You maybe need to take another look at what an ES game is supposed to be. Why shouldn't they be in the game? This is a single player RPG, not a shooter game. It's a role playing game, one in which you can be whatever you want to be for the most part, that's a key part of an ES game, If a player wants to role play an OPed char so skilled with a sword that no one can match him, or a mage so powerful that he can wipe out dozens with ease than why should they not be able to? If that's what they want then their are paths for them to do it with, paths they have to deliberately choose to take and exploit, it isn't something a player will achieve accidentally without deliberately trying to do so. It caters to what the player wants to do, and the type of game they want to play, and thats the way an ES game should be plain and simple.

Not Beths fault that some players can't help themselves but to go for exploits to get OP builds and then whine because they have done so, nor should other RPs see their own options limited because of such players.

Bethesda builds the world, lore, and physics. The players build the game. I'm surprised people haven't figured that out. It pretty much been common knowledge with TES players at least since Morrowind.

Oh wait, I'm not surprised. Given the popularity of Skyrim, I'd be willing to bet a ton of MMO players are trying this game. This is not an MMO. They should stick with their little pink fairy pets and Barbie dress-up gear, where they can all regurgitate their self-entitlement mantras and e-peen about their DPS together -- oh, and complain to their MMO developer of choice about game balance.

Just because you don't like it doesn't make it a Terrible answer.

Regarding what I put in bold, players can ALREADY do that, no problem. It's called novice difficulty, ZERO exploiting required. What people CAN'T DO is level up a master crafter type character and then still hope for a challenge in the game, IT'S CURRENTLY IMPOSSIBLE. So, again, lack of choice and bad design.

This is the biggest piece of fanboyism ever. The fact that one would be forced, yes forced, to use substandard loot in order to get any sort of challenge points to bad game to design.

so upgrading all your gear to legendary quality doesn't give u an advantage? really?

Actually no, it being a terrible answer makes it terrible.

"Wear crappy armor to avoid being too powerful" That's a good solution to you? Lol, fan-boys.

Yep, I love smithing, at lvl 33 my smithing is about 66 or so and I love that I can take my 'stuff' and make it better and as the boss's keep getting harder I want to make better equipment. It's only OP if you get it to really high (to at least 70 or is it 80?) before level 20 and make a bunch of glass and ebony stuff when it isn't available or you power it all the way to 100 and are walking around with legendary dragon armor and legendary daerdric weapons when all your enemies have crap.

I plan/hope that I will eventually have 100 smithing and 100 enchanting but can't see getting there for a very, very long time.

If you get 100/100 in both too early you will be a walking nightmare for everyone and every quest. Make a bunch of dragon scale armor with all sneak, pickpocket and lockpicking double enchants and no db/thief quests will be fun. Make an ultra powerful mage by double enchanting destruction bonuses so you don't need magicka and can put all your level points in hp and stamina.

As has already been said, In a game that is this open you can always exploit it if you want, but its the only way to allow people to play as they want. Eventually I want to be able to make all types of armor, improve it and yes double enchant it. but I will be close to max level (whatever that is) before I get anywhere near there.

Enjoy

Funny, one of my chars is at 100 in smithing, and at level 40 on expert, i still need to carry potions around, especially when going into old burials or when going up against mage types, there is plenty of challenge...

Sorry, i don't see it... Maybe you should take another look at how you are playing the game? What are you doing thats making it apparently so easy for you?

So what is your solution? I'm looking for a solution that doesn't ruin the game for all the people that don't power level.

Fix crafting synergy and limit crafting skills to not be as powerful as the best in game items - People complain.
Leave crafting as is - People complain.
Remove crafting - People complain.
Come up with a perfect solution to the gear / crafting solution - People find something else ...and then complain.
Crafting is only one of the godmode options too.

The system in place isn't perfect, I would be one of the first to agree. However until they can come up with a better solution that is cost effective to employ regarding difficulty - more than increase health / damage - some people will always be unhappy. I for one cannot wait til the construction kit comes out then people can mod the difficulty through the roof or fix things to cater to specific playstyles.

Substandard?... If anything Iron and steel IS the standard! How many people do you see running around in ebony or Daedric armor in this game? Heck their are only a few with even just Iron or steel, most are in fur or hide armors. Even then unless you deliberately improve them with smithing and enchantments Ebony and Daedric are still not over the top OP, and still won't be game changers against higher level enemies.

If you want to wear Daedric and use Daedric weapons than it's your choice, but the whole point of Daedric stuff is how powerful it is.

Well I would have prefered that the crafting synergies never even existed, they are a big part of why crafting is so OP. But it's too late for that.

An easy band-aid fix would be to just make master much harder. That way the people who did 'exploit' the crafting synergies could still have a challenge. And if you haven't touched crafting then just play on expert and it's still a challenge for you as well.
Or if you want to play an OP character that still one-shots, just play on expert after you're done exploiting the crafting (or novice if you didn't craft/enchant).

