Paarthurnax or Blades? : V - Skyrim

» Mon Jun 18, 2012 10:42 pm

I prefer to let him live. He taught the mortals to use the Voice and in doing so enabled them to defeat Alduin and save the world. By the time the Akaviri Dragonguard arrived in Skyrim, Alduin had been banished and Paarthurnax was living peacefully on the top of the Throat of the World. Perhaps Alduin spent some time in Akavir before the Dragon War; it would explain if he could recognize Dragonsbane. But as far as we know Paarthurnax never fought the Akaviri Dragonguard or their successors, the Blades. If they somehow did reach the top of the mountain, he would have been entirely justified in killing them.

Im not so sure, according to Alduin's Wall(The far left panel) the Avaviri Dragonguard fought right alongside the Ancient Nord Heros against Alduin and his men during the Dragon War. Since Alduin at that time ruled over everything...not just Skyrim or Tamriel....I think its safe to say the Avaviri were the first to rebel against the Dragons(or Alduin and his dragons invadved Akavir but met severe resistance from the Avaviri and were forced to abandon the plan when the Nords rebelled)....However, when Skyrim decided to rebel against Alduin's rule, Alduin turned his attention from Akavir and wanted to qwell the rebellion in skyrim....however the Akaviri Dragon guard followed Alduin to Skyrim....its plausible...afterall, it wasn't discovered until many years later that the Vikings traveled and discovered north American before columbus did. It wasn't like the Blades just allowed anyone into Sky Haven Temple...and they spent considerabel resources creating Alduin Wall (which portrays the blades history from the Dragon war to present dayShowing the Avaviri Dragon Guard supporting the Nord Heros) The Avaviri either used Dragonbane against the Dragons, or lent it to a Nord Hero whom they considered worthy(most likely a Dragonborn Hero). also, The Avaviri DragonGuard may have helped train the Ancient nords how to kill these Dragons as they were experts at this, The Nords had no prior expereince fighting them and fighting them is different then just fighting men.

Alduin recognizes Dragonbane because its probably the one weapon wielded against him that actually really hurt him....it was different from other weapons...its secrects are still not fully understood....the weapon has a mysterious past, we know its an Akaviri artifact, we know its very old because Alduin recognizes it, were not sure exactly how it was created....was it created by magic? perhaps one of the divines blessed a weapon of the Avakrir Dragonguard? we may never know.

On a side note, its too bad Alduin never had a showdown with Pelinal Whitestrake(The Divine Crusader), he wielded the weapons given to him by the Eight Divines before Talos Ascended, the Mace of Stendarr, the Boots of Kyne, etc...I wonder if the Divine Crusadrer would have been able to do battle with Alduin and hurt him with weapons forged by the Divines themselves....I wonder if The Divine Crusader would have even needed Dragonrend...I would think those weapons he had forged by the Divines themselves would be able to hurt Alduin one would think...as they were not created by mortal or daedric hands...

» Mon Jun 18, 2012 11:00 pm

I just want the ability to decide for myself what "consequence" I'm willing to option. Right now.... there's no real consequences to anything. So that makes me feel - useless. And sometimes superfluous.

I can only hope that they WANTED people to be confused. To be forced to make a choice based solely on values, rather than consequences. Maybe consequences will be shown later (again, I can only hope).

Not to make too many comparisons, but DA2 ended somewhat like this. Knight Templar Meredith kinda has the same rep with many players as Delphine it seems. She's a [censored], basically. But the Templar side had some valid points, so it makes some people torn on where to look for answers... other than their values.

» Mon Jun 18, 2012 1:51 pm

I can only hope that they WANTED people to be confused. To be forced to make a choice based solely on values, rather than consequences. Maybe consequences will be shown later (again, I can only hope).

Not to make too many comparisons, but DA2 ended somewhat like this. Knight Templar Meredith kinda has the same rep with many players as Delphine it seems. She's a [censored], basically. But the Templar side had some valid points, so it makes some people torn on where to look for answers... other than their values.

Oh, I try not to let my RL values interfere (other than that I just cannot do TG *shrug* It is what it is.... deal.) But the lack of consequences, even when I'm NOT channeling RL stuff, bothers me extremely. Again, I point out that I LOVE this game.... but some things seem to me to need fixing....

» Mon Jun 18, 2012 1:24 pm

Paarthurnax. I mean look at him, he's a boss!

