Quite simple, actually. I'm assuming there's going to be the usual MMO shortcut bar. Have one skill called "Shoot". Click your target, then hit that button to begin firing. Your character will now engage the target, firing when able. (Work that bolt, throw in another clip, slide in another ammo drum, load a rocket, ect) Ammunition types and other skill related things go on the hotbar. (Stimpack, food, et cetera)

On the right side of your keyboard is a keypad. This is the VATs targeting system. Key 8 for head targeting. Key 5 for torso. 4 and 6 for arm targeting (disarm enemy if limb becomes crippled), 1 and 3 for legs (quit running away!), and lastly 7 and 9 for right-hand and left-hand held items respectively (pistols, hammers, grenades, et cetera). Targeting a specific body part or held item against a target in VATs will reduce firing speed by an acceptable percentage (20% maybe?). That way there's a tradeoff between straight DPS and disarming and crippling your enemy.

In this method we can avoid the FPS system (and dodge the aimbot problem altogether) while greatly boosting the tempo of combat within the game. With this method, a good player can choose a target, open fire, aim at a specific location on that target, and switch ammunition types as needed without having to spend an inordinate amount of time doing so.

Suggestions, questions, comments, threats?

DIE DIE DIE DIE DIE~~!!!!

Just kidding dude, great idea, but i think going from 1 to 9 would be easier, 1=head 9=legs So people don't get too mixed up. Im kinda an FPS gamer myself, as third person games are mostly the japanese RPGs, few come out that are shooters, personally, i hope this game lets you switch to 1st person, or 3rd, but either one is fine. Oh, and i forgot 2nd person! Ooohh Shiiinnnnyyyy

Funny seeing you here Whackjob , whats up?

Anyways, on topic:
Sounds like a pretty good idea, but keep in mind VATs is a creation for the bastardized FOs to adapt the targeted shot system from FO1+2 into a non-turn based combat system. gamesas will need to address that, and your idea is a pretty good one. However, the one flaw i see is that it would be fairly difficult to move, look around using the mouse, and target specific areas at the same time. You'd almost need 3 hands to do so.

Another option would be to make it so that targeted shots are learned abilities based on your skill with specific types of weapons and the weapons themselves (in FO1+2 you couldn't do targeted shots with burst fire weapons). This could give them a cooldown to keep people from just targeting the eyes (yes, in FO1+2 you could target the eyes) and blind someone as well as getting massive criticals. To keep it from becoming just another WoW clone, instead of selecting a target it could be done with a FPS style system but with a chance to hit based on your weapon skill, not your actual aim. That would run the risk of making combat look bleh though, with bullets appearing to hit your target while they actually don't because of your skill.

So... you want to look through your enemies eyes while you're killing them? What if you're not near anyone, how will you see your character? 2nd Person perspective is seeing yourself from another's viewpoint. And I've also played plenty of non-Japanese, 3ps games, but they're usually, lock-strafe/over-the-shoulder shooters, which is actually fine by me. I put the 'Skill' in 'Kill.'
Wait, what?

So... you want to look through your enemies eyes while you're killing them? What if you're not near anyone, how will you see your character? 2nd Person perspective is seeing yourself from another's viewpoint. And I've also played plenty of non-Japanese, 3ps games, but they're usually, lock-strafe/over-the-shoulder shooters, which is actually fine by me.

I was joking but i didn't know it was from the enemies perspective...

Since no game (not that I know of) is 2nd person shooter, there isn't really a good definition for whose eyes you will be looking out of . Could be the enemy, could be allies as well I guess, most likely someone who is close, and it would have to be fixed on them.

My take on making a 2nd person shooter game is that you have a protagonist (this is from where you see) that keep chasing you constantly (so you don't disappear out of sight) and you try and avoid him/kill him it's a hard concept >_>

if anyone else got a better explanation I'm all ears ^^

Since no game (not that I know of) is 2nd person shooter, there isn't really a good definition for whose eyes you will be looking out of . Could be the enemy, could be allies as well I guess, most likely someone who is close, and it would have to be fixed on them.