There, win-win-win.

I'm always amused by these people whose playstyle is "pursue all possible power" and then complain that 1) it's too easy, and 2) how dare they expect me to "avoid" certain things.

I find it amusing because I've almost never felt that I was "forcing" myself to avoid things. I just play games, and do what feels right. I've been doing that here, and I'm not feeling overpowered. I'm also not feeling that I've had to consciously limit myself away from anything. But, then - I'm not obsessed with powergaming. I don't feel like every single thing I do has to be the 110% most powerful/efficient.

Only time this gets me in trouble is when I'm playing those few games that assume and require you to be 100% min/max powergamer. I tend to svck out at those games, because powergaming and min/max isn't something I just do naturally.




Explain how this works, please. Because, yeah - my Smithing has given me better gear than I'd have otherwise. But plenty of stuff still hurts me - boss level mobs, in particular, require a bunch of potion support & running around/dodging.

(Lv 39. 71 Smithing. My armor is a mix of glass and elven, improved to various stages of exquisite/epic/legendary. Glass sword, exquisite or higher, don't remember. Light armor, Block, and One-handed are in the 60-80 range, with 6-8 perks in each. Only enchants I'm using are the ones on the gear, because my Enchanting is unperked and is nothing to write home about.)

It's amazing that the ones who claim to be overpowered are the same ones complaining about the scaling. This game allows you to set your own playstyle. If you choose not to enjoy it, play another game.

I think you are absolutely right. My problem with a lot of the people who are complaining is that they created their characters intentionally this way, trying to become all-powerful and are really bragging about their characters and not complaining about the game. This select group also will not use the construction kit to make it more difficult (if anything they will use it to make it easier with more short cuts). There are a lot of people out there who got OP 'legally' and will use the kit to make it more fun and props to them.

To the OP if you are the second type (and are playing on a PC and will actually use the kit to make it harder) then none of my posts are directed at you, there are just so many jokers out here who built there character to be OP and now are bragging/complaining that they succeeded at doing it.

As you said smithing is definitely not the only god mode option .. you can make it so that casting destruction spells doesn't actually use magicka, or you can get four pieces of +archery gear, a good bow and arrows and the sneak perk for 3x sneak damage and 1 shot all non-boss characters

Its actually worse than Oblivion. 100 Sneak is pretty much 100% chameleon.

By abuse you mean using the sneak skill to sneak up on people and then ambush them with a powerful attack, as was intended and is the primary purpose of the skill?

This is the kind of broken that should be fixed. It is one thing when someone drinks a potion to make a enchantment to make potions to drink a potion to make an enchantment etc to eventually make a enchantment to smith something, and it is another if during the ordinary course of leveling a skill it becomes overpowered.

If you have to go out of your way to work a loophole or jump through hoops for extra power I don't care how abusive it is, but if just playing the game in a fairly normal fashion makes you overpowered there is an issue with balance.

Kind of ridiculous that everyone thinks a total reasonable solution to the gameplay being too easy on the most difficult level is to intentionally handicap yourself...

It is a perfectly reasonable expectation that a player face a challenge in the game when playing the best they can without cheating.

i don't think anyone thinks you are power leveling smithing (I'm level 33 with about 67 smithing) .. there are plenty of people out there who have near or 100 smithing and are no where near your level. I'm not sure the minimum, but I think you can be close to 100 smithing at around level 20 if you aren't doing anything else (and it could be far less). But imagine being level 20 (or less) with full dragon scale and daerdric weapons that are all legendary .. you would be unstoppable against foes using steel weapons. Now add in 100 or so enchanting with great enchants .. or double enchants and you would be truly OP. Now to get there you would have to want to get there and plan on getting there, it doesn't happen by 'just playing'

Is it really so much to ask that there can still be a challenge in the game if you try to make your character the best he can be? No matter how you build your character, crafting or not, the game should still be a challenge on master (in my opinion), which it currently is not. If you want to keep playing the overpowered 1-shotting demi-god then turn the difficulty down. But I should not have to limit the potential of my character to avoid making everything easy. Bad design.

I hope you're intentionally being dense.

I'm level 47 at the moment...didn't even do the whole blacksmith/enchanting powerleveling thing (although I do use them)...and I'm starting to waltz through the game. However, I think that's a good run. Just because we CAN hit 50, let alone 81, doesn't mean the game will be challenging the whole way. In addition, most TES games lose their challenge around level 25 anyway. Well, atleast starting with Morrowind. I've decided to wait until the patch to see if there will be any "balance" fixes or possibly a new difficulty released. In the mean time I'll be playing Zelda:SS.

Think of it as achieving godhood and start another character.

What's your solution?

One that still allows those of us who don't power level to play the game.

EDIT - I mean play the game on Master, I shouldn't have to power level to play on Master