Pelinal and the Loveletter : The Elder Scrolls Series Discussion

» Mon Feb 28, 2011 1:07 pm

So,I've heard theroies how Pelinal might be from the future,and of course the whole story behind the loveletter revolves about a message from the future.But,if Akatosh/Alduin is the present in Nirn and devours the past and creates the future,how is this time traveling possible?Surely they can't be from the future if the future is yet to be created?

Can't think of anything to rectify this other than Pelinal and the person behind the loveletter may have just read the Elder Scrolls.

» Sun Feb 27, 2011 9:19 pm

Time isn't stricly linear in TES. That's the point.

» Mon Feb 28, 2011 5:09 am

Also, Pelinal is da terminata!

» Mon Feb 28, 2011 4:38 am

Dont forget that time has been altered several times.
Warp in the West for example where several world changing/regional things happened at the same time.

» Mon Feb 28, 2011 5:48 am

For additional brain-melting time-warping talk, read up on Numidium and what happened during every instance of its use. Oh, and don't forget the Dragon Break(s).

» Mon Feb 28, 2011 10:04 am

I know about the dragon breaks,but I thought only stuff which could happen at the time of the dragon break could happen e.g the Hero of Daggerfall's choices - I don't see how things from the future could appear as it hasn't been created yet.

» Mon Feb 28, 2011 10:48 am

I know about the dragon breaks,but I thought only stuff which could happen at the time of the dragon break could happen e.g the Hero of Daggerfall's choices - I don't see how things from the future could appear as it hasn't been created yet.

I don't think it was ever explained how it snuck into the past, but that's kinda a superfluous detail in the context of things. All that really matters is the Loveletter's content.
If I were to gander a guess, I might say that the Loveletter ended up in the "wrong" point in time by the time Time reassembled itself after a Dragon Break, but that's just me doing a bit of my usual aimless brute force approach to trying to figuring out lore.

» Mon Feb 28, 2011 9:42 am

Many things remain unexplained in TES universe. I assume time-travel falls into that category at this time. Imo.

» Sun Feb 27, 2011 11:37 pm

It's a dragon fart. A lesser variety of the dragon break.

» Mon Feb 28, 2011 3:48 pm

It's a dragon fart. A lesser variety of the dragon break.

This is why giving that ol' dragon of time too much fiber is a bad idea, as he'll end up being extremely gassy.

» Mon Feb 28, 2011 1:22 am

Pelinal is a god-robot-homonculus-berserker who displays odd world-eating tendencies when he gets too angry (on a regional level, though). If he is a Shezzarine then he is related to Akatosh/Alduin and therefore doesn't so much time travel as ignore it's flow (why else wouldn't the Dragon Language have verb tenses?) but that doesn't make it related to the loveletter in itself.

Just like how with magic, you can either speak it into truth by Thu'um or you can manipulate probability the way they do in the Mages Guild, but either way the thing gets done. There are many ways to do one thing in Tamriel.

» Mon Feb 28, 2011 7:58 am

There are many ways to do one thing in Tamriel.

As the old saying goes "there's more than one way to skin a cat." (Who skins cats anyway? Some of my best friends are cats. If you know any cat skinners contact the ASPCA and do it ASAP or I'll be very PO'ed and tell you ESS TEE EFF YOU and GTFO)

You can freeze a man in his tracks with a paralysis spell, a touch of burden or by damaging his strength, but he ain't moving one way or the other. Could these be said to be fundamentally different effects if the result is the same?

» Mon Feb 28, 2011 11:58 am

Although, in light of a certain other thread around here now, do you think he is actually from the past?

Or does it matter?

» Mon Feb 28, 2011 3:00 pm

Pelinal is both Akatosh and Lorkhan in the same body. And that really svcks.

The former is insane, which explains a lot. The former is also the god of time. He's not a time traveler, he just exists in and moves through time in an unusual way. He can transcend time. This sort of shenanigans is probably why avatars of Akatosh are rare.

» Mon Feb 28, 2011 10:26 am

He is historical inaccuracy made manifest. He jumps forward hundreds of years not because some scholar/storyteller messed up (that did happen, though), but because he did jump forward hundreds of years.

» Mon Feb 28, 2011 4:19 pm

As the old saying goes "there's more than one way to skin a cat." (Who skins cats anyway? Some of my best friends are cats. If you know any cat skinners contact the ASPCA and do it ASAP or I'll be very PO'ed and tell you ESS TEE EFF YOU and GTFO)

You can freeze a man in his tracks with a paralysis spell, a touch of burden or by damaging his strength, but he ain't moving one way or the other. Could these be said to be fundamentally different effects if the result is the same?

I have no clue who would skin a cat, but those people need a kick in the nuts.

And that is exactly what I mean! Magic is probability made fact despite being so low as to be impossible, and the Schools are just artificial ways of making it easier to reach the end result.I could also link it to to the duality of space-time and the like, but I'm not in the mood.

