I couldn't agree more. KotN was far from rubbish. If you (the OP) thought it was expensive, fine, but don't just lump us all together in your little world where you thought KotN was rubbish so you felt entitled to steal Shivering Isles! Honestly, I am offended. Not that it matters, but really-- rubbish? We all agreed on that, did we? I think not.

Not true. DLCs are also faster and easier (and hence more efficient) than a full-blown expansion. Something like KotN doesn't take as much effort to build, playtest, and distribute as something like SI does. Since they are smaller they also make sense from a game customization perspective - you can make a DLC tailored only to thieves, but an expansion has to have something (usually, a lot of somethings) for everyone. You can find out what is and is not successful quicker, and if something flops you don't loose as much time or money as an expansion. The smaller development team needed for a smaller DLC also allows you to move on to do more things at once.

I like big expansions. However, they are going the way of the floppy these days. Just because something is smaller doesn't mean its designed solely to take all our hard-earned cash.

I'd have to disagree with you, I actually Loved KotN, but i do wish it was drawn out more.

Yeah, its not expansion sized. That's why it is DLC. :tongue:

I do hope we get some full expansions this time around. The FO3 ones like The Pitt and Point Lookout I enjoyed a lot too. That said, even little things like KotN and Wizard's Tower are a lot better than "appearance packs" and the like you get as dlc from other companies.

I waited for the GOTY edition. The DLC itself was alright and it was fun.

But 15 dollars for a single quest line? NTY.

I liked Oblivion. That said you make an excellent point that Oblivion seemed to bring in too much outside TES style, middle-earth. Part of what I loved about Morrowind was the incredible uniqueness from the various big cities to little yurts. Skyrim seems to take much from Nordic type culture, but I hope it carries strong unique TES styles.


This is what I'm doing with ME 2 and if Skyrim does DLC I'll just wait until it all comes out and buy it when its on sale. I'm not a fan of a bunch of little DLCs.

Don't get me wrong, I don't think Bethesda is "wrong" or "evil" for wanting money. Heck, I want money,... I wouldn't say its designed 'soley' for the money, but all that stuff you mentioned, easier, faster, less risk, time, money, I'm sure is 50% or more of the reason why they chose the DLC route. Which I totally understand, but it still makes me sad to say goodbye to expansions.

Have they outright said "no expansions for Skyrim"? FO:3 still had what I would call expansion sized content additions as did OB. Beth is actually one of the few still making that kind of stuff, I agree I would hate to see it go away.

KOTN was a waste of money. I hope they don't put out FO:3 type DLC. I want expansion packs, and if they're finished them any sooner than 8-9 months then it's not a proper expansion pack.

That's just my opinion though.

They haven't said anywhere that they're going purely DLC/add-on/small Expansion/moneywaster/rubbish. (or whatever you want to call it...^^)
For all we know, they can already have an expansion planned and ready in a year after launch.

I always LOL at some of the comments and expectations from some folks in discussions like these. I tend to feel that expectations are WAY too high by some people. I mean, really... it's $10 friggin dollars people! (If that's a lot of money to you, perhaps you should be working on your job skills, not wasting your time gaming? Just a thought.)

I blow damn near $10 for a # 7 combo at the drive through at Taco Bell a couple of times a month for Christ sake. That usually lasts all of 10 minutes! I've played every DLC for Oblivion and FO3 at least 2 or 3 times each for hours and hours of entertainment and enjoyment. A movie in the theater is nearly $10 bucks and lasts what, maybe a couple of hours? Let's try to keep things in perspective shall we? To expect Shivering Isles sized content for $10 is absurd in my opinion.

Great. I expect we'll get a mix. A few smaller dlc's and hopefully similar to FO:3 with a few larger additions. :celebration:

No, they haven't chosen otherwise. Todd stated that they enjoyed doing the smaller DLCs, but it kept them at work constantly and it was really hard to do, so they think they're going to do 2 bigger expansion-like content than a lot of smaller DLC.

I think the creator of this thread has been PWNED...

if you listen to the newest podcast i think they kind of acknowledged that. of course they didnt come right out and say it, but noted how it wasnt like the shimmering isles.

with a bigger team im sure that wont happen again

I disliked KotN because it felt like it was only meant for a certain type of character to play - the "holy" kind that loves the Empire and the Nine Divines. There was no alternate path, there were no meaningful dialog choices nor branching quests. You can't really play KotN and roleplay as character that isn't "holy". It is foisted upon you. I wanted extra content, but I couldn't play it with my character (Dark Brotherhood faction, apathetic toward the Nine, etc).