My take on making a 2nd person shooter game is that you have a protagonist (this is from where you see) that keep chasing you constantly (so you don't disappear out of sight) and you try and avoid him/kill him it's a hard concept >_>

if anyone else got a better explanation I'm all ears ^^


That would be an intresting game, wonder why no one tried makin' one? Would be good for crime games.

Think it would be very hard to make a long-lasting game that way

should try avoid forcing the numpad, but the idea is great.

maybe if you focus a certan bodypart.
1 = head
2 = torso
3 = arms
4 = feet

No need to target right or left arms or legs, the effect would be the same. Keep it as simple as possible.

say you focus the head, now every shooting skill you use is targeted on the head until you refocus to another bodypart.

Why do we need these things like "Auto Shot", "Fire Shot", "Awesome Shot" or "Super-explosive-terrifying-nuclear-shot"? Why we just can't use the usual FPS aiming system, with aiming from shoulder, but with strong influence from skills?
For example:
You shoot a pistol and its accuracy depends on small guns skill+pistol default accuracy.
Chance to disarm your target - skill+luck
Critical hit - skill + weapon specifications + luck.
Sniper rifle - best critical shot.
Assault Rifle - best rapid damage
Pistol - good critical at close distance.
And of course weapon durability will affect on default weapon accuracy and its critical hit.
- Yeah, yeah. Sorry for my english...

I agree that an FPS/TPS type combat system is probably the best, but there can be a lot of factors involved that a lot of players don't like.

Oh, and durability/condition shouldn't effect accuracy or damage much, if at all, but it should increase (sometimes greatly so) the chances of your weapon jaming, backfiring, ect.

Yea
That the skills from the player should be the main factor in battle is no doubt about.
I also Like that you can be that guy with a lot of luck too. "Don't know what it is with him, he must be blessed from above"

What is really important, is that the combat system is balanced in some other way. Jumping and running and strafing in combat should make your character exhausted, which leads to side effects. Like the fact that you really have to think before you act. The Quake, CS, Unreal, etc skills is good to have, but shouldn't take you to the top. Combat have to be more complex



Agreed! You have to take care of your gear and putting time on how to stuff works!
Lets say if you there could be some sub skill. How to hold a small, big, energy or a melee weapon.
More points you put in to it, less chance for failure. Like you said jaming, backfire, drop your gun from recoil, maybe even dirty in your sniper scope Also durability lasts longer!

I agree. What the OP describes sounds incredibly boring and seems to completely lack player engagement.

gamesas would be foolish to not include strong TPS elements in FOOL.

I don't even feel there necessarily needs to be abilities; the gameplay and characters would get on perfectly fine by simply sticking to S.P.E.C.I.A.L., the skill lines, and perks.

Plus you can tie any of the above to things other than leveling up like quests rewarding perks to skill points or whatnot (FO3) or implants (FONV).

While purely FPS/TPS is great for a MMO-FPS specific game, in which most of the players going in know that the competition knows how to aim and are aware that they must do so or die quickly, it doesn't really fit a more story based MMO in which a fair combat system is needed.

For that reason, I believe the generic select target then activate auto-attack and use skills as needed may be preferable in FOOL. This due to the fact that not only would the Fallout name bring in those hardcoe FPS players (they like anything with guns), but also the more laid back MMORPG players which don't necessarily have the reflexes to defend themselves in PvP environments, especially with everyone bunny-hopping to throw off your aim. That would push the outcome of a battle toward the guy who knows which skill combination is best to take down someone who ambushed them, rather than Dodgy McDodgerson's bullet-dodging ballet preformance and aimbot.

I, having played in both competitive FPS and competitive MMO tournaments, would have no problem with it going either way. I'm just trying to look at the issue from an unbiased standpoint. After all, the idea is to play to the largest audience, not some niche group.

And to those who find 8, 5 and 3 confusing compared to 1, 2 and 3. . I feel the need to demonstrate.
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I would add that you should have a higher miss-rate when aiming at the head due to the fact that it is a critical area and a small one at that.