Well, surelly you will be able to become a vampire, so the 'night person' perk is somehow granted.

Yes, the only thing I hated about night vision perks/magic was that it turned the environment blue. I'd rather they'd have magic cause the iris to open or close to let more light in. In fact, if you're a Khajiit I'd rather you didn't need magic at all personally. It would make more sense to me.

^^^Anything that is easily explained by the biology of the race should be like that I think, like water breathing for Argonians for example, just to take it a step further.

Yeah well i think they should take it a "leap" further as oblivion in that regard was a step behind, I mean it was on a next gen console, we needed next gen ideas,
everyone can cast a spell of water breathing or night vision but what do the races get for having these abilities natually? just a reduced magic cost of the spell? Thats not how thoughs kinds of things should work.
Even adrenaline rush for the red guard in my mind should of been something less like a spell and more like your bodies reaction to being close to death and in the middle of a battle.
Spells are just that, "spells" just about every spell can be learned by every race(except daedric spells), so shouldn't the up's of being a certain races have nothing to do with casting a spell?

Exactly. I wonder if this is a common opinion?

I've always thought that khajiit should just be able to see in the dark when night fall sets in, you shouldn't have to cast a spell to make it happen, im glad im not alone in this regard. And also you should be able to change the night vision intensity some how, sometimes you don't need it all that bright.

Yeah well i think they should take it a "leap" further as oblivion in that regard was a step behind, I mean it was on a next gen console, we needed next gen ideas,
everyone can cast a spell of water breathing or night vision but what do the races get for having these abilities natually? just a reduced magic cost of the spell? Thats not how thoughs kinds of things should work.
Even adrenaline rush for the red guard in my mind should of been something less like a spell and more like your bodies reaction to being close to death and in the middle of a battle.
Spells are just that, "spells" just about every spell can be learned by every race(except daedric spells), so shouldn't the up's of being a certain races have nothing to do with casting a spell?

Yeah well i think they should take it a "leap" further as oblivion in that regard was a step behind, I mean it was on a next gen console, we needed next gen ideas,
everyone can cast a spell of water breathing or night vision but what do the races get for having these abilities natually? just a reduced magic cost of the spell? Thats not how thoughs kinds of things should work.
Even adrenaline rush for the red guard in my mind should of been something less like a spell and more like your bodies reaction to being close to death and in the middle of a battle.
Spells are just that, "spells" just about every spell can be learned by every race(except daedric spells), so shouldn't the up's of being a certain races have nothing to do with casting a spell?

Interesting, is that how Oblivion handled it? I believe Morrowind Argonians had water breathing as a constant effect ability (though don't quote me, as I never played an Argonian).

While Argonians appear reptilian in nature at first glance, they also exhibit fish- and amphibian-like qualities, such as being able to breathe underwater, having small gills behind their ears, and swim using the same body mechanism as that of a tadpole or eel, waving its tail side-to-side to propel itself through the water.

uhh... all the perks will be skill based but the elder scrolsl games have long had unnamed perks or perks that are named but not called perks. like argonians water breathing. and race specific spells. things u earn by becoming the madgod etc u get the point. unfortunately that perk is not going to be in the game at least not how u want it. maybe if ur a vampire it will come with advantages at night.

Yeah well i think they should take it a "leap" further as oblivion in that regard was a step behind, I mean it was on a next gen console, we needed next gen ideas,
everyone can cast a spell of water breathing or night vision but what do the races get for having these abilities natually? just a reduced magic cost of the spell? Thats not how thoughs kinds of things should work.
Even adrenaline rush for the red guard in my mind should of been something less like a spell and more like your bodies reaction to being close to death and in the middle of a battle.
Spells are just that, "spells" just about every spell can be learned by every race(except daedric spells), so shouldn't the up's of being a certain races have nothing to do with casting a spell?

Well having a traits system will really help with this. Many natural and acquired abilities can be done with traits while perks are dependent on skills only. So with scripted traits we can create an adrenaline rush trait that starts working if certain conditions are met like receiving large health damage, have increased stamina usage, be in combat and so on as well as at certain levels of a trait that can level for a race or a character with character level. Or it can be chosen already on higher level as a class specialization trait. So for example a Redguard mage and a Redguard warrior will have different starting traits even though both are Redguards, but a redguard mage would start with adrenaline rush as an uncontrollable automatic ability that starts automatically if a redguard mage is in danger, while a redguard warrior will have such traits from the beginning with the ability to toggle it at will due to his combat training, not only automatically, but also he can have increased effect from such a trait. But when a mage becomes older (more experienced as a character and/or has some level increase in warrior skills) he will develop such a trait at a basic level of a warrior.

In such cases many traits can be done. for example Khajiits can have damage reduction from falling from the start as their racial feline trait. Skilled acrobats will also have such a trait if leveled enough in acrobatics. Khajiits can have starting traits that use Night Eye spell effect, but not as a spell. Other characters can also start with such traits to model unusual changes in the character's physiology from birth. Mystical or alchemical influences are not needed to create strict full backgrounds, but having traits chosen from the beginning can really help roleplay different characters even if we all start as jack of all trades and master of none.

Zaarin, on 22 May 2011 - 07:45 PM, said:
Interesting, is that how Oblivion handled it? I believe Morrowind Argonians had water breathing as a constant effect ability (though don't quote me, as I never played an Argonian).

Well

"While Argonians appear reptilian in nature at first glance, they also exhibit fish- and amphibian-like qualities, such as being able to breathe underwater, having small gills behind their ears, and swim using the same body mechanism as that of a tadpole or eel, waving its tail side-to-side to propel itself through the water."

But Water Breathing was limited to 120sec for very low cost. that was changed in Oblivion where they receive constant Water Breathing as a trait as well as in numerous mods for morrowind. Unlike Oblivion, in modded Morrowind argonians also receive a swift swim spell effect as traits. such a spell effect was removed from Oblivion. The alteration feature has only one way to be modeled via script effect which checks for swimming conditions and alters speed attribute accordingly. I wonder if we can change the movement mechanic for Argonians in Skyrim.