» Mon Jun 18, 2012 5:16 pm

Oh, I try not to let my RL values interfere (other than that I just cannot do TG *shrug* It is what it is.... deal.) But the lack of consequences, even when I'm NOT channeling RL stuff, bothers me extremely. Again, I point out that I LOVE this game.... but some things seem to me to need fixing....

It bothers me too, so I can only hope the consequences are left out intentionally, and they'll revisit them in an expansion. It seems too big to overlook at least, that I think it was done that way.

As for values.. yeah.. I dunno.. maybe that's not exactly the right word. Just relying on our instincts or whatnot. Again, to borrow another example from Dragon Age, Flemeth has a great line. "We stand upon the precipice of change. The world fears the inevitable plummet into the abyss. Watch for that moment...and when it comes, do not hesitate to leap." She doesn't tell the character what to do.. she just tells them to leap. Maybe it's the same situation here.

» Mon Jun 18, 2012 6:20 pm

Im not so sure, according to Alduin's Wall(The far left panel) the Avaviri Dragonguard fought right alongside the Ancient Nord Heros against Alduin and his men during the Dragon War. Since Alduin at that time ruled over everything...not just Skyrim or Tamriel....I think its safe to say the Avaviri were the first to rebel against the Dragons(or Alduin and his dragons invadved Akavir but met severe resistance from the Avaviri and were forced to abandon the plan when the Nords rebelled)....However, when Skyrim decided to rebel against Alduin's rule, Alduin turned his attention from Akavir and wanted to qwell the rebellion in skyrim....however the Akaviri Dragon guard followed Alduin to Skyrim....its plausible...afterall, it wasn't discovered until many years later that the Vikings traveled and discovered north American before columbus did. It wasn't like the Blades just allowed anyone into Sky Haven Temple...and they spent considerabel resources creating Alduin Wall (which portrays the blades history from the Dragon war to present dayShowing the Avaviri Dragon Guard supporting the Nord Heros) The Avaviri either used Dragonbane against the Dragons, or lent it to a Nord Hero whom they considered worthy(most likely a Dragonborn Hero). also, The Avaviri DragonGuard may have helped train the Ancient nords how to kill these Dragons as they were experts at this, The Nords had no prior expereince fighting them and fighting them is different then just fighting men.

Alduin recognizes Dragonbane because its probably the one weapon wielded against him that actually really hurt him....it was different from other weapons...its secrects are still not fully understood....the weapon has a mysterious past, we know its an Akaviri artifact, we know its very old because Alduin recognizes it, were not sure exactly how it was created....was it created by magic? perhaps one of the divines blessed a weapon of the Avakrir Dragonguard? we may never know.

On a side note, its too bad Alduin never had a showdown with Pelinal Whitestrake(The Divine Crusader), he wielded the weapons given to him by the Eight Divines before Talos Ascended, the Mace of Stendarr, the Boots of Kyne, etc...I wonder if the Divine Crusadrer would have been able to do battle with Alduin and hurt him with weapons forged by the Divines themselves....I wonder if The Divine Crusader would have even needed Dragonrend...I would think those weapons he had forged by the Divines themselves would be able to hurt Alduin one would think...as they were not created by mortal or daedric hands...

Maybe they fought Alduin in Akavir. But they did not fight him in Skyrim. The Dragonguard in Alduin's wall were not fighting the dragons on the right side, but were rather kneeling to the Last Dragonborn on the left side. They did know of the prophecy of the Last Dragonborn, and it's possible it originated with them. But there is no evidence linking the Akaviri to the ancient Dragon War, even if they seemed very interested in it. The first known appearance of the Dragonguard was in the late First Era, long after the Tongues sent Alduin forward in time. I've seen nothing suggesting that they were ever in Skyrim before that. It wasn't them that defeated Alduin and his Dragon allies, it was the Nords Tongues that defeated them. The Dragonguard came to Skyrim much later, and wiped out the dragons that survived both the Dragon War and their dragon genocide in Akavir. Most of them, at least.

» Tue Jun 19, 2012 1:48 am

It bothers me too, so I can only hope the consequences are left out intentionally, and they'll revisit them in an expansion. It seems too big to overlook at least, that I think it was done that way.

