Sounds ridiculous, which is again why I'd argue that the actual solution is that SPECIAL points will be simple enough to come by.

I feel as if I've been ignored on some level.

At any rate, here's a http://oyster.ignimgs.com/wordpress/stg.ign.com/2015/06/CHgojIsWsAAgtNs.jpg-large.jpeg of what I'm talking about. Lvl 24 character with a total of 31 special. Not that big of a jump from the starting 28 really.

That depends on if Int is needed for energy weapons.

Fallout three Energy weapons were modified by(Drumroll) PERCEPTION

Guns were modified by (Drumroll) AGILITY

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pWMRGsy_1lc&feature=youtu.be&t=1m58s

if you look at the chart Gun nut is a level 3 perk(the top row is the old icon for the stat)

so its

Inteligence Icon (Gee so why is the level 3 perk.. . .

unidentifiable icon

unidentifiable Icon

Gun nut (at level 3)

Magazines (aparently) now give a temp boost to a given perk( which aparenly explains why theres reportedly more magazine types)

Longknife your points make no sense.

F3 and new vegas are like identical twins.
I always go back and forth which one is better (it should have been new vegas easily because it stood on f3 shoulders).
You bash on f3 and celebrate new vegas. I get it, you see obsidians logo and cheer. You see bethesdas and boo. You rob yourself because of it.

I rank both f3 and nv better than any other game made.

F4 seems to be a direct continuation of them both.

Gun Nut is at level 4. Medicine is at level 3. You can see it http://imgur.com/GvJH23e.

Gun Nut gives you the ability to mod guns at a work bench.

Science Perk gives you the ability to mod energy weapons at a work bench.

Both gun nut and the science perk are under intelligence.

The fact that energy weapon damage was modified by perception has absolutely nothing to do with the intelligence you need to actually modify the weapons.

Im so thrilled about romanceable companions.

Love the new limited builds. Both in f3 and new vegas you became master of all.

Combat looks amazing.

The feel of the world is beyond words.

And lol dog is made from rl dog!

Well, the educated perk is there if you sink 9 points into intelligence. Maybe they let you get a 2nd perk every 3rd level if you take the educated perk.

Ok look at the FULL IMAGE of the perk poster,

The top row is the SPECIAL Icons, NOT Perk Icons, the one for Intelligence is seen HERE http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Intelligenceand here

https://youtu.be/D5esyZPt5Jo?t=486

when you count below the icon you have 10 rows,(Unless your also arguing that Special now goes to 11 because Hey its one more than 10 and thus better!)

the Icons under the Inteligence Stat Icon

(??)

Aparently a medcial one

Gun not

Aparently a hacking one.

theres nothing to indicate that you need 7 int to actualy make energy weapons

I see. So the science perk could be at level 6. Under the hacking one is Comprehension.

Still, my point about science perk levels being needed to work on energy weapons and the science perk likely being under intelligence still stands.

Probably the only thing I will ever agree with you on.

No if the screen shot someone posted on Neogaf*(My bad for listing it as at Redit) is accurate it take science 9.

OMG, http://i.imgur.com/tJjZKM4.jpg is horrible.

There was a https://www.reddit.com/r/Fallout/comments/3and58/perk_chart_partially_decoded/ page for http://i.imgur.com/tJjZKM4.jpg a while back.

Why? beats haveing it at 10. if it bugs you that mutch just mod the perk needed to gun nut.

(post above) diferent image from what I saw

Thank you.

It's not that bad. I can still http://www.rpg-gaming.com/fo4.html?n=YoungSmeagol&a=2425933 and you don't need to put any points into endurance to get the toughness perk.

I'm with Longknife on this.

If SPECIAL points are limited then you will have diverse characters that will be blocked off from a large portion of the perks. A well rounded guy would never get to any of the perks that require 6 or more, definitely never getting to the level 8's without hardcoe specialization. This would make for really hard choices in character design and force multiple play throughs to start to try out all the various perks.

Or SPECIAL points will be readily available and you can get as high as you want in whatever you want.

Looking at Bethesda's track record I'm betting on the second scenario. On the plus side though it sounds like everyone is bisixual in FO4 so you can marry everyone. That should greatly improve the rich character storytelling that Bethesda is famous for

Well, you should have to make tough choices. You shouldn't be able to get everything you want in one play through.

Bethesdas track record? Seriously? were going by that now to justify as high as you want?

Marrowind Max Level was 78 unless you did a lot of odd things to your character like deliberately spend time in jail or use certain cheats

Oblivion Similar max level

Skyrim they had to put "Legendary" skills to allow you to continue leveling to once you maxed out the skills you really wanted to get the perks you also really wanted

Fallout level cap of 20 then 30...

New vegas does not realy count and you had other cap issues...

Guns and Energy Weapons will likely have multiple perks depending on how you customize your character.

I very much doubt that the 9th perk is Science, as Todd Howard has basically said that the higher perks are more interesting perks. Intelligence 6 looks pretty much the same and I'd argue it is Science. It doesn't make sense putting Science that high.

the reason why people think its a level 9 perk is because http://i.imgur.com/tJjZKM4.jpg

I've seen that image. Also isn't that counter to what many thought before, specifically mentioned in mrmattyplays video how the 9th perk was likely Educated? Also, from a logical standpoint added to the similar looks of both perks, would make sense at all to put such a basic perk so high? 6 is reaching pretty high, it at least comes after Gun Nut and Hacker, and seems to be a natural progression of 'science'? Additionally, isn't the laser pistol a little too high in comparison to the perk image we've seen, compared to 6 with looks closer?

not even remotly

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1084169&page=5

Image has both the science perk and the perk poster images

http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Educated%C2%A0

(Scroll down to the F3 image)

also

http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Chemist

This Educated ( http://cdn.staticneo.com/w/fallout/1/11/Educated_FO3.png) looks much more like the number 9 perk than Science does from E3, and has been the Educated of FO3 and FNV. Also, I have seen that image before, you aren't showing me anything new. Additionally, the guy counters his own image with the list at the bottom that clearly says Educated, so even he isn't sure, seriously just look at the Excel bit.

EDIT: http://tamrielvault.com/group/fallout-character-building/forum/topics/perks-chart-news

This is the earlier chart that I am talking about.

i dont care if science requires 9 int.

i can make normal guns.