In Tamriel, what would be the equivalent of the Pope?

The Emperor.

Oh. OK, would there be like any sort of Cardinal? Or would that be the Heir to the throne?

Not really keen on that Emperor idea - because:

When the Roman Empire split about 1600 years ago the Eastern Empire retained a secular ruler, continued the Ancient Roman military traditions and other customs, becoming known as Byzantium. It was ruled by Emperors - think Emperor Constantine - Constantinople.

In the West there was no single secular ruler - the titular head of the Christian Church became known as the Pope and held no secular authority - in Rome there is a stone seat known as the Vacant Throne (Vatican anyone?) - the Pope as he became known is a purely religious figure. And you will note that the Western Empire immediately and permanenty split up into separate Kingdoms.

And the Pope cannot even claim religious control over Europe anymore ... only the Mediteranean nations.

In Tamriel each God has his own clergy and head - there may be arguments about seniority ... but.

There is one authority that might be seen as unifying in a spiritual sense - the Psyjiics and the Elder Council? But it has a different basis for its authority.

Even though there has been an Emperor who was deified - there was no One God - Talos was the 9th of 9 Gods. and his worship is currently unlawful according to the Legion Quests at Gnisis in Morrowind.

The Psijiics are their own religion, and the Elder Council a temporary body of rulers, many of which do not follow the Nine Divines.

I wouldn't go so far as to say that the emperor is the top authority, but he probably is as close to one as it gets. The emperors are deified in a sense since they are believe to descend from Alessia in a pure bloodline (which is bull... hehe, pun).

I'm not speculating.



The King of Men is the Priest of the King of the Gods. As far as a 'Divine Rights' or a 'Mandate of Heaven' goes, this is it.

If you're gonna compare a Tamrielic religion with catholicism, I'd go for the Tribunal worship. It has saints, a trinity, borrows heavily from earlier religions for validity, and it has an inquisition.
Heck, Vivec even has its own Swiss guard. Pious men from another part of the world who is tasked with the protection of the holy city. Only in the game, they have awesome outfits instead of dorky ones.
For the Pope and Cardinal comparison in that case, the tribunal doesn't need a pope as they could enforce their doctrine on their own. Things will of course change there unless it already has. Cardinals? Also not needed, but I suppose the local Patriarchs and whatnot might fill that role sufficiently.



No, I'd say that conspiring to kill the emperor under the guise of worshiping Talos is what's unlawful. If Talos worship was unlawful, the temple in Bruma would need to keep a lower profile.

Can't really do the cross over comparison.

With Morrowind the Imperial religion was painted as a lose collection of cults, not so much the Polytheistic Catholic church.

A cult that believes weak emperors should be killed in the name of Talos, there is something to say for that. Especially since Uriel was a weak, dying Emperor and it seemed Empire was about to come apart in Morrowind.

Of course nobody in Cyrodiil even noticed. <_<

There really is no comparison. Christianity was a single religion that united most of the people in Europe. Tamriel used to be distinguished by a multitude of religions, from small covens and cults to large, empire-spanning temple organizations to the Eight or Nine (depending on where you go and who you ask). Even in Cyrodil, the matter is not without controversy, as there is some disagreement among the people regarding who belongs in the place of honor: Talos or Akatosh (a commentary in the Guide to the Imperial City about the statues).

Of course, if you accept the propaganda put forth in Oblivion as the gospel truth, clearly the High Priest of Akatosh, who has the blood of Akatosh, which is the same person as the Emperor--both Pope and King rolled into one. Once again, this is not anologous to the Pope, but MUCH more anologous to Oriental Despots in general (including Emperors who took Octavian's claim of deity seriously; not all of them did).

Talos worship is not unlawful. The local group of talos worshippers was simply plotting an assassination, that's all.

As for the Op's question, I don't think any of the religions are that similar to the catholic church, though they have similar aspects, especially with the tribunal in Morrowind.

Try Henry VIII of England.

Henery decided that the Vatican was being used for political purposes to harm his interests (no doubt remembering what happened to the Cathars in the South of France when covetous neighbours who did not like the political system developing there used a crusade as an excuse for a land grab) and the Catholic Church had become too powerful financially and so swopped to the Prodestant faith. But Henery also made sure that the Clergy took religious responsibility and the King became Defenderi Fidem in matters temporal - as it is now in theory.

Again the Popes never had Armies in their pockets - they did rubber-stamped stuff - and frequently delivered Christianity (the religion of peace and forgiveness) into the control of various murderous despots who gave them lipservice and the Inquisition. The reason for that was that they were effectively severed from the political/state system and their political position was set up for Empire and devolved from that.

