I like that they're trying something new with the spell system but you can't deny that without spell creation there's alot less variation thats possible.
With the new leveling system they were shooting for more variety and unique characters being possible so I'd like them to do the same with the magic system and do everything they can to include spellmaking.

Sorry, I actually meant as a whole, not in the spell creation aspect. I'd still like that to be in. So edit it is lol.

Nothing equals character variaty like spell creation.

Ever tortur-, er I mean questioned an Argonian witch-heretic as a Imperial Inquisitor with interrogation magic?

Ever curse an Imperial Inquisitor that stumbled into your mystical lair as an Argonian witch doctor?

Ever telepathically svcked the blood from a handmaiden as a Vampire playboy?

I doubt these things would be possible in a Vanilla Skyrim without spell creation.

Considering that Todd himself seems to have said that spell making is not in, I feel I can safely say that the writer of this preview is mistaken, soul gems are likely used for creating and recharging enchantments, and only that, just as they've always been, my guess is Todd Howard said that and the writer misinterpreted it to mean that soul gems can be used for spell making. Spell making is not in, let's face that, and either accept it, or don't, personally, I'm quite willing to accept that, spell making was never a vital part of what makes the Elder Scrolls what it was to me, I don't really consider it to be a big loss. It's not like Bethesda is removing character creation or abandoning the open world here.



I have to agree, I fully expect to enjoy Skyrim, just as I did Morrowind, and Oblivion, and Daggerfall for that matter, sure, a lot has changed, but that's just fine with me, I LIKE change, it helps to ensure that I don't keep playing the exact same game again, and again, and again, and again, and again, and... you get the idea. Sure, sometimes changes can cause a series to move in a direction that I feel is a bad one, and I'd say there are some changes we've heard about in Skyrim that are not ones I'd approve of, and then there are some changes I'm not ready to judge just yet, like the removal of attributes, but as a whole, the good seems to outweigh the bad to me.

I kind of thought the same way before because I rarely used magic and never even used spell creation once but it WAS a huge part for ALOT of people. It made for alot more possibilities that just arent possible without it. This is one move by Bethesda I don't agree with.(if they don't include it that is)

Its funny that this is brought up since spell creation, enchanting and a extensive alchemy system is what made TES so special. Other games have ha one or another, but they were never as deep and fleshed out as TES. Its been in since Daggerfall and arguably Arena, but not in the same capacity. Not to mention Arena was supposed to be a two person fighting game.

Not directly quoting you Broski, just didnt feel like cut/pasting.

Ugh, I skipped page 5 and 6.

Btw, Xarnac, you really should stop arguing with these people about spellmaking. It seems like your life's work, lol. Just sayin, they won't listen, or they'll just agree and nod their heads. Have you ever actually convinced someone spellmaking should be in? Because I've read almost all these threads with dozens of your posts, and no one really changes.

Anyway, OT about the quote: To be honest, I never cared about the spellmaking system or enchanting system. I think they worked fine, but they didn't bother me. As for what Todd said, I get it. But I don't really think it's a big deal. I do wanna say though, back when I posted about Oblivion after its release, I DID say the attributes were unnecessary and annoying, as well as pointing out the obvious stupidity of Acrobatics and Athletics as "specialized skills". I wasted so much of my time jumping around in OB for that, and I was always pissed that Athletics took a freakin decade to level up to max. Those couple of issues were obvious and I think most people would notice them. The magic stuff....not so much. If you used it, you liked it, if not, you probably didn't care. For me, the only problem I had with it was the cheap level grinding 1 point spells. But that issue is a problem with how magic skills level, not with the spellmaking. Because if the magic system leveled based on "practical" use of spells instead of just "number of spells cast", then no one would care to make a 1 point spell, because it would have no purpose.

I think spellmaking would be fine as long as it doesn't induce any level grinding exploits or other BS. Xarnac, if you want to make a spell that lights an enemy on fire, sends him into a frenzy, and boosts his health, just so you can watch him run around beating his allies and catching them on fire while he screams from the slow torture you've induced followed by them all burning and dying, with the target slowly burning to a crisp until he's the last one left and you just walk up to him and impale him on your sword to show mercy - Be my guest.

That type of creativity is great. It should still be tempered with realistic in-game limits on power and effects, of course, but aside from that, it should go all out. I mean, why not? B)

Devs come on the site all the time. I'll do all I can to keep it in. Am I combative and argumentative? If so I apologize, Im just for, not against.


I really implore everyone that didnt use it, to boot up any TES from Daggerfall up and try it out. Go all out. Go mega nerd on it, until your face implodes. Its fun, its interesting and almost limitless. And if you have a way to play TES I'll try it out too. I'm always up for a new way to play TES, sans mods since Im a console gamer.

No, you're not too argumentative, but anyone here can tell it's your "hot button issue". You've made more posts about spellmaking than anything else on the Skyrim forum, I'd wager.

And yeah, the devs come here, but even I don't think they really bother with most of the topics nowadays. Maybe back when Todd could actually read everything there would be some real change, but now....I doubt it. I'm sure we still have a very small impact by bringing up issues and debating them thousands of times, but I wouldn't bet on Bethesda looking here and deciding anything as large as spellmaking based on the opinions of 50 or so loyal fans/forum members. They also have millions of other people that WILL pay them for Skyrim no matter what, and they're counting on THAT factor to pay for the project, and only after that do I see their concern for stimulating more sales and interest in the game coming into play by ensuring the fans are getting what they want and noticing what is right and wrong. To me it's kind of lame that SP game makers don't really have Betas for their games, because that's how the best multiplayer and MMO games of our day ensure they're getting the fans the best game. And that it actually works online, of course.

You know, I actually think it could be a great idea for Bethesda to produce some kind of standardized demo/beta for the next TES that allows fans to play about 6 months before release, and have it downloaded from online with hooks in it to watch what happens, as well as using this forum for actually compiling fan suggestions and improvements for the game. All that would be necessary would be a simple demo akin to what they showed in Utah, but specifically designed to let users test everything from character creation to combat, to stealth, to magic, to enchanting, to woodcutting, to spellmaking, etc.

Then this forum would be at it's utmost usage and would actually be performing a great service to the game and the industry itself. Just an idea, but I wouldn't be surprised to see it come into play for all major games in the future with enough resources and advertising.

EDIT: I'm on console as well, and I always look to have the best game possible and not worry about all the modding business. As for spellmaking, idk if I'll go back to the old games again, but maybe. I'm actually just kinda looking forward to playing a true mage character in Skyrim. My first true mage on OB svcked and then he got overwritten. I was sad. And he was the best looking character too....even with OB's character models he looked awesome.

You basically say it in the latter part of your post. Instead of Profit, Profit, Profit, you go Depth, Depth, Depth, but optional depth. You focus on that and you wont need fancy ways to fleece, or overt panhandling to an unreceptive demographic (Beth hasn't really gone this far...yet). You do that and you make a big profit no matter what. Beth RPGS are the biggest RPGs period, except for the rudimentary graphics games that can be made (nothing wrong with them either).

In whole Im less argumentative and more just trying to get some dialogue going with people.

Makes sense to be part of enchanting, be able to create your own spells. I sure hope we can..