The site you are talking about was THE place to upload mods for morrowind. It was the most widely used site and was VERY friendly to the user. You sir/ma'am, according to your post, must be unlearned in the way of modern sites. I'm just saying, this post will cause an inflammation of...dislike towards you. Be careful when giving a personal opinion on a site you apparently never tried to learn. Regardless of whether you actually tried to learn or not, I'm not declaring you didn't. Just saying it doesn't seem like it. Regard this as a fair warning for the future.

Back to the TESAlliance discussion, I LOVE the TESAlliance site. The layout and features are great! I, for one will mainly base my mods there. Until TESNexus is split, I'm sticking to TESAlliance. So user friendly. Nexus is too, but isn't split yet. Other sites...I find them...weird. Not like other sites. So I think TESAlliance is THE place to go from here.

http://www.wolflore.net/portal.php - an advlt community, but we do offer general content as well. Registration is required to view our advlt content.
http://www.fliggerty.com/phpBB3/portal.php - also home to Morrowind Modding History (MMH).
http://tesalliance.org/

Now you know of three alternatives.

Make that four because there is also http://www.tesvskyrim.com/ on http://www.fliggerty.com/phpBB3/index.php.

I assumed the poster meant Morrowind mod sites, Leo. Though THoS is part of the GHF family, it is not a Morrowind modding site.

As far as archiving and re-posting mods elsewhere, I have to ask: When, exactly, does a mod become public domain? We know that mods are not properties that can be sold. In a community with mods that are nearing ten years old, what of the mods that are NOT available on a creator's personal website (meaning, the creator does not have a website) that are no longer suppoorted - ie, the mod is only uploaded on a third party site by the creator, but the creator is no longer responding to the contact information in the readme, and does not have a main site on which to be contacted? When does a mod become considered abandoned? If the mod should vanish from the web and have no support provided by the creator, should it not be considered public domain of some sort? There are often reasons for a creator requiring permissions, but if that means allowing the mod to die after it has been abandoned, I have to wonder. I'm not sure of the legalities of copyrights on mods, considering that as I understand it they cannot legally be sold if they are using any of bethesda's content (meshes from the TES CS disc, for example), though I imagine that a mod consisting of textures alone might be able to be copyrighted since the textures, alone in a void, technically don't use bethesda's files in order to exist.

As I understand it, the modding community has their own unwritten, agreed-upon practice for assigning permissions - so, what are the rules for determining if a mod has been abandoned, and what are the rules governing it if it has been? It seems to be a common thing for older mods to have no support through the emails listed in the readme files... you would think that if the modder intended to retain control over it, they would update that information. Ultimately, who is the authority for permissions and redistribution on older mods that are no longer supported?

I think it varies. I've seen some people pick up abandoned mods and others contend that a license doesn't change just because the author disappears. To an extent, it becomes what you feel comfortable with.

I'm personally of the opinion that if you made every effort to get permissions, and the author has just vanished for years, and you give the full credit, then there is no great sin in continuing their work.

I think it varies on who you ask.

Personally, I'm of the opinion that if the mod is readily available online, and you cannot get a-hold of the author for a response on re-uploading permissions, and they've made no mention of uploading permissions in their file description or readme, then you don't have permission. So if the mod is on PES, and you want to upload it to the Nexus but the author won't respond to your permission requests then that's a no to uploading it to the Nexus.

If however PES were to go down, and the author hasn't provided any information on permissions, and the author cannot be contacted, then I see no reason why it cannot be re-uploaded to the Nexus, or another site, provided the uploader adds in a "Uploaded without permission, if you are the author and do not want your mod hosted here please contact me and your file will be removed immediately" clause.

Others might disagree. But that's my stance.

I happen to agree with this. If the site is going down and you cant get into contact with the author, than it should be ok to upload elsewhere provided you state it will be taken down if requested. It is one thing if the author isnt around but the site is fine, and quite another if the author isnt around and the mod is likely going to disappear forever.
I mean, if I disappeared, I would hope people thought my stuff worthy of being saved.

This.

Superkitten's post. ^^

Ryu's post about superkittens post about what tarius said^^

we should just archive up all the top 100/HoF/on popular lists mods. i mean, some mods aren't worth saving.

why not just go through all the popular lists (MAs, Mythic mods, povohulo (sp?), Knots, BTBs.) and stick them all on a big mod site. That's atleast 300-500 mods (rather than 2000).
we also need to keep "our history" such as unused yet iconic mods. A small site purely for the most used/loved mods would be perfect - gathering them from PES, Fliggerty, Nexus, EricM and fan sites.


Also, what's going to happen when this place gets closed down? Bethesda is supporting 3 TES forums + old tes forums. How much longer until Morrowind is added to the old game section with Daggerfall and Arena? (if ever)

I'd think that everyone would leave for TESAlliance, GHF, Wolflore, etc. Morrowind is still too big for them to cut it out anytime soon.

Just my opinion...

I wasnt saying it was a bad site. Just not a site i ever really got on with. It may be THE site for you, but for me, THE site has always been the nexus.