KotN was not an example of role-playing freedom. Much of TESIV and its DLC houses were catered to a particular character type with no options for other character types. Could a law-abiding citizen go to the Count of Anvil and expose the piracy occurring in Dunbarrow? Collect a nice fat reward for that? What about the Vampire Layer, was there anything you could do to enjoy the extra content without being vampire-centric? For instance, maybe you could find some unhappy vampires in the IC and help them cure their vampirism. Or even if the Lair suited your tastes, there was no way to connect it to the broader world, such as linking up with the Dark Brotherhood.

Instead of being extra content for everyone, the DLC felt like mods - I would only play with this or that one if I intended to RP a particular character. What's the point of Dunbarrow and Scornhallow if I'm a holy crusader? What's the point of Frostcrag if I'm an illiterate warrior? Why bother with KotN if I'm a back-stabbing thief or a Daedra worshiper?

Horse Armor, Spell Tomes, and Mehrune's Razor were pretty neutral. The Razor did have a subtle option of turning into a vampire if you wanted to, but you could just ignore that part. It was unfortunate that everyone respawns in the underground town even if you massacre them twenty times. I would have liked more ramifications for the rest of the Cyrodiil - joining the invading armor, alerting local forces to it, revamping the place as my own, etc.

SI was the only "DLC" that I consider an expansion pack. It added new land, a lengthy (relatively) Main Quest, addition side quests, and new creatures, items, objects, terrain, etc. It had that moral ambiguity that makes it less restrictive than OB's main quest (help Martin against the "evil" daedra) and KotN (help the incumbent religion and indulge in your Teutonic fantasies).

That may be because SI is the only expansion pack for Oblivion.

And Tank mages, or people who wanted to rp healers.

I see your point, but how is the KotN faction any different in terms of role-playing freedom than the Dark Brotherhood? Honestly, I'm all for role-playing-- I do it every game! But part of role-playing is making those choices; if I'm an assassin who only "saved" Tamriel because I didn't want to upset the status quo (who knows if Daedra will continue paying me to murder people?) and joined the Dark Brotherhood because I felt right at home, I can (and did) choose to not join the KotN faction. Who needs the gods? Give me a poisoned arrow and a bow any day! By the same token, if I'm playing a holy Paladin, the KotN would make perfect sense-- but the Thieves Guild? No. The Dark Brotherhood? Absolutely not! It wouldn't fit my character at all. I can't report their location to anyone, I can't tell the guards about my meeting with Lucian, and the only way I can do any harm to them is to join them and backstab them (since, as I recall, you can't enter their Sanctuary unless you did Lucian's dirty deed)-- something a Paladin would never do. I just don't see the difference-- there is a choice there. You can choose to not join.

But perhaps I missed something (I am only human, after all!). What exactly do you see as the role-playing freedom difference between the Dark Brotherhood and the KotN?

I thought KotN was pretty horrible.

the only thing i had a problem with in fallout was to continue playing you needed a DLC... i really hope they don't do that again but other then that im fine with DLC's knights of the nine was really good SI was entertaining i liked the house ones they gave me something to do more or less but when i got rid of my Xbox i lost em.

DLC's are good but they need to be priced fairly depending on content.
Expansions are a whole other thing entirely there a major add on think of an MMO the expansion adds to game DLC's do this but to a far lesser extent

if there just DLC's though make them ether free or really cheap... expansions are the stuff to pay for

It wasn't rubbish, It was actually good if you think about it, You get a fee house, New Followers, Armour, Your own Blacksmith, Now Spell Tomes They were the only bad DLC But, then again it was only 90MS :tes:

Not sure what to make of the Original Post. I haven't gone through all 7 pages to figure it out.

But in my opinion Knights of the Nine was the best DLC released (given that Shivering Isles was not a DLC, it is an expansion).

It was an excellent and involved storyline. And best of all it has some nice puzzles in it.

Not sure what the OP didn't like about it. Maybe that's in the other posts I haven't read. But I don't think we can all agree that it was "rubbish".

Doesn't have to be GotY.



This. Kids like to argue about semantics because it makes them feel smarter. Judge a DLC by its content and price, nothing else.



I like them. Just not the ones that want to kill innocent men, women, and children.



Hahahahahaha!!!! :rofl: lmfao!!

Wait....are you serious? So much fail.

A lore purist....lolz




Ditto. People are just silly for not understanding where their money goes. Then again, most people are stupid about money in general. I'd rather pay $20 dollars for a good DLC or an expansion than spend it in tips for a couple nights out at a restaurant. Stop and think before you complain about DLC costs, people. I mean hell, horse armor kinda svcked, but the price was fair to me compared to a coffee at Starbucks, lol.

So true!