I certainly appreciate having a tutorial explaining what controls to use to perform certain actions. While you can pretty much guess that WASD keys (on PC) are used for movement - the rest isn't necessarily obvious. However, is it really necessary to implement a starter-dungeon-on-rails for this? I thought what CD Projekt did with TW was brilliant - the tutorial is integrated into the entire game, with pop-ups that appear when you encounter a game feature for the first time, with a toggle to turn those pop-ups off, AND it has an indexed help section in the game journal in case you forget something.

You also missed me saying that if you didn't have a manual you were half-way screwed. It wasn't hard, it just took time. Many people are known to drop a game without seeing the real beauty of it from the beginning if the basics are not explained. I don't see how people think a tutorial is annoying and yet even complaining about it on a game we still don't know nothing about yet. As I said, there is going to be a tutorial in this game, but I agree with everybody else there should be an option to skip it. What many of you do understand that the differences from Morrowind and Oblivion were to simplify, educate, and also expand the game to a bigger audience while satisfying the old audience. It succeed.

I'm not saying this for myself, but on the account of why they actually put that tutorial there. Also I on that ship I am remembering there was interaction and movement before getting off.

My problem with the Oblivion tutorial was how much [censored] you got before you left the sewers. You had about 4 or 5 different weapons, nearly a whole suit of armor, a few spells even if you weren't a magic character, and a few hundred septims worth of loot. My favorite part of Morrowind was starting out with absolutely nothing and then finding money by taking the worthless stuff in crates, stealing from houses, and killing mudcrabs just to sell their meat. It felt awesome when you finally had a full set of armor and a weapon even if it was just iron.

My second problem with the Oblivon tutorial was how it immediately threw you into the main quest. Ten minutes in I'm being told that I am the last hope of Tamriel. It completely broke the open world aspect of the game. If I don't deliver the Amulet of Kings immediately and save Martin, then I feel like a complete dike and that the world is just waiting on me. If I do deliver the Amulet of Kings and save Martin, I'm thrown into this linear progression of quests that has almost no stopping point. Morrowind beat Oblivion here as well. When you got off the boat the Imperial at the Census & Excise Office told you to deliver a package to a shirtless skooma addict in Balmora. That's it. You didn't know what was in the package, there was no pressure to deliver the package, and even if you delivered the package the shirtless skooma addict told you to go do your own thing for awhile. That's what I hope Skyrim will be like, there is a brief tutorial available, but the freeform aspect of the game isn't invalidated by the tutorial.


:thumbsup:

Yes, But we need to be able to have an option to skip it if we really don't care. I've done the begining section 30 odd times now and after a while it really becomes a chore.

Even though I love stealing in TES, not many people like to steal. I was very appreciative of the stuff they gave in Oblivion, because if any adventure can remember coming out that cave and exploring, you were more prone to get your *** kicked. I remember my first death was almost by a skamp. i felt it was revenge after the abuse I put them though in Morrowind.

I didn't like all the stuff you got because you were already equipped to take out an entire dungeon at level 1. Stealing isn't the only way to make money at an early level. That actually brings me to my third point about the tutorial dungeon. Starting the game right next to the Imperial City completely ruined it for me. The Imperial City was supposed to be the grandest landmark in all of Tamriel and I'm already walking around it at the very beginning. Seeing the best city in the game first also ruined the other cities. If Leyawiin was my first city I would have thought it was awesome, but after seeing the rest of the cities Leyawiin seemed only average. In Skyrim they should start you in a small town like Seyda Neen where you have a bunch of beginners quests and beginners caves to make money off of before you explore the rest of the world. That way if you don't want to steal, you still have multiple options to gain cash early

Of course there will be. People learn in different way and many don't like to read.

Wether it will be like OB or MW? I dn't know, but there will be some sort of guided experience. Hopefully optional or one that you don't have to waste a save on.

The Tutorial could be something like a guy greeting you on the street, asking if you are new here and need help (Say yes to needing help= Tutorial and introduction of this guy, propably some barkeep, Say no to needing help= Only introduction of this guy). Easy peasy.

I can agree with that. Even though it lined up with the story, I don't think many of us expected to be right near the Imperial City. We always saw in videos and screenshots of looking at the city in a distance. I think if anything at least a small village that is a few miles away or further. Then again in Morrowind we were right by Vivic (well pretty far from it) although we are more instructed to go the opposite way if I can remember. Balmora was my home. I think it's just that some people like big cities and some like small towns, but hey, whatever they do...

yes definatly enjoyed OB and FO3 tutorials, but as many suggest a skip option would be nice after its been completed already

In Morrowind I figured things out through trial and error, it was fun.

All the stuff you do in the tutorial dungeon can be done right outside the office in Morrowind.

I practiced fighting with a mudcrab then went and practiced bartering by sellng the meat and buying a weapon and some alchemy stuff, then I practiced some alchemy and collecting ingredients.

I didn't need a tutorial dungeon to tell me what to do, I figured it out the same way but in the game instead of a fake feeling tutorial.

I think a good compromise is to have a tutorial that you choose to do. Maybe when your character is setup and you're ready to play an NPC can ask if you'd like a tour of the city and they can guide you through a few things or you can tell them to go away and just get on with the game.

Whatever they do, I'm really hoping they put that 'stepping off the boat' feeling from Morrowind back in, I really miss that feeling of being in an alien world with nothing but the shirt on my back.

IMO, the tutorial should be in a dream sequence, and you have the option to wake up at any time during it. This would allow people to mess around with gear and spells without actually packing them on every character and ruining the, "I am a nobody in the middle of nowhere with nothing but my shirt on my back and a spring in my step" type of feeling when starting an RPG.

I think Oblivion's was brilliant but yes you should be able to skip it if you want to, or at least most of it.

I was new to TES with Oblivion and I'd have been totally lost without that tutorial. Heck, I still didn't understand everything until hours into the game. When I finally tried Morrowind I was very lost at first, and I thought I was doing something wrong when I'd whack at an enemy over and over and nothing at all would happen. I didn't know it was intended that you miss 90% of the time at first.

So yes, I think there should be an extensive tutorial for people new to the series. I needed it with Oblivion and I'm sure many will need it for Skyrim. There should be an abridged version for people who want to skip it though for sure.

I don't mind having a tutorial (I might need it if any of the controls or features have changed!) but I would like the ability to skip it on subsequent playthroughs. I'm a chronic restarter and got tired of Oblivion's dungeon after a while despite loving it the first few times, I'd have loved to have been given the option to skip it (other than through mods).

Even though I preferred Morrowind's style of "Choose your basic stuff, leave, then you're done. If you need to know how to do anything else, check the manual or keybinds.", some people just need to have their hands held in a "creative" way. I kind of hope there isn't a "growing up" intro, as I really don't want to take 45 min. just to get to the very start of my adventure. At least Oblivion took like 25 min. or so.