I don't think it's prejudice as much as just a lack of interest among orcs. I mean, we had two Argonians chapter heads, three after Falcar left.

My original reason for asking this is that I'm planning an Orc mage as part of an Oblivion mod, and don't what someone to come up with an objection like "Traven banned the Orcs, along with the Necromancers" or something like that. So long as it's just a generality that Orc's don't do that, I'm happy with it being surprising that a mage is an Orc. Actually even a ban from Traven wouldn't block this, as it all takes place after his death.

The fact that they're not among the ranks of conjurers and necromancers was what made me wonder about a more fundamental issue, but that seems to be more a case of developers taking an easy route with the "random" races for these coming from a very short list in each case. That part makes it easier for the planned Orc mage to have an aversion to the Necromancers, as none of them are his people.

No..dude..I didn't mean in Cyrodill. I was talking about the perception by players of Morrowind and Oblivion that Orcs are stupid. I've seen it posted on both forums and in Lore numerous times, and yet we have every reason to believe there are numerous fiercely intelligent individuals in Orc society. Not the least of which is King Gortwog himself who brilliantly engineered his own Kingship.

How was it brilliant engineering? All he did in the end was offer the Agent a [random artifact] in exchange for the keys to the giant. Eadwyre made the same play, and nobody thinks he was brilliant.

Depends what kind. the little kitties that can't talk are VERY proficient with it though.

No, Hairdo. As much as my Prince Gortwog is deficit in pleasure dancers, he has denied your employ eight times now. Please, stop trying to woo your way into his bedroom. Grace through adversity, remember.

I'm not referring to his actions in Daggerfall. Although such diplomacy is far beyond the abilities of an imbecile. I'm referring to http://uesp.net/wiki/Lore:How_Orsinium_Passed_to_Orcs. You have to admit his tenacity and brilliance, plotting with old Tunner. Fatten the human up and humiliate him. Pride comes before the fall. A warrior race would realize this. That duel was well played.

The maiming, killing, fornicating king of Wayrest is the only man for Galosh.

I've got needs, man. Only a passionate and green lover will do, and Hulk was unavailable.

But anyway, yeah, stereotypes have some grounding in truth but are often wildly exaggerated. So I'm willing to concede that Trayvond's experience and opinion of Redguard culture and magic may be exaggerated too, but it appears to be somewhat accurate. We saw a few Sorcerers and Priests in TES Adventures, but Cyrus sure wasn't one of them, and neither was the average citizen of Hammerfell.

The orcs aren't noticeably dumber than say the nords, but the fiercely inteliigents ones you mention are rather rare compared to altmers or bretons. But they have a very real problem when it come to magic because their culture offers very little in the way of education.

Which means that even the smart ones will fare poorly compared to the other races whose overall culture offers far more material to refine that raw ability. Considering that less than one century before they were considered as monsters to kill on sight, even those willing to get out to get that sort education will have an harder time to get it.

With htat sort of handicaps it isn't surprising that orcs are few and far between in the Mage's guild.