming.

We really don't know any of that yet, but i assume it will be similar to Red Dead Redemtion (kinda like GTA where you can sit in it real-time and you can decide to skip it).

and yeah, i'd bet it just costs gold... no minigame or mission... i can't even think of what those would be.

They actually had pack animals and the like around so it's feasible.

My wording was imprecise, sorry. Characters never use the magic map (also known as Fast Travel or map travel); only players do. To the character, the magic map does not exist. The character is no more aware of the magic map than he is of Save Game or Best Buy or automobiles. The magic map is not part of his world, so the character can not use it.

If my character appreciates traveling by carriage, and a carriage is available, then my character will use it. If my character prefers riding his own horse or walking or swimming, then he will avoid using a carriage. When the magic map is usable, I will often use it to carry me to the end of my character's journey, but not when a carriage is available and my character has a preference for it.

So it's not a roleplaying game?

oh okay. that's more RPing than i'm used to. I was looking at it from the player's perspective, not the character's

I use a lot of carriage transport especially if it's being in real time (see the scenery go by, get off wherever you want). But I never get that bored with the world to abuse fast travel, I like to walk and kill things on the way even if it's the 99th time.

While Oblivion had motile merchants.

Although, it did detract the element of surprise from the game just as the quest markers did; Oblivion's fast travel system was still practical. I think we all can agree that the inclusion of the carriage system is a much appreciated addition to Skyrim.

Oblivion didn't have mobile merchant's. They were always in the same town.

Yes, carriages are appreciated. They should have more and maybe less mundane options but I guess I'll take what I can get

Actually, it sounded like he was emphasizing the "roleplaying" in his answers - the type of travel he chooses is based on his character's motivations, not his. But in his mind "fast traveling" on the map = walking there on foot. From the character's perspective.


(A great many media use "time passes" techniques. Indiana Jones movies show a vehicle superimposed over an image of a dotted line moving across a world map; Fallout 1 showed a dot moving across the world map to the destination you'd chosen; pen-and-paper games allow the GM to say "okay, you travel west for three days. nothing interesting happens so you don't need to go over every meal break, watch schedule, camp setup & takedown, etc".)

----------------
OP:

Not having any problems with OB / FO3 fast travel, I will use the Skyrim travel options the way they're most likely intended - I will use the Carriage system to get the main destinations marked on my map (already done at the start of OB), and then I will use map travel from then on.

:shrug:

Precisely. :foodndrink:

I'll try to use the carriage system as often as possible when I don't have the energy to walk, but I will also use fast-travel when I just want to travel from hotspot to hotspot and just want action/dungeon crawling instead of walking between the city and the dungeon.

But as I said, I will try to travel in Morrowind-style as much as possible.

The carriage system are great news for the people that want to live in the Elder Scrolls universe as opposed to play in it!
Sometimes, I just want to live in the world, traveling to a city I haven't been to yet, buying a hotel room for the night, and then go fishing for pearls in the morning.

All I read in his statement was how he was dividing HIS perception and his characters which is the antithesis of roleplaying in my mind. Roleplaying is when you seek to merge the two as much as possible. So it is far easier to roleplay in morrowind because YOU the character/player have to actively seek out methods of transportation whereas he is saying HE as a player uses the map but his CHARACTER does something different.

Just let him play as he wants until this disscussion gets out of hand.

^this. this kind of reasoning should be more prevalent on these forums. Here, these are for you: :ribbon: :trophy: +rep

Me? I'm going to play the freaking game and see what happens based on each situation.

Most of the time I won't fast travel at all and will only use my mount to get around. Fast travel takes away the fun of seeing the game world and discovering new places! I'll probably use carriages from time to time though, probably once I've been playing for a while and travelled all over the place. Usually though I like to play with as much realism as possible, and fast travel with a loading screen takes away from that. Much better to ride your horse along lonely roads through the woods!

Definitely no "magic map" though. I did use the map in Oblivion sometimes to simulate some kind of transport system between the towns, but now we have real carriages.

I suspect a lot of these poll results are lies. Most of you will be using fast travel. You can lie to me, but you can't lie to yourself.