But please let's stop here as this is becoming too political.

It relates to lore doesn't it?

Anyway, I don't have a clue what you're on about. The 'acts of supremacy' declared Henry the only supreme head on earth of the Church in England, which makes him a valid example of head of state also being the head of a church.

If you want to get any deeper into it that's fine but there isn't much of a point as the idea of a Pope as anything other then the head of a church doesn't carry over to Tamriel. And since the OP didn't really specify it further, I assume we can take the most superficial interpretation.

In the Imperial Cult in Morrowind they have a handbook called "For my Gods and Emperor". To paraphrase, it basically states that they are to serve the emperor as much as they serve their Gods. To compare to anything in history (though TES is a made up world and there is nothing completely accurate to compare it too) I think pre-catholic "late antiquity" Rome would be more realistic. The real "Imperial Cult" was an off shoot of the somewhat official roman pagan religion, which worshipped the emperor as a demi-god and also worshipped certain dead emperors(like Julius Caesar) as men who were raised to divine status after death. The emperor tends to have a similar exalted status in the TES world, and the divine Talos is none other than Tiber Septim the first emperor being worshipped as a man who achieved godhood. Oblivion lore doesn't divert much at all from this.

In the TES empire they don't seem to have a strict seperation in their view of the secular and religious. The Septim bloodline is concidered to have been chosen by the gods, and the same imperial handbook I quoted above says the empire is "their divine work on nirn"(to paraphrase again), despite the fact that the empire traditionally values freedom of religion.

So I agree the best comparison when it comes to the empire's religion to the pope would be the Emperor, but not strictly similar. Of course if you were to compare other tamrielic cultures like the Tribunal as someone did above, you'd find different similarities in them to other various real-world cultures/religions, but none that would exactly match anything.

Arguably, since the Gods are proven to exist, there are no religions in Tamriel, only political factions.

Nevermind...nevermind.

I'd disagree. Religion encompasses the practices and myths of their followers among other things, not just faith in a deity.

Oh well - agree about faith - religion is different in Tamriel = it's actually a question of taste.

religion = res ligio = touching all things


I think the OP asked if there was a similar figure, not who was the nearest.

The Emperor was head of a State Cult - and head of the state

All the Popes laid claim to was the Empty Throne = no comparison - a country that was never genuinely a country.

The Emperors of Tamriel ruled or died - the Popes intrigued or begged.

Thats true, as there are widely different views on deities. But the existance of those beings who are deified or demonized is virtually indisputable as Harke said. But thats why I think the ancient world is a better comparison to TES. Rarely did people argue the existance of the gods in those days, but many disputed over their natures or who should be worshipped.

And as for the TES religious factions, I'd have to agree with Harke, they're more similar to political factions with specific metaphysical/cultural views than modern religions. For example, most cultures regard Aedra as gods, while some would rather worship the Daedra(chimer/dunmer). While others viewed these beings as just powerful spiritual people and saw worship as primitive(like the dwemer). and then there is the psijic order's view which does seem to condone the worship of "good" spirits, but views them more like theosophy's "ascended masters" which are of the same spiritual essence as humans but have ascended to a higher level of existance.

I guess whether the factions can be concidered religious depends on how highly they esteem these "gods", not whether it involves a spirit. After all Dagoth Ur's sixth house was very fervent in its worship, yet its members were given "divine" power and he was basically just extremely powerful ancient sorcerer. And the mythic dawn exalted Mehrunes Dagon in a blind faith worse than most religious factions, while the player can just make deals with daedra like working with a typical quest giver.

So concidering all this, to go back to the original question i'd say the only comparison to a "pope" in TES would be any human religious leader concidered to have a higher level of divine authority than other people. But that can be compared to all sorts of real world religious leaders in history, from crazy cults to ancient egypt's pharohs.

I'd say the Cardinals would be the Chancellors, who also serve as rulers if the emperor's bloodline is erased or if something happens to the emperor.

I assume you're referring to the Elder Council.

Hey OP, just out of curiosity, is there a reason you're asking about this?

Yes. I'm making a MOD that uses Cyodiil's religion. To be more specific, the religion that worships the Nine Divines.

Sounds interesting odd.bod - but there is no "religion that worships the Nine Divines". Each God/Goddess is worshipped separately ...

I realised that after reading up on something, which I could have done earlier. Sorry for wasting your time.

Hey, no apology needed. This is what we DO.