Unlearned in the way of modern sites? Are you kidding? I host my own sites and work on lots of others and your calling me unlearned??? From what I've seen you struggle to administrate a free forum.... so go figure.

As i said, i have used PES quite a bit, and it is a shame to see it going under.

I agree it is a shame. At least there will be more time than originally thought to save the mods.

Disregard the rest, It's not worth it.

I find it interesting to note that people are talking aobut creating new sites to replace PES.Morrowind is an old game, and numbers of dedicated players and modders alike have dwindled. How many defunct sites can you think of that were one doing concerns with thousands of members?

I never got around much, but I can think of a few, some of whom are still there, but with little or no traffic. Enmesharra's refuge, Canadian Ice and Houndog's place, Lady e and Proudfoot, I can't count the number of times I've tried to follow promising links and gotten a 404. then when you consider the amount of traffic even PES got in the Morrowind forums is pretty damned slow. I used to poast at PES, but it seemed like all the posts and responses were two moths old, and even if it was interesting, bringing back an old topic is frowned on.

You can say what you want, but I think thre are plenty of existing options when you think of Wolflore, TESnexus, Great House Fliggerty, TESalliance and one or two whose names I can't recall at the moment. Y'know, it's kind of like fixing a glass of Kool-Aid. Dump a package in a quart of water, and it's fine, but if you try to make 2 gallons out of it, it's too weak to mess with. With limited numbers of people interested, adding new sites is just a way of diluting the traffic each site will enjoy to zilch.

I'd much rather see four or five really active sites than twenty that nobody visits. Just my two cents worth, eh?

well... it's like... a free forum.. man.

What in the world do you mean, Wolli? My brain is pretty much shut down. S'late.

Not that I entirely disagree, but I think people are just concerned about losing mods in the case that PES does shut down, though we're being reassured now that this is not the plan. But it has been a wake-up call. It's such a go-to place that it's natural that people might think to give it a try on making a site. I don't think anyone's talking about creating yet another indie Morrowind forum.

I'm one of those modders that prefers to make her own website for her mods rather than uploading to PES, but I hope my the website increases the experience of the mod by supporting it properly. Will I end up hosting some other mods? Probably, but not a lot... if I create a recommended mod list, or if there is a mod that needs a home/ needs rescuing. Will I have forums? Only if people ask for it, which I don't anticipate. So, add one more site to the kool aid vat. We'll let the users be the judge as to whether it dilutes or flavors Morrowind as a whole.

I have no way to measure it or prove it, but I feel like we're going to have an upswing in the amount of active modders for Morrowind, especially as people realize how far the modders have improved it. Morrowind offers a huge variety of settings to use in a mod, and with the fact that it doesn't have physics automatically added to all objects, it has a lot of potential for a lot of very creative mods (hello upside-down dream sequence?). That and the fact that Morrowind isn't littered with mods with horrible voice acting, With MSGO, people are going to notice - not in droves, but in a gently increasing amount. Maybe my viewpoint is skewed because I've only been modding for 4 months, so I think others will finally start as well, but I've seen new faces pop up in here since I showed up. Just have to have a good attitude about it - each time someone pops in and asks for help choosing mods for their new install, you might have them come back six months later as a modder.

I think modding is a natural progression with Morrowind. When playing it,no matter what mods you have installed, there's always something you look at and say "Hey, wouldn't it be great if..." Modding allows to to create that "if" whatever it is.
that being said, there are a couple of things about very active sites that make sense for most modders who release mods.

The first thing is, how hard is it going to be for someone to find my mod? If I have my own pa== that's fine, but if it has little or no traffic, how does someone just browsing for something different get to it? Half of the mods I play I got from PES or the Nexus because I went there looking for something else. Browse enough pages and you'll always find something interesting.

The other thing is that heavily-trafficked sites are generally well maintained. People who try to maintain sites that get two visitors a month get bored and move on, then you start seeing the old 404...

As much as some of us hate advertising, heavy traffic sells ads if money is needed to support the project. Spammers are driving some forums off the web, and forums are where information is exchanged about new mods new modders, new tools, and the old WIP thread for ideas and input. Forums are important...

Seems like this won't be an issue anylonger. I got word that 2 guys are taking over the job that APY had at PES. I'll let you know if there's anything else

Nice. If the site won't be screwed like we thought, then I'm happy. I'm still gonna use TESAlliance as well. It's such an awesome site.

I wonder if mod approval will be slower since those two guys are gonna be the admins.

Unfortunately the issue isn't with the admins of the site, but with the lack of programming support being offered by the owners of the site, IGN, as they continue to consolidate and down-scale their fansite offerings.

For example the Neverwinter Vault site (another IGN site using the same, or at least very similar code to PES) has had issues with its password reset form for many months now. Any returning members who need to retrieve their password can no longer do so, and the issue cannot be fixed by the admin of the site (the APY figure, if you will) as it's a programming issue.

It means the sites will not be receiving any programming updates, and if something breaks, it's unlikely it'll be fixed. A risky situation.

...and of course, sooner or later, something always goes wrong.

Perhaps IGN isn't the best way to go if they offer to buy out a site...