As for values.. yeah.. I dunno.. maybe that's not exactly the right word. Just relying on our instincts or whatnot. Again, to borrow another example from Dragon Age, Flemeth has a great line. "We stand upon the precipice of change. The world fears the inevitable plummet into the abyss. Watch for that moment...and when it comes, do not hesitate to leap." She doesn't tell the character what to do.. she just tells them to leap. Maybe it's the same situation here.

I haven't played DA.... it just didn't appeal to me from what my sister said. She liked it, but... we're different people as to games etc. But that's a very apt quote, thanks. It does make sense for THIS game in some ways. Because we ARE taking that leap - of faith, I suppose.

» Mon Jun 18, 2012 6:30 pm

I haven't played DA.... it just didn't appeal to me from what my sister said. She liked it, but... we're different people as to games etc. But that's a very apt quote, thanks. It does make sense for THIS game in some ways. Because we ARE taking that leap - of faith, I suppose.

The one thing I hate about this trend is that DLC/Expansions can't come out soon enough. Cliffhangers are OK in television, where you get a chance to see what happens next week. Game developers probably want to create that sort of story tension, but they still piss me off because they're not technically capable of doing it. It's not exactly conducive to the medium. People pay 50 to 60 bucks for a game, and get teased a lot these days. Everything is developed with DLC or trilogies in mind now.

» Tue Jun 19, 2012 4:54 am

The one thing I hate about this trend is that DLC/Expansions can't come out soon enough. Cliffhangers are OK in television, where you get a chance to see what happens next week. Game developers probably want to create that sort of story tension, but they still piss me off because they're not technically capable of doing it. It's not exactly conducive to the medium. People pay 50 to 60 bucks for a game, and get teased a lot these days. Everything is developed with DLC or trilogies in mind now.

QFT.... the only people who DON'T have the issue are those of us on PC - because as soon as the CK releases, we'll have gazoolas of mods to play with.

» Mon Jun 18, 2012 1:01 pm

QFT.... the only people who DON'T have the issue are those of us on PC - because as soon as the CK releases, we'll have gazoolas of mods to play with.

OFT, I don't know much about modding ES games... but I hope that someone makes a mod were you basically tell the blades to shut the hell up... as they they are meant to protect the dragonborn and to follow his/her orders. I really can't decide what to do, on one hand I like the blades and want to rebuild them... on the other I don't really want to kill Paarthurnax. Past crimes or no crimes... when it comes down to it... without him the dragonborn wouldn't have been able to save the world. It was a war...

» Mon Jun 18, 2012 9:16 pm

OFT, I don't know much about modding ES games... but I hope that someone makes a mod were you basically tell the blades to shut the hell up... as they they are meant to protect the dragonborn and to follow his/her orders. I really can't decide what to do, on one hand I like the blades and want to rebuild them... on the other I don't really want to kill Paarthurnax. Past crimes or no crimes... when it comes down to it... without him the dragonborn wouldn't have been able to save the world. It was a war...

I understand the need for such a mod, but isn't that kind of unfulfilling, since it doesn't come from the creators? It's basically fan-fiction in mod form

Anyhow, I'm pretty sure they've set it up that Paarth is going to garner sympathy from at least half the playerbase, and they'll address that.

» Mon Jun 18, 2012 4:35 pm

I understand the need for such a mod, but isn't that kind of unfulfilling, since it doesn't come from the creators? It's basically fan-fiction in mod form :biggrin:

Anyhow, I'm pretty sure they've set it up that Paarth is going to garner sympathy from at least half the playerbase, and they'll address that.

Kind of, but for an RP perspective... I want to be able to have choice. Something BS should have put in the game in the first place. Plus we have no real way of knowing if BS will touch upon it during DLC (I mean it seems like they will), but doesn't mean they will.

