I wouldn't say massacre. Oblivion just seemed to disregard previous lore in favor of something that would add a crutch to OB weak plot. Some of the stuff that OB has given us is pretty good. If we were to go by OB's Dragonfire law, then during the Interregnum, daedra should have been walking about like it was no one's business. The only rational that can be applied is the fact that the Heart of Lorkhan was still chilling in Red Mountain, which allowed the barrier between Nirn and Oblivion to have enough strength to not need the Dragonfire's to be lit. But that seems like an escape hatch for the devs.

Was there actually any word about the dragonfires before Oblivion or was that something new that it added?

Yeah. But then it was just a ceremony that was added to the coronation of Emperor of Cyrodiil.

Once again: Oblivion's plot needed a crutch.

The Dragonfires are not the key element- the structure and its stone are.

I dunno, it didn't seem so bad from the "tower" angle. I don't want to turn this into another battlefield, I just don't understand how elections of the Alessian Emperors and the introduction of the Dragonfires were detrimental to Oblivion.

Oh Tiber, you old dog! He was such a player.

Because the loading screens were telling stupid lies without any indication that they weren't true. The MQ has plot holes galore beyond the metaphysics (which also require some digging and apologism even if you sleep with a copy of the Nu-Mantia Intercept under your pillow. If you're uesp, god helps you).

The man created an alternate dimension and you're impressed by his ability to wear an amulet?

Okay, this is the last time I am ever going to correct someone on this. I'm sick of typing it.

He wore it in that shrine near Cheydinhal.

I don't give a crap where he wore it you idiot, I'm saying that his ability to create a dimension is far more impressive than his ability to wear an amulet, no matter where he is. Surely if he has the know-how to create Paradise and contact Mehrunes Dagon, he has another trick or two up his sleeve like the ability to overcome some charm on some bracelet.

I think he knew that, he was just saying that wearing a reluctant amulet is no hardship for a guy who can create his own dimension. Though He'd still be subject to Nirn's rules, I suppose.


Blackstar, its not "some charm", nor is it just "some bracelet". Especially since it is worn on the neck.

whoa, clam down there.

What "stupid lies" were these? Do you know more about the game's world than the devs? if you think it's not right, does it make it 'a lie'? The dev's arnt in the habit of shoving random lies in there to amuse you later so you can cry about how "Oblivion butchered Lore" If they put it in there, they had a reason.

Well actually... :whisper:

Its not that we necessarily know more, its that they didn't do the best job of implementing it - not to mention that I'd bet the person that made the loading screens wasn't the same person that made up the lore... but then again chances are we just know more...

The Amulet can only be worn by a Septim. That's false. The loading screen issue is anold one and has been discussed before. The main thing is that it was a loading screen, not that it was wrong.

It was put in there to simplify an already skeletal plot for people who don't know and don't care about any of it. This should be quite obvious.

But to address your outburst specifically, I bet most of the people credited with work on Oblivion know less than you do, so kindly realize that the finished product does not necessarily represent the best or even passable work of the people who actually are in the know. Given the lack of narrative direction that pervades everything in Oblivion, you should not be surprised when something goes belly up. So I don't give anything in that game the benefit of the doubt.

Jagar Tharn was able to wear it also, when he impersonated Uriel Septim VII for 10 years. They both were aided by Mehrunes Dagon.

He didn't create it - he did what Daedra princes do. He is his own realm, and he didn't use his own power to do it - he used the power of Dagon's sphere, or perhaps even Dagon himself. That might seem extraordinary to most people in Tamriel, but to an Ayleid noble? They were always getting their magical powers from the Daedra.

And I think it may have been the Daedra that approached him, as Camoran was more useful to Mehrunes Dagon. In fact, he was necessary - Dagon needed the Mythic Dawn to open the Oblivion gates. Anyway, for a powerful wizard like Mankar Camoran to contact a Daedra? There's nothing special about that, especially when his father had an army of Daedra.



We also know that one of them was nobility, and the other was an Imperial Battlemage who was probably also nobility.

Nevermind that Jager Tharn was walking around like the Emperor in the literal sense of the word.

Closed for flaming.