Skyrim looks amazing and Attributes weren't that important anyways. I mean Wizards raised Int and Wis, Melee raised Str and End, and Thieves raised Agi and Speed. All classes can use luck and personality is mainly for questing but there was always an alternative. They just took out what was not needed and simplified it into "Raise HP", "Raise Magika", and "Raise Stamina". I assume they raise the amount you can carry via levelling up so every 5-10 levels they give you 10 Wg more.

I think I found a video of you:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j_ekugPKqFw

this

RP and LARP are different things.

We don't know anything about encumbrance yet, encumbrance might be affected by choosing strength for all we know. And how do you know that your health/damage/speed doesn't grow with your strength, what else would choosing strength do?

the 8 attributes that have been taken out are all still in the game in forms of perks and skills, so you are saying just because they are not labeled as an attribute that they ruined?

This was abstracted via the attribute raise bonus. The system was poorly designed either way. I say that in the OP. But the solution is to fix it, not remove it.




If you are strong enough to send someone flying with a hammer, you are strong enough to send someone flying with an axe. If you do twice the damage with a high two-handed skill level, you should do lots of damage with a 1 handed weapon. Because your actual strength grows. Perks will, at best, represent a portion of your strength that grows independent of the others. That's why attributes are useful: they keep track of one thing that, with good design, should influence a number of other things. That so many attributes in TES games only influenced one other thing is a sign of bad design.



I guess it's pointless to point out that skill with a weapon does not necessarily imply strength. Weapons are usually dangerous enough regardless of your strength, as long as you can wield them effectively. A master swordsman will usually kill an unarmed UFC champion because it takes very little effort to stick a sword in someone.

Boom headshot!

Erm...yes, this. I agree with this. Though, using the term real rper will throw things into a whole debate about what an rpg is, and how its different things to different people and you're opinion on what it is isn't better than mine....

At any rate, I'm on the side that thinks all numbers should go under the hood, and the game should just throw you out there. If you feel like you're getting better as you use something, that's good enough for me. Now if only I could find something that is better than the barter and inventory menus to use instead...

OH WOE IS US!!!! I DON'T BELIEVE WATER SHALL EVER QUENCH THIRST, OR BREAD CURE MY HUNGER AGAIN!!!!

WE HAVE BEEN FORSAKEN!

They are the same thing to people who say stuff like "Because a real RPer doesnt need to deal with a menu." Your attributes are not represented in the actual world, you just pretend you have them. Like a LARPer.

You can't fit running speed (without athletics), jumping height (without acrobatics), overall strength, your ability to carry more items and your overall physical strength with skills or health, fatigue or magicka. If they've done it that way it won't make sense.

Rather than clean up this thread, I am locking it. There is already a thread where the attribute stuff is being roiled about. Because, you know... it's the internets. It's what we do, make a lot of noise over every random piece of game info before release.