» Mon Jun 18, 2012 11:07 pm

Yes the Avaviri's and the people of Tameriel have had their squabbles so to speak....however, the very reason the Avaviri Dragonguard were "allowed" to raise in rank to become the Emperor's personal guard was because their presence was misunderstood....The Avaviri Dragonguard DID NOT come to Skyrim or Tamreiel to take over...they came in search of the Dragonborn....The Blades had been fighting Dragons for centuries....but they could not permantly kill them...they kept coming back to life...The blades learned of individual who could devour a dragons soul and permantely kill him....that is why they came..in search of one with that gift, to teach him, to train him, and to help him set history right the way it should be.

where do the Greybeards get their info? They have gotten all their info from Parthurnaax...Parthurnaax has been lieing to them for a long time...Parthurnaax has left out the whole left side of Alduin Walls (Where the Avaviri Blades are shown helping the Nord Heros fight the Dragons) Proof: If you Attack Alduin on the Throat of the World with DragonBane he will say: "You have the weapon of youre ancestors, but you lack their skill" Dragonbane is an Ancient, revered Avaviri Katana and Artifact of the Blades/Avavirir Dragonguard....now how would Alduin know of this blade, and knowthe Nordic Ancestors used this blade.against him..unless it was given/lent to a Dragonborn during the Great War by the Akaviri helpers that Parthurnaax and his little stone tablets to Throat of the World so conviently leave out.

Parthurnaax tells you at the end that he plans to "force" all dragons to see the right of his Th'um (meaning he is the top dog now) if they want to hear it or not...Parthurnaax plans to exert his power over the other dovah...

Odaving himself tells you at the End that Parthurnaax is a TYRANT....he tells you "he doubts most of the dovah would trade Alduin lordship for the tyranny of Parthurnaax's way of the voice"

who would better know Parthurnaax's true intentions then Odaving? by letting Parthurnaax live, you are letting him have the last laugh....he flat out tells you he is going to force the other dragons under his leadership by forcing them to the way of the voice...so he says...also Parthurnaax says "he feels younger then he ever has"...meaning his old ways are coming back....once Parthurnaax has bent the other dovah to his will...the real temptation of power will be dangling right in front of his face...its like telling a kid not to get a cookie out of the cookie jar and then walking away...Parthurnaax hiding on that mountain for all those years was an act....he secluded himself for thousands of years so he could let his plan come to fruition.....he had to remove himself from temptation until the time was right....that was his plan all along.

Also, you do realize that many of the Avaviri swords of fallen Blades that hung in Cloud ruler Temple in Bruma are there because of of Parthurnaax....the Blades have every right to want him brought to justice for what he has done.....Do you think Jaufree, Baurus, and the others did not know of Parthurnaax? of course they did....thye didn't want confrontation with the Greybeards because the Greybeards are being manipulated, they were being lied to....the Greybeards did not deserve to die at the hands of the Blades for protecting someone who has lied and manipulated their order for centuries..Parthurnaax founded the Way of the Voice and trained the Greybeards to not only help the Dragonborn.....that was second fiddle. their true purpose was to protect him from the justice of the Blades....to prevent the Blades from coming up that mountain after him...as Parthurnaax knew the Blades were men of honor...they would kill innocent men...thats why the books in Sky Haven Temple says the Grandmaster wanted to avoid direct confrontation with the Greybeards while they waited for the time to extract justice...

Think about it...yes the Greybeards could use the Voice....yes they could put up a fight against the blades if needed, however...the Blades at that time would have and could have went right through the Greybeards if they wanted to...The blades number in the many thousands all over Tamriel at that time...5 Greybeards with The Voice ar enot going to be able to beat thousands of highly trained, armed blades....see Red Mountain...where the Shouting Nords were beaten by the Dunmer..

The Blades didn't want to hurt the Greybeards because the Greybeards had not done anything wrong...the blades knew the Greybeards were being manipulated into protecting Parthurnaax....thats the big reason the Blades and the Greybeards had a rift...because the Greybeards wouldn't listen to early Grandmasters of the Blades...and the blades were not going to "go through" the Greybeards to get to Parthurnaax because thats not justice, and its not the honor bound way of the Blades to do something like that....

Also, the Blades are not dead....in skyrim...we know of only two Blades left....however...its not out of the realm of posibility that there are remaining blades in Cyrodill, and the other provinces that once they hear of "men killing dragons in Skyrim with Akaviri curved long swords" they may come out of hiding to see and find whats left of their order....Also, just because in game you can only recruit 3 doesn't mean more won't be recruited by the Dragonborn...The 3 limit was put into place i think to prevent a lot of lag by having a Dragon or two + you + 3 helpers on screen at once....The Blades could very easily be rebuilt...now they Have a Dragonborn....They have their Ancient records back, a lot of what was lost at cloud ruler temple is at Sky Haven...their history and lineage is in tact...The Blades are very well in tact and on the rise.

