Bethesda have a great animation system- and wont do anything : V - Skyrim

» Wed Mar 09, 2011 3:02 am

A developer might have a list a mile long full of great ideas that they want in the game,but sometimes you can't do that. I bet if you asked a dev after a game is made if they wish they'd of added this or that,they would say yes. It's not easy making such decisions when there is so many ideas flapping around,there has to be a cut of point,for whatever reason....it's not as simple as black or white my friend. Your trying to please millions of people all at the same time....ain't going to happen.

I think you overlooked his sarcasm.

» Wed Mar 09, 2011 4:43 am

A developer might have a list a mile long full of great ideas that they want in the game,but sometimes you can't do that. I bet if you asked a dev after a game is made if they wish they'd of added this or that,they would say yes. It's not easy making such decisions when there is so many ideas flapping around,there has to be a cut of point,for whatever reason....it's not as simple as black or white my friend. Your trying to please millions of people all at the same time....ain't going to happen.

yea i know thats what i was getting at my point was those games i mentioned are only about the elements that the op wants included and they have a much longer development cycle than the "it should only take a week with compotent developers" that the op suggests.

sry i thought my post was dripping with enough sarcasm that i didnt need a disclaimer

» Wed Mar 09, 2011 2:36 am

yea i know thats what i was getting at my point was those games i mentioned are only about the elements that the op wants included and they have a much longer development cycle than the "it should only take a week with compotent developers" that the op suggests.

sry i thought my post was dripping with enough sarcasm that i didnt need a disclaimer

Sorry,i didn't see the sarcasm

i meant no offence. Just defending "what i believe" are great developers. :thumbsup:

» Wed Mar 09, 2011 10:43 am

Sorry,i didn't see the sarcasm

i meant no offence. Just defending "what i believe" are great developers. :thumbsup:

ohh none taken i absolutly agree. i have the utmost respect for developers and the seemingly rushed cycles and duedates that they have to deal with its a very odd occasion that a team even has the amount of time that a company like bethesda has and its pretty much unheard of to get the leeway that id software has and still they cant possibly squeeze in everything that either they or i want.

» Wed Mar 09, 2011 1:30 am

I for one can't imagine why anyone wouldn't want to be able to climb, I mean, cmon, just look at those skyrim mountains, I've been itching to climg them since the first screenshots were released (I do rock climbing and mountain climbing in real life too). One of the main reasons I play oblivion on the PC is for mods like the thieves arsenal, which allows climbing via rope arrows, being able to climb is a must for me.

» Wed Mar 09, 2011 5:40 am

I for one can't imagine why anyone wouldn't want to be able to climb, I mean, cmon, just look at those skyrim mountains, I've been itching to climg them since the first screenshots were released (I do rock climbing and mountain climbing in real life too). One of the main reasons I play oblivion on the PC is for mods like the thieves arsenal, which allows climbing via rope arrows, being able to climb is a must for me.

Why would you climb them? For the sake of climbing them? Imagine the climbing in MW2, (which wasn't even fun really, it was more like a cutscene where you spam the triggers) except you are doing it up mountains instead of small cliffs. It just seems boring to me.

» Wed Mar 09, 2011 12:15 pm

Should be easy
Should be easy
Should be easy

I see this phrase repeated in your post and it's not accurate at all.

Do you even know what animation work involves? Are you an animator?

Yeah, the phrase 'should be easy' is used way to leisurely here. The stuff that is mentioned here, animations and the like would probably take the best part of a month at best, and that's with solid work put in. I've done basic computer character animation, with a team of about five. And that took forever to do. Climbing, finding footholds. Assassins creed does that, and their system took the best part of four years to create and get spot on. I don't think climbing would be viable in the time left to create the game. I mean, sure, Bethesda may pull a few surprises, as they have been working on this for a very very long time, but even so. What has been confirmed, is all things that have been done in that time. Anything more, that is of great substance, would probably take them off their release schedule, and I don't think they're prepared to do so. They've set 11.11.11 to date now, and anything like another three months of kicking, climbing, and more animations would be too detrimental to their time.

» Wed Mar 09, 2011 2:02 am

I can think of two ways to do climbing:
Procedural: you have a script that anolyses a surface for possible handholds, generates a suitable animation for the climbing (in 3:d and 1:st person) and recognizes when you want to climb the surface. Problem is that it would probably tax a system too heavily, look bad due to clipping or weird animations and act weird in general. Not to mention being ridiculously complex to program in the first place.
Hand crafted: you go into the world and prep the walls and ledges with suitable triggers for climbing and you pre-build the necessary animations. Problem is it would be ridiculously time and resource consuming.

» Tue Mar 08, 2011 9:22 pm

This thread seems to have been made with an insight to the future. The game isn't out for a while, and only snippets have been seen. Has it been confirmed that all that has been mentioned here, wont be appearing in the game? I don't get it.

Also, personally, while i don't think i'd ever spend my time climbing a mountain as i think It would be time consuming, boring and slow. An emergency grip system in the event of falling off a ledge could be nice.

» Wed Mar 09, 2011 12:19 pm

if bethesda have a good animation system- then why cant they do some more stuff with the game?

it should be easy to make kicks, and to check what would be the best punch/kick to use. i personaly think there should be a kick key, holding it down would effect the power and moving a direction would determine what type of kick

it should be easy to make a nice counter attack system - a single week week would be more than enough for this simple thing
1: dodge or block an attack
2: grab, trap or move the attacking limb
3: let the player decide what to do; kick,throw,attack with weapon, attack with magic, use as a human shield, talk etc

it should be easy to animate some climbing! again, single week would be all it takes to nail a few decent climbing mechanics!
-- grabing the ledge or outcrop you are looking at with the appropriate arm
-- knowing which arm to grab with and what arm should let go when you need to get to the third hold
-- knowing what to do with the rest of the body (what are the legs doing,are you leaning, are you trying to get your body around something)
-- damaging stamina, and damaging stamina when you have more weight on you.
-- experiment with the use of smaller weapons and magic whilst climbing
-- make some nice controls- grabbing holds might be point and click, but arrowkeys might make the player lean different ways or control the legs.
-- whilst npcs dont need an advanced climbing ai- they should at least be able to climb simple things and know what to do when you climb

it would also be great if swimming and flying animations where decent...

EDIT: by easy, i mean for a team of paid for professionals who spend their time wasting away at making this odd game about people yelling at dragons

Kicking could be nice, as an ability, just a frontal kick to stagger opponent.

BUT!!!!

The problem is that things like that tends to be abused and spammed and hence destroying combat as a whole.
I know it's a choice you'd make yourself in your SP game, but this is the reason I think why kicks like that are left out in games.

» Wed Mar 09, 2011 2:39 am

I for one can't imagine why anyone wouldn't want to be able to climb, I mean, cmon, just look at those skyrim mountains, I've been itching to climg them since the first screenshots were released (I do rock climbing and mountain climbing in real life too). One of the main reasons I play oblivion on the PC is for mods like the thieves arsenal, which allows climbing via rope arrows, being able to climb is a must for me.

I'd like climbing in the game.

What I wouldn't like is a half-assed, stupid looking, buggy climbing system we would get if Bethesda would just add it in, just because "it should be easy".