» Mon Feb 28, 2011 9:11 am

Pelinal is both Akatosh and Lorkhan in the same body. And that really svcks.

The former is insane, which explains a lot. The former is also the god of time. He's not a time traveler, he just exists in and moves through time in an unusual way. He can transcend time. This sort of shenanigans is probably why avatars of Akatosh are rare.

I understand Pelinal to be a Shezarrine, where is it said that he is an aspect of Akatosh as well?

» Mon Feb 28, 2011 7:19 am

I understand Pelinal to be a Shezarrine, where is it said that he is an aspect of Akatosh as well?

If you look at the relationship between Akatosh and Lorkhan, Pelinal gets involved by default.

» Mon Feb 28, 2011 3:46 am

I understand Pelinal to be a Shezarrine, where is it said that he is an aspect of Akatosh as well?

There's a complicated relationship between Akatosh and Lorkhan. Maybe someone else can explain it.
Here, read at this, Pelinal speaking to Alessia upon her deathbed:

"... and left you to gather sinew with my other half, who will bring light thereby to that mortal idea that brings [the Gods] great joy, that is, freedom, which even the Heavens do not truly know, [which is] why our Father, the... [Text lost]... in those first [days/spirits/swirls] before Convention... that which we echoed in our earthly madness. [Let us] now take you Up. We will [show] our true faces... [which eat] one another in amnesia each Age."

By the way, I'm reading the Song of Pelinal again, and at one point it says

Pelinal called out Haromir of Copper and Tea into a duel at the Tor, and ate his neck-veins while screaming praise to Reman, a name that no one knew yet.

which is awesome and all, but I don't understand why he was screaming praise to Reman...? Anyone know what the deal is there?

» Mon Feb 28, 2011 5:04 pm

Pelinal's armor and weapons are from a future era for him. The only piece we may have a known time of creation for is the mace. The other pieces might not have been made yet. Any individual with an Elder Scroll can alter past events. If someone had access to Hermaeus Mora's library, maintained thier sanity and returned to Mundus, they might be able find the method that was used for transporting the "Love Letter". It could be a ruse by a Daedric prince to strengthen thier position in Oblivion. EDIT If someone had access to pieces of Jygallag's library, they could know some future events.

» Mon Feb 28, 2011 7:08 am

which is awesome and all, but I don't understand why he was screaming praise to Reman...? Anyone know what the deal is there?

Reman was a cool guy. Point is, he didn't exist yet.

Pelinal has a hole in his chest and fights for humanity like Shor. He's bat[censored] insane and transcends time like Akatosh. He is sometimes lucid and and sometimes a blood-crazed maniac that not only destroys, but removes from the timeline.

» Mon Feb 28, 2011 8:44 am

Reman was a cool guy. Point is, he didn't exist yet.

Pelinal has a hole in his chest and fights for humanity like Shor. He's bat[censored] insane and transcends time like Akatosh. He is sometimes lucid and and sometimes a blood-crazed maniac that not only destroys, but removes from the timeline.

Yeah, but... why scream Reman's name specifically? Is there any relevance to it? Or was it just chosen because Reman is a major figure, and this serves to illustrate Pelinal's... insanity, for lack of a better word.

What I'm asking is, does it matter than he screamed "Reman" and not "Pelagius", for example?

» Mon Feb 28, 2011 3:07 pm

He is historical inaccuracy made manifest. He jumps forward hundreds of years not because some scholar/storyteller messed up (that did happen, though), but because he did jump forward hundreds of years.

No, he jumps around several times because other Shezzarines mantled Shezzar in the same exact way. *cough* CoC *cough*

» Mon Feb 28, 2011 11:11 am

Yeah, but... why scream Reman's name specifically? Is there any relevance to it? Or was it just chosen because Reman is a major figure, and this serves to illustrate Pelinal's... insanity, for lack of a better word.

What I'm asking is, does it matter than he screamed "Reman" and not "Pelagius", for example?

If you haven't read the best book in vanilla Oblivion, go read it now: http://imperial-library.info/content/oblivion-remanada

Reman was a supernatural child conceived by Hrol and Alessia centuries after her death, and Cyrod herself gave birth to him. He renewed the Covenant and was born with Chim-el Adabal on his forehead. So he does have some relation to Pelinal and Co.

» Mon Feb 28, 2011 6:49 am

If you haven't read the best book in vanilla Oblivion, go read it now: http://imperial-library.info/content/oblivion-remanada

Reman was a supernatural child conceived by Hrol and Alessia centuries after her death, and Cyrod herself gave birth to him. He renewed the Covenant and was born with Chim-el Adabal on his forehead. So he does have some relation to Pelinal and Co.

Ah, I actually hadn't read it recently; not since reading up on Pelinal and finally getting a grasp on that aspect of lore. Thank you, it's all coming together!