The Blades will play a very important role in the Empire's next showdown with the Thalmor....as they will get even for what the Thalmor done to them...and restore sactity to Talos sacred name...Remember what Jaufree said...The Blades are known as the Order of Talos.....its also their honor sworn duty to honor the name of Talos...

The books ar ekinda stetchy, but the Greybeards told Tiber Septim that he had to go south to build an empire....its not outside the realm of posibility that tiber Septim found out who and what Parthurnaax really was and wanted to put an end to him then, and the Greybeards protected him....and The Greybeards "nice way" of telling him to leave was telling him to carve out an empire down south...thus occupying him with building an empire and he doesn't have time to worry about Parthurnaax....thats a very valid assumption....

Jaufree, Baurus, the other great Blades...if they were alive in skyrim...they would want Parthurnaax brought to justice for his crimes....The Greybeards makes excuses for him because they don't want to believe in their hearts how much of a bad guy Parthurnaax is....

Don't get me wrong...i liked Parthurnaax...i wish i didn't have to end him...I did not get pleasure out of ending him...but it was the right thing to do....setting right a centuries old wrong....thousands of years to a dragon is equivalaent to like 70 years for a person since dragons are immortal....so by that anology should a man who has commited heinoius acts be left alone after 70 years? should justice not be served? Should we make exceptions in the law for one but not another?

just because Parthurnaax is a dragon and he helped people...that excuses him for his crimes? Parthurnaax commited atrocities that are crimes....either the law is applied equally to all be they human or dragon...or they are not applied at all....they have to be uniform and applied equally to all or there is no law....im sure the Emperor's agreed with the blades(or else the Blades would not have been plotting in secret behind the emperor's back to exact justice on Parthurnaax) they just agreed the blades would not hurt the Greybeards in the process who had done nothing wrong because thats not justice...

also again...Remember Odavings words...a dragon telling you Parthurnaax is seen as a tyrant by other dragons....who better to known Parthurnaax then one of his own kind....atleast Odaving has honor...he is upfront with you, and swears his service to you not only because you beat alduin twice, but you defeated him in single combat and trapped him...and he made an oath to serve you...Odaving is honorable and upfront about his intentions....Parthurnaax not so much.

damn very well said. See YOU fleshed it out with explanation to where theres a reason behind it all. Now in the game im really gonna have to thin about killign him or sparing him...but ill be very honest it boils down if i kill him im stuck with the blades "who i feel i dunno violated almost with the ultimatum, it goes against everything i knew about the blades them doign that" or i can let him live and have the wisdom u shared on my conscience but im free of the blade pretenders in my eyes...gah! Im with u on the whoel Paar situation "dunno if ill kill him or not but ill actually ahvesomethign on my conscience for once if i let him live" but i still dotn liek the whoel blades situation in the game. Like you i wish they had changed it up iu dunno maybe lets say u let him live, delphie yells at ya but she stays on and u can recruit more people and u get the perk from the greybeards and i forgot the word walls they tell ya OR u can kill Paar Delphies happy u get an "enhanced" blade armor, u can recruit, theyll tell ya the word and dragon locations AND u get the perk from them. One side u get a perk and word location with recuiting and on the other u get Enhanced gear, perk, word and dragons, recruiting and that nice weapon. So u get rewarded more doing something hard or u get bare bones and feel good inside lol. Either way, it just boogles my mind why no matter what side i chose i should still get the blades at my back because i am the dragonborn and it dosent make since that the blades throw away their only purpose "well was before thye started going all dragonguard instead which explains alot and i guess pisses me off".
Good points, now it boils down to weither i wanna deal with the blades for the rest of the game or feel good with a conscience inside..

» Tue Jun 19, 2012 2:08 am

The Blades aren't consistent in their reasoning at all. Paarth is evil and has to die and you can't trust dragons, according to them. What about Odhaviing? They have no issue with me actively using a dragon to terminate my enemies, often of which are human? The only time Delphine even mentions him is when she remarks about me flying a dragon to get to Alduin's portal. Odha also used to kill "innocents" I'm sure, since Alduin brought him back from the dead and he's pretty old.

Then there's the fact that the Blades totally disrespect their Dragonborn. They force you to act as a courier and constantly prove yourself, then they ham it up with how great you are and what a legend you've become after you slayed Alduin, and then drop you at the turn of a dime over Paarth despite it all. They can't use the oath excuse because they didn't go after Odhaviing either, so in reality it's about personal vengeance coming before sense and integrity.

