So my mage should miss out on great loot because he is not a stealth character specializing in security? That is absolute crap!

Rather than axing abilities and such there are other ways around "fixing" certain aspects

AI intelligence (especially that of enemies) should be enhanced. If an enemy gets attacked by you the player while invisible, then they should react to it rather than sitting there and saying "I think it was my imagination that stabbed me in the back just now"

Let's take for example Fallout 3 where I could blast some guys head off and his buddy sitting across the table doesn't flinch or even notice. Should we take out sneak attacks then? No we should do something more sensible like fixing the AI.

Invisibility is not balanced they do need to make some changes to it. Although I don't want them to completely remove invisibility just make it more balanced like you can still be heard by other NPC's when moving just they can't see you and the AI should react accordingly.

put cool down on it

problem solved

this way u use it when u really need it.

Invisibility and chameleon are both fun spells, but were a bit over the top in oblivion, IMO.

I think the should have very high mana cost and should be highly specialized skills requiring a good amount of skill in both illusion and sneak.

I think the abilities should also slow down your movement speed.

Well how about rework instead of axing invisibility and chameleon?
Invisibility
Novice
Become invisible while motionless, movement will break invisibility, cannot recast spell if detected.
Apprentice
Able to move invisibly while crouched, interacting with the environment or bumping anyone breaks invisibility, cannot recast spell if detected.
Journeyman
Able to perform stealth kills and critical strikes while invisible, bumping anyone or interacting with the environment breaks invisibility. Inflicts sneak attack damage on strike that breaks invisibility, cannot recast spell if detected.
Expert
Able to interact with the environment while invisible, interacting don't breaks invisibility until not seen by actor, cannot recast spell if detected.
Master
Able to hide sight of enemy but enemy will aware of presence of character around and will search.

For first Invisibility is not stealth since Light has no effect o it so invisibility can be used even in areas full of light,
for second actors thats aware of player presence can search for player and if bump into him effectively breaking his invisible state, or by force player (by saying something like "catch you... you cant hide forever') to make stupid things thats will break his invisibility like attack or open doors (interact with objects), for second creatures can fill presence of invisible actor because of their beast mind thats hard to affect with certain illusion spells and their animal senses, enemy mages actually can cast detect life spell and if their level + skill level+ magnitude of spell will be greater then player character level + skill level + magnitude of spell then player will be detected in invisible state, thats can be difference between invisibility and chameleon, under chameleon character will be always detected by detect life spell.
Chameleon will work as not additional spell but as middle-high level perk thats add chameleon spell effect to base invisibility spell and can has requirements in some sneak skill perks or levels.
Chameleon must be caped, 100% chameleon must not be achievable in game only with CS, 50-75% chameleon will be best cap, for second actors must use detect life spell thats will always found character under chameleon, chameleon can work as support spell for sneak skill not as replace of it, so it can lower light penalty for sneaking characters, as well as be overridden by direct light spell since actors can still hear movement of character thats will increase detection,

There can be different additional spell effects thats can be added as addons to invisibility via perks like
Demoralize Aura: hide real character vision and make him looks fearsome for enemies effectively demoralizing them and make them flee, don't work on certain actors.
Charming Aura: real character vision and make him looks charming to actors don't work in combat, but affect actors in certain radius around caster.

I always found it useless!
Interact with anything and it goes away! Perhaps I just didn't give it a chance?

I think only powerful mages should get access to this spell. Make it hard to get then it is a well deserved spell.
It shouldn't be easily available to all characters unless in scroll form.

Good idea

I don't see how invisibility breaks immersion. Maybe eliminates a challenge, but if you are a mage who studies Illusion and learns to turn yourself invisible it seems in keeping with immersion to be able to get around an enemy without them seeing you. And I do think it needs to be balanced out with sound/smell or monsters seeking you out. And I would also be fine if it worked like MW where you can't using it if someone is looking at you.

I also would be fine if, dependent on your level or skill with invisibility, some monsters would have an advantage/disadvantage in spotting you. If you are a high level mage (with high level illusion) I could see low level monsters being unable to see/hear/smell you. But equal level monsters might not be fooled as easily and might hear/smell you. Higher level monsters than you might be able to more easily hear/smell you or detect your general whereabouts and be more likely to pinpoint your location to attack (especially if you attacked first)

This means we can have an obfuscate branch of perks for Illusion skill which at some levels of illusion, could add those effects for the invisibility/chameleon spell.

Neat idea.

Invisibility is my favorite spell, it allows me to role-play my non-violent Magi. Being able to walk away from fights is beyond my favorite part of Illusion. If invisibility, was gone, I'd... I'd... Won't buy Skyrim...

But thankfully I'm sure they'll keep invisibility. Then again I'd thought they'd keep spears in Oblivion... :sadvaultboy:

i like the suggestion along the lines of how obfuscate worked in vampire bloodlines. only at the highest level were you able to move around freely and interact with the envirionment. i also agree with a cooldown.

In addition to some tweaking of the artificial intelligence, I think a good solution is removing invisibility and altering chameleon so that it exposes you to some degree every time you take an action, attack, or maybe even move (much like active camouflage in Halo, but less severely affected). And also make 99% chameleon the max.

Lol. Yes, Gandalf probably would blow the door off. But there are many instances of him using shutting and opening spells. He even speaks of knowing many. Indeed it is while performing a shutting spell on a door in Moria that he first encounters The Balrog. The Demon percieved the shutting spell and cast a counter spell which began to force the door open. The conflicting magics proved too great a strain, and ultimately destroyed both the door and part of the chamber.

But I digress.

It isn't a stupid game mechanic, any more than lock picking is a stupid mechanic, or the ability to break open doors (if offered) for players with very high strength would be a stupid mechanic. As has been said, it addresses different playing styles. I am inclined to think that you are a master thief, and you don't like the notion of other character types taking an easy path to things you accomplish through hard earned skills. . .. but their abilities come through well earned skills as well. A different set of skills than that of the thief, but skills all the same. Yes, a thief would likely pick a lock and sneak into a room better than a scholastic mage or a barbarian. That makes sense. It also makes sense that a skilled wizard would be able to do things that few thieves or warriors would be able to. Things like dissapear and charm locks open.

By definition, a wizard has Supernatural powers. . . .powers that are outside of the normal range of abilities. And so they are able to do atypical things. While these may include casting bolts of lightning and storms of fire, they are not necessarily limited to these things. Nor should they be.

Like in Halo: Reach if I was to guess. Standing still, youre completely invisible. Walking slowly makes you only a faint shadow and running only slightly dims your true appearance while attacking has the same affect as running. and rather than constatly drain magic, I think it should just not recharge while invisible and only diminish when the "plane" is broken. Idk, kinda like how a car works. "idling" or standing there doesnt cost anything but when you start to run and put strain on the spells hidden veil, then magic drains depending on how fast you move

200+ posts, time to close this.