Whether Paarth turns out to be Alduin #2 or not hardly matters. He's not as powerful as Alduin as has been made clear, nor does he have Alduin's ability to keep coming back to life. He's a powerful dragon but an easily bested one at that, especially since you have dragon rend (which he taught you) and the ability to summon a dragon for help or use storm call and rip them apart without even touching them. He gave you the tools to make sure it's impossible for him to rule the world, and unlikely to rule the dragons. Oh yeah, and there's still the elder scroll which you possess or at least the magic library possesses.

The only thing I got out of the blades was a good dragon killing weapon for mid-levels (the enchanted blade sword) and a home base in Riverwood which I use since they abandoned it.

» Mon Jun 18, 2012 9:34 pm

Think of it this way: Paarth is immortal save a violent death, you on the other hand are not.

Paarth might have betrayed Alduin because Paarth believed that HE should control the world with his Thu'um, thus teaching the Greybeards and other dragons the Way of the Voice: which Paarth would use to inspire his followers to attack mankind and control Tamriel. But he can not do this with you alive. So he decieves you by playing off the harmless act (much like Delphine and Esbern, apparently nobody can be trusted) and is waiting for you to die of old age.

You can stop Paarth himself, but if you die without killing him then the rest of Tamriel would not be able to get rid of him, his legions of dragons, draugr, dragon priests, and the Greybeards.

The blades don't want to deal with someone who is willing to risk the destruction of mankind simply for his sense of morality, which can often times be blinded by deception.

» Mon Jun 18, 2012 12:48 pm

I had a few qualms about killing parthurnax, I thought "well if you want him dead then YOU kill him!" but after reading through this thread, "I" might kill him...it svcks though, can't we all just get along?

Apparently not.

Many of the things people wrote against Paarthurnax are either inaccurate or totally negatively speculative based on prejudice of his being a Dragon anyway. If U wanted to spare Paarthurnax U have many more real reasons to do so, so your first instinct/choice not to was more likely right. U can just be yourself.

» Mon Jun 18, 2012 12:47 pm

The blades don't want to deal with someone who is willing to risk the destruction of mankind simply for his sense of morality, which can often times be blinded by deception.

That's how I view them. People go on about their oath, but why should they care about an oath when there is such a clash of priorities. I think it's best that they're either set up as friends or enemies. Not enemies, who bite their tongue, and do what they're told simply because you're dragonborn. While that might be ideal, it's pretty boring gameplay and storywise. It's good to have conflict of interests (or a further friendship from shared ones).

» Mon Jun 18, 2012 5:32 pm

all excellent points but i do have a different opionions on situations as in ok the "tyranny of the way of the voice"....yes to dragons it will seem like tyranny when someone is gonna deny ur "habits and way of thinking"....its like telling someone that they HAVE to quit eating meat and eat veggies form now on for no other reason that eating meat means ending thelife of an animal life form below u.....
Also i was under the impression that Tiber Septim had to conquer the DragonGuard FIRST and then afterwards they found out he was dagonborn and swore the oath to serve and protect the dragonborn as a way of sentence for making up for the atrocities they have done......so by that means if the Blades can attone their sins by doing works why not Paar?
Also i dotn agree with the idea of Greybeards "protecting" paar from Tiber by tellign him to go south, otherwise why did Tiber and pretty much every Emporer forbade the Blades form goign after Paar if at first they wanted paar dead why not tell the Blades to go for it. Im not aware of any contract or agreement between Greybeards and Tiber on the grounds of dealing with Paar or hell the greybeards themselves.
Also the mass amoutn of Blade graves right there on the side of the mountain.....so u saying that soemone comes to you and trys to kill you and u kill them back. because form the location of the graves, it looks like the Blades came to Paar, Paar didnt go outta his way and find the blades because they were comign after him on that mountain where hes been chillin and fought back against someoen who came after him and wanted him dead....thats not Justice for the Blades, thats a hunter getting onsessed with a dangerous game that have eluded and killed their earlier hunters when they went after it and feel its a swore duty to finish the hunt because peopel have lose thier lives over it...hunter being angry and obsessed that its game has remained free for so long..
also remember the Nords didnt actually form/come from skyrim, they came from High Rock same place as the DragonGuard so yes there would eb pictures depicting Nords and dragonGuards fightign dragons from that point of view.

also the whoel order of talos thing...the game breaks it when the "blades" give u an ultimatum to not follow u and follow their oath for not killing Paar....someoen may i remind that tiber himself forbade the baldes going after. so if the mighty talos himself didnt want dead BUT because i also have same feelign as the almighty Talos...im not good enuf or a true "dragonborn"?

Yes, and i agree with those who discern that it has not been shown Paarhurnax should die, nor that Dragonborn should be disowned for not doing so, on the orders of Delphine...just because someone speculates out of mistrust in dragons or loyalty to the Blades idea, things like: ..that supposedly Paarthurnax started The Way of The Voice only as an evil plot to take over the world instead of Alduin..or could do this or that ..later..etc..etc.....Well yanno Jurgen Windcaller started The Way of The Voice to correct abuse/misuse of the voice, not done by Paarthurnax tho teaching of the voice to human heros again could of course not been done without Paarth being the Dragon willing to do so based on his own aquired sympathy to them, (unless a god with the power to do so, decided to do so again. ) And the WALL (that was claimed not to tell more parts of the story told in exactly the way blades sympathiizers want it there) is called 'Alduin's Wall' not Paarthurnax Wall! So Parth' should not be punished for that either way. All the stuff against Paarthurnax ..claiming he should die, theory is based on speculation due to mistrust of dragons and the web of speculations against him and what is to be pre-blamed on him even in future-times that have not come, is usualy elaborate negative and speculative web weaved around that. Though i do not agree with every idea the Greybeards have, i think they have been more honest than than Delphine (i do not hate her either, but i think she is stubbornly wrong and not fair to Dragonborn either) Besides that life would not exist at all except for Paarth's aid to humans, also Delphine could not even get into see Alduin's Wall if not for the True Dragonborn sacrificing own blood to activate the way in, and right away she claims it as a Base for the Blades.that they are in charge of above u.and acts like u are a stranger in your own new home-base almost...after claiming the Blades exist to serve the Dragonborn? She then puts a moral dilemna in front of u to kill Paarthurnax or be disowned, knowing u also have affilliation with Paarthurnax and the Greybeards who see alternatives to the genocide of ALL dragons? Thereby essentially setting u up to be a traitor and judged as a traitor thru-out history if u obey her command to kill your other friends, such as Kill Paarth' and betray the Greybeards who are honored in Skyrim and respected for good reason. . Well if she does not want to play nicely, maybe she should get out of the base u provided her cause It was YOUR blood that opened the way in for a reason, not hers. Think about it. :wink:

» Mon Jun 18, 2012 12:39 pm

BTW, does anyone at least dig the armor?

I know you can get it without joining, but then... that's kind of weird, if you roleplay at all.

I think it's cool not just for dragonbane, but the armor was one of the only form fitting heavy sets around (the others being Wolf and maybe banded iron). I'd rather be a dragonslayer than walk around looking like Fred Flintstone or Sauron.

» Mon Jun 18, 2012 3:48 pm

Ignoring all the Lore behind it, Paarthurnax seems to offer more benefits then the blades.
e.g. meditating on words as oppose to just having a follower i find to be more beneficial to myself.

» Tue Jun 19, 2012 2:22 am

In short: which is (aside from who is the cooler character) the best path to choose?

What does your heart tell you, Dovakiin?

» Mon Jun 18, 2012 5:28 pm

Ignoring all the Lore behind it, Paarthurnax seems to offer more benefits then the blades.
e.g. meditating on words as oppose to just having a follower i find to be more beneficial to myself.

I don't know.. Probably the best way to get a benefit out of that is to induct followers whom you would otherwise pay for (i.e. Marcurio).

» Tue Jun 19, 2012 3:43 am

Ignoring all the Lore behind it, Paarthurnax seems to offer more benefits then the blades.
e.g. meditating on words as oppose to just having a follower i find to be more beneficial to myself.

Nah, Blades definetly have more benefits. You get a temporary effect called "dragon slayer's blessing" as well as a permanet perk called Dragon Infusion, except it's buged on PC for some reason. Probably to sell more Xbox and PS.

» Mon Jun 18, 2012 7:37 pm

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